The 5th Ammendment

cotzal · Nov 21, 2004

Dear Americans,

How come you are all so illeterate and ignorant aboput your own laws? As far as I am aware the 5th ammendment does not say "You have the right to bear weapons"....It says "You have the right to bear arms".

The "Right to bear arms" means you have the right to bear a heraldic device (i.e. a coat of arms) into the field of battle.

Why is it that you let 'gun toting'- 'bo-hunk'-'hill-billy'-'capped-tobacco-chewing' 'militia arm-band wearing psycho-christians' rule your moral agenda. You listen to them as they say 'If everybody has a gun, we'll all be safe'.....why? Yet you wonder why the REST OF THE ENTIRE PLANET do not trust you.

And guess what...I'm 40 years old and I have never seen a privatley owned firearm, let alone had one pointed at me. Why? Because we have the intelligence in the UK to have worked out (yes, even our trailer trash sussed it out) that if noone has guns then noone gets shot!

This website is one of the most sickening I have seen on the web. An image of a pregnant woman holding a SMG! Children! It is designed to maintain the paranoia between neighbours, to hinder the advancement of the human race by the maintenence of gun-culture. Listen guys, the 1870's mid-west pioneering days are OVER. Billy the Kid is not going to hold up your wagon train anymore.

Wake up, smell the coffee, chuck your guns in the lake and step out of your door free from fear and paranoia.

Weapons go against God and his creation. Guns destroy...decreate that which God has created. Killing or destroying or carrying the devices to do so go against God. In fact if you carry a gun, you give God the big middle-finger.

If you feel you need a gun to keep yourself safe, then may I suggest Psychiatry and/or Cognitive Behavioural Therapy. With good therapy you will realise what a fallacy this argument is.

PLease, help forward the moral development of this planet. Save your moral-soul too. Destroy all guns and weapons. Jail those that do not. Save yourself, your country and OUR planet.

Thankyou

Jake · Nov 21, 2004

Barbara · Nov 21, 2004

So..you like 9 mm or 45?

Justin · Nov 21, 2004

Anyone got a Vorpal blade with +2 against bigoted ethnocentrism?

cotzal · Nov 21, 2004

No need for suicide matey. Don't be so hard on yourself.

CZguy · Nov 21, 2004

Don't hold back.

All that repressed, internalizing, can really get to you!

bytor94 · Nov 21, 2004

"Because we have the intelligence in the UK to have worked out (yes, even our trailer trash sussed it out) that if noone has guns then noone gets shot!"

Did not your Government, which you are a subject of, take them?

Our SECOND Ammendment was passed just so that OUR Government not take our guns

I don't have to have bars on my windows to keep out the riff-raff that knows I am defenseless either. :neener:

Justin · Nov 21, 2004

No need for suicide matey. Don't be so hard on yourself.

Oh, how delightfully ironic. Last time I checked I wasn't the one posting all sorts of stereotyped generalizations about an entire culture of people.

Dionysusigma · Nov 21, 2004

Merriam-Webster's definition:
Main Entry: 3arm
Function: noun
Usage: often attributive
Etymology: Middle English armes (plural) weapons, from Old French, from Latin arma
1 a : a means (as a weapon) of offense or defense; especially : FIREARM b : a combat branch (as of an army) c : an organized branch of national defense (as the navy)
2 plural a : the hereditary heraldic devices of a family b : heraldic devices adopted by a government
3 plural a : active hostilities : WARFARE b : military service
- up in arms : aroused and ready to undertake hostilities

See also: How To Deal With Messages Of This Nature

Oh, and go ahead and give your peaceful Utopia a try. We'll provide covering fire for you when it turns to rot. :neener:

thefitzvh · Nov 21, 2004

Guys...

don't feed the trolls :-D

Justin · Nov 21, 2004

Dionysusigma-

Don't sweat it. Unless Mssr. Cotzal changes the tone of his messages to one that's a bit more civil, his membership priveleges may turn out to be quite fleeting indeed.

Rich K · Nov 21, 2004

"Let he among you who has no sword,sell his coat and buy one." JESUS CHRIST.That is enough for me.Just my 2 cents.

cotzal · Nov 21, 2004

But then again, my immediate reaction to a challenge was not violence. First replies immediatley brought out posts regarding guns and weapons. Interesting. In real life, how quickly would you therefore reach for a weapon? How quickly would someone else? This is the very basic attitude of all humans. We think of destruction to work our way out first. It betrays our Ape ancestry.

No one took our guns away, we never developed the habit to carry them. We didn't have the Pioneering need in 'New' lands where there were massive lawless areas. Guns have never been a big thing here. Even 95% of our Police force are (famously) without guns.

As for the translation of the expression 'Right to Bear Arms' (which is a standardised expression, like when someone says 'long arm of the law' they don't mean a rifle). here is another link http://www.heraldica.org/topics/right.htm. see also "Freedom of Speech and Expression"

I have also never ever ever had bars on my windows, nor barbed wire etc. I've never been burgaled yet either (touch wood) and if I ever am burgled, extremely unlikely the guy will have a gun anyway. And there is nothing I have in the world that is worth shooting or being shot over.

Barbara · Nov 21, 2004

First replies immediatley brought out posts regarding guns and weapons.

I was going to post about silkworms and pottery, but it seemed kind of out of place.

Justin · Nov 21, 2004

But then again, my immediate reaction to a challenge was not violence. First replies immediatley brought out posts regarding guns and weapons. Interesting.

You have got to be kidding. You show up on this board, spew a bunch of hateful, ill-informed vitriol in the most grand display of trollish behavior I've seen in at least a month and then when others respond with bemused sarcasm you accuse them of threatening violence? Just to clear things up, I've gone to the trouble of Googling the term Vorpal Blade for you.

I never thought I'd see the day when a reference to a nerdy paper 'n' pen board game would get me accused of violent behavior.

In real life, how quickly would you therefore reach for a weapon? How quickly would someone else? This is the very basic attitude of all humans. We think of destruction to work our way out first. It betrays our Ape ancestry.

Spoken like a true statist. In short, you're stating that all of the other people that you share this world with must be ignorant cretins prone to violence, so measures must be taken to protect them from themselves. It must really suck to live in a world where you don't think you can trust your fellow humans to handle a small chunk of metal with a modicum of responsibility.

As for the translation of the expression 'Right to Bear Arms' (which is a standardised expression, like when someone says 'long arm of the law' they don't mean a rifle). here is another link http://www.heraldica.org/topics/right.htm. see also "Freedom of Speech and Expression"

Again, I have to ask if you're kidding. Given that you couldn't even initially properly list the constitutional amendment that includes the right to keep and bear arms (RKBA) I find your assertion to be suspect and the implications outright laughable. Do you really think that the founders of this nation, who engaged in a grand display of tearing down the signs and trappings of royalty would then reverse themselves and include an amendment that would allow every able-bodied person to carry a crest with a pretty picture on it? On a battlefield?

Radagast · Nov 21, 2004

Hey Cotzal you winging pom, do you prefer Glocks or 1911s? Blued or stainless? IDPA or IPSC? Is the NRA too cozy with Washington or is GOA too extremist? Are Smith & Wesson still sell out traitors?
If you want to troll here we have standard formats that guarantee all the responses you could desire.

Barbara, definitely 9mm. .45s are for old relics who think there has been no improvements in small arms since 1911, and none between 1873 and then. :evil:

Ken, who's labourer was happy to leave London for Australia as he was fed up with the yardies carrying guns in his street.

Psssniper · Nov 21, 2004

We won
You lost
about a couple hundred years ago
remember?

cotzal · Nov 21, 2004

Yes yes Justin. I have known what Vorpal Blade is. I have been able to recite Lewis Carrol's The Jabberwocky for a long time now....I really don't know which board game you believe the expression came from.

AS for all the POM bit, well, My Mums English, my dad is from Texas and I was born and raised in Australia, I have lived in Denmark, Asia and Latin America for many years. I have a wide and varied global perspective and at least the Poms are not globally hated by all but a few suck-up politicians (Like Tony Blair). Sure not the most popular either.

I certainly did not imply that all the world are idiots, but the same movement will give idiots guns as well. And no, I wouldn't trust some people with such pieces of metal. Would you trust everybody that carried a gun? Concealed? Do YOU know if someone you meet may/may not go for his/her gun in an argument? Would you think of how 'safe' you would feel with a sidearm on you? Where there are no guns there are no thoughts or worries.

As for the founders of the nation, would these be the same extremist Puritans that we kicked out of England on the Mayflower who then went on to conduct medieval style witch hunts in the New World? Sure you had a grievance against GeorgeIII. He was completely and totally clinically mad. Loco. Tonto. As mad as a march hare. Up until the point of the constitutions my expression of right to bear arms was exactly what it meant.

well, I stated my point. You may revoke my privaledges as I can't be bothered to find the button. I only signed on to express how sickening I think this is. I was actually looking for images of wheelchairs which is how I came across the site.

Moparmike · Nov 21, 2004

Is this guy for real?

After reading only the first post, I dont know wether to laugh hysterically, "pity the fool", or find him disturbing. :scrutiny:

Tamara · Nov 21, 2004

The "Right to bear arms" means you have the right to bear a heraldic device (i.e. a coat of arms) into the field of battle.

I have to know... Are you being serious? The right to bear heraldic arms? In a country with no vestigial holdover nobility? Look, friend, the only time you see a coat of arms in this country is on some little tchotchke picked up at some tourist trap like "Merry Olde English Village" or "Bavaria Haus" or suchlike, and it's faked.

StandOnGuard · Nov 21, 2004

It's the 2nd Amendment you're referring to, cotzal, not the 5th. The 5th Amendment guarantees, amongst other things, the right to due process, and the right not to have property arbitrarily confiscated (ie. eminent domain).

erik the bold · Nov 21, 2004

Being from Texas, you'd think his ol' man would have taught him something about our heritage. Unfortunately, his lack of education (see, I could have said ignorance...

) gives him the appearance of blissninny/troll.

Cotzal should really should read further into the background of this country, probably starting here: http://www.law.ou.edu/hist/federalist/ before spouting off on topics which he has obviously no clue. :banghead:

See sig. line for my opinion.........

jdkelly · Nov 21, 2004

Are you part French, too?

I guess your'e a Chamberlain kind of guy. Nuff said?

With not so much respect,

jdkelly

jamz · Nov 21, 2004

While cotzal may seem like a troll, I invite him, if he's not, to stay and learn. Lots of people don't share our point of view- let's educate in the reasonable civilized manner that we always do

But I have to ask, cotzal, bear a suit of armor? That actually made me laugh out loud. And has anyone noted his quoting of the FIFTH amendment? The one pertaining to questioning in a crime?

For cotzal, here is the fifth amendment.

No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

I believe you are really referring to the second amendment- that is the one that guarentees us Americans, as human beings, the right to excercize self defense.

Jspy · Nov 21, 2004

Just keep believing cotzal, and all will be well. Its a good thing the British govt has been kind enough to make these decisions for you. Hell, I wonder what in the world all of the upper crusts over there are going to do now that they can't even go fox hunting. By the way, what exactly is "burgled" or "burgaled" ? I'm guessing its similar to "shagged" which describes why people over there can't decide for themselves whether or not they have the mental capicity to control the use of firearms. Thank goodness for big govt.

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