S&W Forum?

LoneStar- If this (primo examples for press use that are better than production samples) is typically done then THAT would have been a reasonable response to my question.

halvey- I guess I could have started a new thread but I was simply asking a question inspired by what was happening on this one. I wasn't trying to detract from the admiration fbeing expressed for the very nice gun pictured (in fact I joined in), I just had a question about marketing such a piece.

FPrice- I didn't mean to come on too strong. Apparently some members took it that way from the anger in their responses.

Like I said, this wasn't the only time this happened. It seems like any diessention from unqualified groveling at the feet of the more senior members over there draws a lot of ire. You're right in that it's my choice whether to participate and that's why I don't. What bothered me the most was the favortism shown towards those with the biggest collections. But, it is, afterall, a forum for serious collectors so maybe they have simply established their hierarchy?

As I said I still drop in and read, but I don't post any opinions as they are clearly unwelcome.

As I said I still drop in and read, but I don't post any opinions as they are clearly unwelcome.

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Bad assumption. Hopefully you will change your mind and begin posting again.

They're so busy sucking up to someone that showed a picture of a gun, woo-hoo, they have to stomp on you to make themselves feel big. If I were you I wouldn't return either. You made a legit observation and it was not geared toward the poster. You even complimented the gun. I would tell em all to kiss my azz (the ones being critcal).

For the ease of reading:

thatguy:

I don't doubt that it's the only one like this you've seen. It was obviously intended to impress the press and photograph well for publication. Free advertising, what?

That is certainly a beautiful revolver and its history adds to to its value and character. But, does it strike anyone else as just slightly unethical to make up a special gun for the magazine piece? How many people saw the pictures in the magazine and ordered 29s expecting to get one just like this one? I understand wanting to put your best foot forward, and all, but is it fair to show people a gun they aren't going to get (and not tell them that the one in the magazine was a specially prepared show piece)?


Others:


Simple reply NO...
I really doubt it crossed ANYONE's mind on this forum that
the interesting story offered with this great photograph of a
pristine example of the classic model 29 as being "unethical".
Your beatin a dead horse..a 50 year old dead horse.
You must be an attorney or salesman.
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Hey "thatguy"....show some respect will you? If you can't detract from the thread, then keep your fingers off the keyboard.

Bill is going out of his way to show us some of his fine guns and you want to take the thread over by editorializing about 50 year old advertizing policy?

I for one will be dissapointed if Doc 44 stops patiently showing us his guns because he gets tired of reading your comments.

Bill. A sincere "Thank You" from all of us who can enjoy your photos of truely spectacular guns we would never have a chance to see otherwize. Please keep them coming.
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I forgot something. Hey thatguy, why don't you take a long walk off a short pier.
DW
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I like S&WF. Less fluff compared to GT

I've never had a problem posting in various threads over in the S&W Forum, although I seldom frequent the Revolver section ... although I've learned a lot while browsing the Revolver forum, and continue to browse it for that reason alone.

I browse & read much more than I post, though.

Overall, any 'special interest' groups notwithstanding, I've generally found the majority of the folks to be more polite and cordial than in some of the other forums.

It's not uncommon for me to learn something new almost every time I browse among the forum sections.

I like the fact that it's more firearms-oriented than 'tactical', 'cop' or 'gunfight survival' oriented. A little of that goes a long way, if you know what I mean ...

FG- The alloy Chief's Special became the Model 37 in 1957.

Here's the serial range for the pre-number J frames from Nahas & Supica:
1950: Start at 1
1952: 7369-21342
1953: 21343-28916
1955: 55050-75000
1957: 117770-125000

I guess they didn't produce them every year?

thatguy said:

FPrice- Here's a thread where I came under personal attack for asking what I thought was a legitimate question. Member Doc44 (a very advanced, serious, and obviously wealthy collector who has many fabulous pieces) posted a pic of a deluxe .44 Magnum made for press use back in 1957. This gun was prepared in ways that would not be included on the regular production guns and I asked if showing people a gun they wouldn't get (but they might think they would) was 100% ethical. In responses I was told to not participate if I couldn't be positive (in other words fawn all over whatever was posted without question), "take a walk off a short pier", which caused another reply to note that this would violate EPA rules (I am toxic?). In re-reading the thread it seems to me that a couple other insulting replies appear to have been deleted from the thread but I might be confusing them with other insulting remarks directed towards me in other threads.

My reply is in the middle of page 2, and note the subsequent remarks by Sebago Son and DWFAN. Like I said, I recall that there were others now gone. Do you think what I asked warranted such caustic responses? I complimented the gun then asked if it was fair marketing. Apparently this is not allowed. What's your opinion?

http://smith-wessonforum.com/groupee/forums/a/tpc/f/530103904/m/574100117/p/1

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I see a couple of other usual suspects in there too. Not surprised that it was that group getting all bent out of shape over your terrible question...

As with any forum there are a certain amount of snobs present. Most of them are members of the SWCA. But the majority of them are just like people here.........more than willing to help a fellow member in any way they can. So don't let a few snobs ruin the site for you.

thatguy said:

but I might be confusing them with other insulting remarks directed towards me in other threads.

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You've had insulting remarks directed towards you in other threads???

Hmm, Maybe you come on a little strong.

Dean

HMM, while I'm a member of a number of firearm forums, I spend most of my "forum time" over at the S&W forum, and generally find it to be one of the most cordial and pleasant. Of course, I'm also a member of the S&WCA, so maybe I get better treatment since I know the secret handshake

Are there people that post there that are a bit snobby at times? Sure, but most of those folks also have and share a lot of knowledge about S&W's. I also post pictures of my meager "collection" on the forums that I visit, and while I'm not looking for fawning adulation it sure is nice to get some positive feedback

At least 70 or 80% of my posts over there are answering questions posted by other members: when was my gun made - whats my gun worth - how do I fix my gun, etc. I do believe I recall getting a bit short with you once, Thatguy - one of the VERY few times I've posted a somewhat unpleasant response on any forum. But such is life; adults can "agree to disagree" without holding a grudge. So, if you post a question here or over on the S&W forum I'll be happy to offer any insight or advice that I can.

If, however, you would prefer to hang out here and whine about the nasty people over on the Smith forum, thats fine too. But it's your loss, not mine

It is the first forum I go to when I sit down at the computer. I only own 3 1/2 Smiths and I have never had a problem with anyone over there. I sure don't have a problem with someone posting a picture of a one of kind gun. I am just glad I got to see a picture of it.

I've upset the apple cart on this forum once or twice, too. Maybe I do barge in sometimes, and I know sometimes I have it coming like everyone else. But I try, even if I am short and direct which seems to set some people off when I don't intend, to avoid personal slights (like telling someone to take a long walk...). I don't mind fair criticism, it's the cheap shots that turn me off.

Again, the S&W Forum is THE PLACE for S&W info and most people are nice most of the time. I have ceertainly sen far worse forums. I only offer a couple of warnings for those planning to visit based on my own experience. I got slapped around over there more than I felt I deserved but that's just my opinion.

I see that they are now discussing this thread, saying they are being trashed. I'm not trashing anything or anyone, just offering my viewpoint based on my experience. I don't wish anyone ill will.

Thatguy , every forum has a personality just like it's members , I believe the main reason you took some abuse over there is you posted that "question" in a thread by Doc44 , Doc44 does not debate the politics of S&W , the lock or any of the other BS that sidetracks so many conversations. Traditionally his posts are a "show and tell" about some of the rarest and finest examples S&W has ever produced. He is a pure collecter and will share all of his knowledge without regard to any members "status". He's not a snob , he just doesn't get into policy or politics on the forum.

For myself and many others it is a true treat that you get to see the first 44 Magnum ever produced , or the first one engraved . If you have a Standard Catalog 2nd edition , look at the photo section at the engraved and other special 44 magnums , see the collection most are credited to ? Thats Doc44 , If you look at the "all posts by Doc44" available under his user name you won't see a controversial word in all the pages , but you will see some wonderous guns.

While it's not necessary to"ohhh and ahhh" to those threads , it isn't exactly great form to introduce a thread veer into the policies of the company at the time the gun was produced. He doesn't post that often and really no-one wants anything to deter him from posting. It's not a snob thing , just a respect thing.

That would be sort of like a member here going to one of Olegs poster threads and saying " do you really think these posters have any affect on anything?"

I would expect you to get some abuse for that.

Ray

Tha S&W Forum.. What JOKE...

Hello ThatGuy

Sebago Son
Member
Posted 01 November 2005 08:25 PM
Well Then Tony, They Don't Have To Come Back! We Know Who They Are.... If They Can't Take It Here, Then 'Screw 'Em....

Seen This Before With A Few Cast-Offs That Started Their Own "Forum".... They Get Six Posts A Day, Total And Most Are Circle-J**ks...

Second Raters Deserve To Hang Togeather.....

Drew Sr.

"..... Evil Flourishes When Good Men Do Nothing...."
Posts: 3312 | Location: Sebago Lake, Maine, USA | Registered: 09 July 2002



I see you are also NOW one of the victims in there on going member trashing. Sabego-Son is the WORST for slashing member's throats and I feel he must be PAID in full to the little Magott that OWNS it.I also was TRASHED in his above response so FELT the need to respond with the FACTS as well. The truth is the owner seldom responds unless it is to intimidate, or belittle a member. He also LAUNCHED a scam a few months ago to FILL his pockets with member's hard earned CASH for a 29 cent upgrade that is cost minimal when you have and account with a server in place.I WONDER if he sent in the TOTAL ammount he scammed to the Federal Government, as need's to be claimed for TAX purposes, after this as well ? I too was TOSSED & TRASHED By Sabeago-Son over a grip thread.He has Never seen my work or more importantly PAID for any of it, and went on to run his mouth and tell lies about my previous refinishing work. I have refinished and sold over 500 set's of grips and had one complaint, and that was that they were too shinney. He is a WANNA-BEE and that is all he will ever be there. He want's to BE a moderator so bad he can taste it but they wouldnt give the OLD-FOOL the time of day. He sit's on the computer all day, trying to impress all his chronies, but it does not take one long to see this guy is a complete BLOW-HARD. He paint's a picture of how important he is, or what his lifes accomplishments are and the truth is he is a born LOOSER. He claims to be a "X" Winchester collector but when you bring up his name around prominent collectors they have NEVER heard of him. He also claims to have "300" pairs of factory grips' yet, when Dick Burg asked him for a set he could NOT produce.He also said he owned a gun shop at one time and I feel this is yet another one of PIPE-DREAMS. He goes on to BRAG about what and extensive collection he has but has YET to show any pictures other than a RUSTED Ole-K-frame, That someone else took the picture of !! This flaming idiot does not even have a camera to take pictures let alone, any revolver's to take them of. He made up and excuse that he could NOT attend the Tulsa show, as he had spent ALL his money on PRE-27's.. What a joke, he more than likely could not have purchased a BUS ticket to Tulsa let alone stay and enjoy a show. He also say's he is a Gun refinisher but BEGGED for member, to GIVE him a hammer for a -N-frame he had making excuses that he used HIS on a customer gun.The ONLY response he GOT was from a member that wanted to SELL him one. This showed me how much he was REALLY liked as well.What amazes me was he did NOT mind trashing my refinishing work YET molested a set of highly sought after "COKE" style grips. This was shown in the thread his "OFF spring " LOOSER SON as he called himself Posted.Here is the thread to that little deal and I found it amusing as, Sabeago-Son often jumps in thread's to TELL every one how to raise there kid's and what a good EXAMPLE he set for his own. /SEE END OF RESPONSE FOR LINK/ He also TRASHED me and my forum without even looking at this thread, so I figured I would respond. The difference is I can KEEP idiots like him from wrecking a perfectly good forum by his slanderous allegations that hold NO MERIT. He RAN to the owner of the S&W forum, after I warned him to STOP trashing my work from a PRIVATE E-mail. The owner also TELLS you to take all beefs off forum, then uses them against you, to TOSS you from his board. He also made FALSE allagations that I threatened to bring about a LAWSUITE towards this Sabago-Son looser as I said that they QUOTE/ "DEFORMED"/QUOTE My charector by what they said in there made UP thread about the grips. They even went to the extent to STEAL a picture that was also MINE as he does NOT own a camera to take the pictures and NEVER had the grip's to begin with. I guess because I said the Majic word "DEFORMED" is what caused them to hit the DUMP button on me as Victoris Louis ,explained that it was a QUOTE/ "LEGAL" /QUOTE, Term. They did me a FAVOR as I have moved on to my own forum, and enjoy and APPRECIATE all my members without TAKING there money.I also have NOT had one flame war in over a year of owning the forum, as I do NOT tolerate LOOSERS like Sabego-Son !! It is REALLY sad as this IDIOT has caused MANY to LEAVE that forum from his CAUSTIC , SLANDEROUS remarks, and I have several that have joined mine and like it there. The REALLY sad part is there is alot of GOOD people on that forum, but and on growing "CANCER" like him seem's to be spreading fast.I think if you FOLLOW the thread below it is not hard to see the apple does not fall far from the tree. They are more than likely Car pooling today looking for Blue light specials on "SPRAY-PAINT" to cover there RUSTY S&W'S with ! I also have not EVER seen him mention Mrs. Sabego-Son.. Hmm... Must be just ANOTHER Failure in his Meaningless pitifull life.. Regards, Hammerdown.

http://smith-wessonforum.com/groupee/forums/a/tpc/f/530103904/m/959109867/p/1

Show me

thatguy said:

...I was. And I saw others get it, too.

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I've been visiting several times daily for two years and posting S&WF occasionally, as well. I have nor witnessed what you claim. In fact, the opposite seems to b the rule: very polite and friendly forum. Trolls take an occasional beating.


You seem to me pretty ranty, trollish and pretty insulting in this thread, yourself. Seems to me you could contribute to the peace and dignity of these forums by chilling a bit. :banghead:

Apply the two year rule: "in two years, who's gonna give a damn?"

S.w.c.a.

/QUOTE/As with any forum there are a certain amount of snobs present. Most of them are members of the SWCA.../QUOTE/

Hello
I have SEEN a recent SURGE of behaviour in this fine club recently as well, and believe some of it may be directed to the forum discussed.. Sad but it HAS TARNISHED that fine membership as well . Hammerdown

With all due respect Hammerdown...You have an axe to grind, and everyone on the S&W forum knows it.

Wow, Hammerdown . . . my experience with Sebago Son is that he's just about the nicest, most nurturing collector out there.

When I got into and posted photos of a pre-Model 17 that had its barrel cut (I thought it was some rare collectible variant), Sebago Son was very gentle in encouraging me to enjoy shooting my gun - and graciously only agreed that it had been cut down and was not at all collectible when I specifically asked. He then noticed that the gun had come with goofy Pachmayr Presentation stocks, and gifted me three pairs of wood stocks for it, one custom and two factory, just out of the goodness of his heart. What a nice gesture!

In fact, I often tell people about Sebago Son's generousity when I talk about just how many great friends I've met on the internet. If he ever comes to NM again, the cervezas and enchiladas are on me.

It saddens me that nice folks don't always have the best encounters on the web, and I sure try to do my part to keep things friendly and positive. (Stephen A. Camp is a shining example of internet citizenship - one of those gentlemen that I wish I could always emulate. Though I don't, always.) But, as one of my Forum-mates on the S&W Forum has in his signature (paraphrased), "Be kind and bear in mind that everyone you encounter is fighting battles of which you have no awareness." I suppose that accounts for most of the unfortunateness one sees on the 'net.

In my experience, the S&W Forum is one of the friendliest places on the 'net. And there's always room for everyone - come on over!

Frenchy said:

With all due respect Hammerdown...You have an axe to grind, and everyone on the S&W forum knows it.

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Hello Frenchy
Evidently you have one with me as well, by how I saw YOU pointed out MY forum in the S&W thread.. Hammerdown

Erich said:

Wow, Hammerdown . . . my experience with Sebago Son is that he's just about the nicest, most nurturing collector out there.

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Hello Erich
GREAT that YOU had some good to report.. Sorry that I DONT on that member. Just simply stating the FACTS, and sometimes the TRUTH bother's those that HIDE from it. Regards, Hammerdown

Hammerdown said:

Hello Frenchy
Evidently you have one with me as well, by how I saw YOU pointed out MY forum in the S&W thread.. Hammerdown

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Come on HD!...You stepped on enough toes over there to cripple a brigade..

I will not continue this on this forum however, as it take away from the premise of the thread, and it will upset the moderators.

Hammerdown Post #41

From the Forum Rules:
4.) Spamming, trolling, flaming, and personal attacks are prohibited. You can disagree with other members, even vehemently, but it must be done in a well-mannered form. Attack the argument, not the arguer.

If your #41 doesn't qualify under this rule, I don't know what does.

This possibly the worse diatribe I have seen on any forum. I'm sure it really gives a great impression to newbies and guests as to what kind of members we have.

Dean

I guess I qualify as a Smith and Wesson collector, since I own more than one and have bought and sold a few others over the years. Personally, I've never felt slighted or dumped on at SWF and I've asked some pretty basic questions, for example "What's a roll mark?" and have always gotten informative, polite answers.

Thatguy--I read the thread that you linked to and agree that some of the comments directed toward you were pretty caustic but I also feel you picked an inappropriate avenue for bringing up your point. Then, when one member defended you and your position, instead of leaving well enough alone, you come back with "Well excuse me", almost as if you wished to continue the spat. Know when to walk away! Also, it wouldn't have killed you to have posted an apology in the thread.

I'll never be able to buy the large majority of guns that serious collector show on internet forums or that are showcased in gun mags. That doesn't mean I don't like to look at them.