SKS Question

The Russian ones are very fine, no doubts there. The Norincos are nice, but I'd shell out the extra $50 for a Russian one myself.

Russians didn't have synthetic stocks. I take that as they've modified (Bubbafied) it. Now you've entered the wonderful realm of 922(r).

You should probably look the Russian over. Russian SKS's are the standard that all other SKS's are judged by.

922(r) from Survivor's SKS Board (link)

Only ten parts from the original 14 can stay on the rifle if the rifle is not in its original issued condition (it's Curio & Relic status).

Those fourteen parts are:
1. Receiver
2. Barrel
3. Bolt
4. Bolt carrier
5. Gas piston
6. Trigger housing
7. Trigger
8. Hammer
9. Sear
10. Disconnector
11. Stock
12. Handguard
13. Magazine body
14. Follower

So, four of these (Russian and Chinese made SKS) need to be replaced with USA made parts to make it legal.

Here is a thread I started a while back because I had read negitive comments on the norinco guns. Post number 5 should make you feel a little better about the chinese guns. http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=318230

I have two norincos. The 20" barrel and the paratrooper model with a 16" barrel. I like the shortness of the paratrooper but like shooting the rifle version better.

The chinese guns are fine. Keep the wood stock and add a buttpad extension. Use the money you would spend on the plastic stock and buy lots of ammo. Your gonna need it.

I have both, the chinese are very good rifles. But, when you pick up a russian... you can just feel the difference. I bought my russian for 199, and my chinese for 139. so you are paying almost twice what they are worth, but they will never again be that cheap. since the chinese sounds to be in original, buy it. I hate rifles that someone else has meddled with.

I recently picked up a norinco SKS, built around 1966. It is a tackdriver. I am more accurate with it than with my AR (much to my chagrin). I guess not all SKS's are terribly accurate, but some sure are. At first I was pissed not having the bayonet, but then I realized how much heavier that made it and got happy with what I have. For some reasons I find the irons on the SKS very good.

never ever have I had a slam fire. the only thing, sks's don't like to be fired un oiled.

I hate rifles that someone else has meddled with.

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Especially a Russian.

Although, I think that every person fond of the SKS should own at least 2. One should be left in the original configuration...the other should be a bit bubbafied.

I will own a Russian one day. The most beautiful wood found on any SKS rifle always seems to be Russian.

Good points.
Not only does the Russian wood have much more appeal, it has the original blade bayonet, chrome-lined bore and they helped to bridge the gap between the Mosin Nagant and AK-47.

Authentic, historic, military milled rifle (versus stamped parts) at a price only a bit more than for any common Norinco.
The last two Memphis gun shows (last spring) had two nice Russians at the same table. Gentlemen also prefer 'redheads'.
No "bubba-ed" guns will ever be in my family.

On 922r....

Not to be confused with the Assault weapons ban, this compliance was for imported, demilled, full auto weapons to be built from kits, you could not have more than 10 original parts...unlike an AK, FAL, or Browning Belt fed kits, SKS rifles were semi and do fall under 922r ruling... in fact sporterized was better, drew less attention from the antigun dems.....Russian in an original stock is good, or early Type 56 Chinese..............the cool ones are the paratrooper model that use AK mags...have fun...............


( again this 922r does not apply to a SKS...since it's not F/A, ya can't replace the firing group parts...trigger, hammer, and disconnector...trust me, I've Built AKs, Krinks, FALs, & belt feds...)

i just got a like new condition norinco sks non bubba original with a beautiful wood stock for 250 and i have to say it was one of the best buys ive made yet. i used to knock sks as a poor mans assault rifle but i know why people like them. light fairly accurate for a 7.62x39 rifle and i think is more fun to shoot than my 1200 dollar arsenal model 107cr ive got (did a trade would never pay that much for a ak but damn are they good). Im going to buy another pref a russian as my friend got one and also got me hooked on them. bubba sks are stupid looking in my opinion and those crapco stocks are much less durable than the wood. stay original and you will be happy.

I believe that the 922(r) law still applies to SKS rifles. I don't believe it's an F/A issue, it's an "imported" issue

Pyro-Grafix said:

On 922r....
Not to be confused with the Assault weapons ban, this compliance was for imported, demilled, full auto weapons to be built from kits

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No, that's not strictly true.

This gets confusing... you said:

SKS rifles were semi and do fall under 922r ruling...

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Which is true.

And then you said:

this 922r does not apply to a SKS...since it's not F/A,

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which is false.

Here's a summary of how the various laws affect the SKS and what the ATF says about it:

Therefore, since an SKS exibits some of these characteristics, it is banned from importation under section 925(d)(3). However, subsection (e)(1) of the same section allows for its importation because of its current designation as a Curio and Relic (the 20th item down on this list: http://www.atf.treas.gov/firearms/curios/0301to0505update.htm).

This section, by itself, only applies to importation, once it is in the country, Section 925 no longer applies.

HOWEVER, this section is referred to in Section 922(r) which states:

"It shall be unlawful for any person to assemble from imported parts any semi-automatic rifle or shotgun which is identical to any rifle or shotgun prohibited from importation under section 925(d)(3) of this chapter as not being particularly suitable or readily adaptable to sporting purposes except that this subsection shall not apply to... "

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Current ATF rulings hold that any modification of a military surplus C&R firearm from its "original military configuration" voids its status as a C&R firearm. Current ATF rulings also indicate that virtually ANY modification to a firearm can be construed as "assembly" of a new firearm.

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(http://sailorcurt.blogspot.com/2007/02/sks-legal-issues.html)

As Nuglium posted, you should read this: http://www.sksboards.com/smf/index.php?topic=27678.0 so that you know what the ATF has to say about it. Even the most cursory reading shows that they CAN and DO consider a modified SKS to be subject to the parts count provision of 922(r).

Be careful giving advice on legal issues. When you are wrong, you could cause some one else a lot of trouble.

-Sam

P.S. -- Welcome to the forum Pyro... You'll find that there are many here who can say this:

Trust me, I've Built AKs, Krinks, FALs, & belt feds...

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But that (fortunately) won't be accepted as proof of legal understanding.

russians really are pretty

top to bottom,
norinco
russian 1953 tula
norinco paratrooper

ccsniper- Beautiful Russian you've got there...and a nice assortment of the SKS platform too.

See, that is the only was a Russian should be. None of this taticool crap attached or anything, just wood and metal. I have concluded it a sin to put on anything aftermarket (unless it's a sight upgrade or trigger job) on a Russian SKS.

Thanks SAM1911

Point taken, thanks for the correction........................

After seeing those prices I'm laughing about how sick I was about buying my first Russian right after the passage of the '94 AWB for $200. Wish I still had it!

Thanks SAM1911
Point taken, thanks for the correction........................

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Hey, no worries, we're all here to learn stuff.

And the 922(r) rules are often pretty non-intuitive. Unless you've got the ATF letters in front of you, you really can't be sure you've got it figured out... :banghead:

-Sam

I paid $175 for my Russian a few years back. The stock looks like crap but all the numbers match. Other then that the rifle shoots better then my AK.
One thing I learned about the SKS is that they will slam fire. My russian has the spring in it, but any crap in the firing pin can cause a slam fire. It is a lot more accurate then my AK is.

I think it's a tough call, depending on what you want out of an SKS, but I wouldn't delay too long as those guns won't last. A Russian is the most desirable, but the Norinco is nothing to sneeze at. The issue, not knowing the condition of either rifle, is that the Russian is in a synthetic stock. If that doesn't bother you I would say go for the Russian. If you want an SKS as issued, non-modified, go with the Norinco. You could try and find a wood stock for the Russian, but that might be difficult and expensive, although there is one on GunBroker right now: http://gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=136806142 I returned a synthetic stock Romanian to somewhat orginal configuration (used a Chinese stock) and those projects can be fun and rewarding, and sometimes more complicated than one would have imagined.

So, if you want a restoration project, or like synthetic stocks, go with the Russian. Considering the stock I'd try and get them down to $300 but would probably go the $350. If you want a gun as issued, that is ready to shoot, needing no more work, get the Chinese.

The Chinese SKS's with the Arsenal 26 stamp are considered some of the most well-made SKS's out there. The draw to the Russian's isn't necessarily because they're the "best." They're desirable from a collector's stand point and because of the laminate stocks they have. They're set apart in looks and history. Not saying they aren't high quality among SKS's though because they definitely are, but I wouldn't say that a Russian is necessarily higher quality than a Norinco.
You should go over to the SKS boards and do some reading. They will teach you everything you need to know about the SKS and specifically the SKS you're purchasing.