What do you think is the major "sleeper" cartridge out there?

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The problem with the 350 Rem mag is it's better suited to lighter bullet weights while most 35 Whelens can effectively use heaver 250gr. bullets.
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200 and 250 grains were (are) the standard factory loads. With either weight, you get slightly more powder capacity than the Whelen
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The 350 Remington Magnum (The first short action magnum) Does not suffered as a cartridge from problems with long and heavy bullets.

That problem is with the rifle magazine box length and the rifle twist being offered.
For example: I shoot 275 grain bullets from my 350 Rem Mag because it is a Ruger stainless with a better twist rate and a slightly longer magazine box. Remington goofed on both counts.
Not only with the 350 Rem Mag, but also their 35 Whelen rifles which use a 1-16 twist.
 
I can't think of any "sleeper" rifle cartridges. Every cartridge I can think of is essentially duplicated by at least one other cartridge, or is so close to some other more popular cartridge as to be pointless. When people start touting an additional 100 FPS I have to resist the urge to hold a ballistics chart up to their faces. If we were a rational species there would be maybe a half dozen rifle cartridges in existence.

And the .257 Roberts would be one of them, Bluenote. :)
 
The .260 is not ignored by competitive shooters. It was used to win the nationals this year at Perry and set a new high score record. The same person used it to set the record for the highest 800 point and 1000 point agg scores ever shot across the course.
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Did you see the rifle used to win at Perry? Not your off the shelf Remington. Competitive shooters have been looking at the 6.5mm and 7mm bullets for a while now. You get the drop and wind drift of a big 7.62 magnum without the recoil. The .260 is a fairly good blend of barrel life to velocity. Some are faster and wear faster, others slower with a longer life, but it makes for a good middle ground. My problem is the availability of factory built rifles and of quality factory ammo. Federal has three hunting loads, Remington has a managed recoil load and a core-lokt load. Not much selection.
 
I think its the 243 winchester. Great deer rifle and great for long range shooting to 1000 yards.
 
hands down its the 6.5 grendel! hard hitting and flat as can be. you can stack it on about any platform but it hasnt been taken up that greatly. huge man stopper and can drop any game you wanna shoot in north america. reloading from 7.62x39 cases is easy as pie. as accurate as round can get and imho dominates the venerated 6.8 spc. long and short range ballistics are fantastic and i can use my same mags!

and i want one!
 
7-30 Waters.... .375 Winchester.... .307 Winchester..... .356 Winchester..... .30-30 Ackley Improved.... .444 Marlin..... Huge orphans, and undeservedly so.

Basically, any rifle cartridge that fits a Model 94 action... other than the plain old .30-30. Because the .30-30 ain't a sleeper. It's still one of, if not THE, top selling hunting cartridges. These other ones... not so much.

All those and the 7 WSM. The OP was right on that one. AND whoever said the .280 Rem was also right. Those two Seven Mike Mikes deserve a lot more love.
 
5.45x39 - the cheapest varmint round you can buy. It is half the price of 17 hmr and 2x as capable. I wish CZ or someone chambered a 527 in this caliber. So what if I have to clean the gun, I do it anyway. .22 LR is the only thing cheaper, it is also the only thing dirtier.
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Don't think that's a very fair comparison, for either. All the .17HMR ammo on the market is premium quality and I don't know anywhere else you can buy a $300 rifle that shoots half-MOA. All the 5.45 ammo that I see is the cheapest stuff possible and none loaded with good varmint bullets.


7-30 Waters.... .375 Winchester.... .307 Winchester..... .356 Winchester..... .30-30 Ackley Improved.... .444 Marlin..... Huge orphans, and undeservedly so.

Basically, any rifle cartridge that fits a Model 94 action... other than the plain old .30-30. Because the .30-30 ain't a sleeper. It's still one of, if not THE, top selling hunting cartridges. These other ones... not so much.
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I agree, there have been some great cartridges chambered in the 94 that never really caught on. Some recently duplicated to a certain extent with the .308 and .338 Marlin Express cartridges. I'd still love to have a 7-30, .375 and .356. It was also a bummer that they reintroduced the .38-55 and .25-35 right before going belly-up. I got excited about that!

I also have no idea why anybody would consider the .30-30 a "sleeper". It's been doing the deed for over 100yrs and is still one of the top sellers in both loaded ammunition and reloading dies.
 
Rodman30 said:
+1 on the 303 british
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.303 British isn't popular in America, but it was immensely popular in England, Australia and parts of Africa where the British have been.

What about the 7.7x58 Arisaka...it is rimless and was based off of the .303 Biritsh.

I think the .280 Rem is under-appreciated, but not sure it is a sleeper
 
I used a 7x64 Brenneke(sp?) over in South Africa last year. Great cartridge and basically the same as .280 Rem. Would have to echo the votes for smaller .260 Rem and bigger .35 Whelen.
 
Don't think that's a very fair comparison, for either. All the .17HMR ammo on the market is premium quality and I don't know anywhere else you can buy a $300 rifle that shoots half-MOA. All the 5.45 ammo that I see is the cheapest stuff possible and none loaded with good varmint bullets.
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That's exactly the point. There is nothing cheaper than 5.45x39, except .22 lr. For $120 you can buy a 1,000 rnd + spam can of 5.45, giving you 400+ rounds of practice over purchasing an equivalent amount of 17hmr.

Also, I am guessing without knowing, that a group of surplus 5.45 shot at 200ish yds from a decent bolt rifle, is smaller than the bullet drop of .17hmr from 175-225yds. When does .17hmr go subsonic anyways? I can't measure distance that accurately to work out the bullet drop and be effective at shooting squirrels/ground hogs etc. with 17 hmr at those ranges. 17hmr can't really be used on anything bigger. However, 5.45 would still be relatively flat shooting out to 200 yds, it is similar to .223. If you are shooting offhand, and are not an olympic class shooter, then any accuracy difference between 5.45 and 17hmr is moot anyways. Also, the Russians have been using 5.45 for years on game as large and dangerous as homo sapien.

If I were shooting 100's of rounds at paper from a bench for the tiniest groups, then sure 17hmr would be better. I also appreciate you can buy a cheap rifle.

However, the OP is looking for the most under appreciated round. I think 5.45x39 certainly qualifies, since there is by far more cheap ammo in that caliber than anything else. Nobody can dispute that- even re loaders. And, AFAIK there are only a few hundred SSG82 5.45 bolt rifles in the county. Only one is for sale now on gunbroker:

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=185591830

I'll put my money where my mouth is and mail anyone $1 if they can name a caliber with fewer bolt action rifles, and more available ammo in the USA.
 
Kernel said:
.30-30 Ackley Improved.... Huge orphans, and undeservedly so.

Basically, any rifle cartridge that fits a Model 94 action... other than the plain old .30-30. Because the .30-30 ain't a sleeper. It's still one of, if not THE, top selling hunting cartridges.
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An Ackley Improved anything adds about 100 FPS to its velocity (which is a gemoetric increase in energy). By itself, that may not be sufficient. But they also still fire the original cartridge: a big positive and probably no negative. So guns would be chambered for it rather than a new cartridge developed or even many made. For the .30-06 Ackley Improved, to the decent reader, over a competitive .308 it makes it worthwhile and eliminates much of the perceived need for the Marketing Department's "Magnum." Oooga, put a belt on that bad boy! And sell more recoil pads...

.30-06 Ackley Improved: the .308 Magnum!

Al
 
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That's exactly the point. There is nothing cheaper than 5.45x39, except .22 lr. For $120 you can buy a 1,000 rnd + spam can of 5.45, giving you 400+ rounds of practice over purchasing an equivalent amount of 17hmr.
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Yeah and like I said, you have 1000rds of el cheapo ammo you can't use for anything but paper punching or plinking. The .17HMR is a field round, all the factory ammo is premium quality. It ain't a plinker and ain't meant to be. Cheap ain't everything and I don't even understand why you feel the need to compare the two.


Also, I am guessing without knowing, that a group of surplus 5.45 shot at 200ish yds from a decent bolt rifle, is smaller than the bullet drop of .17hmr from 175-225yds. When does .17hmr go subsonic anyways? I can't measure distance that accurately to work out the bullet drop and be effective at shooting squirrels/ground hogs etc. with 17 hmr at those ranges. 17hmr can't really be used on anything bigger. However, 5.45 would still be relatively flat shooting out to 200 yds, it is similar to .223. If you are shooting offhand, and are not an olympic class shooter, then any accuracy difference between 5.45 and 17hmr is moot anyways. Also, the Russians have been using 5.45 for years on game as large and dangerous as homo sapien.
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A bunch of nonsense from somebody who obviously never spent any time with the .17HMR. The .17 is incredibly flat-shooting, with a 100yd zero, it drops only about 8" at 250yds. Again, with a bullet intended for use on game. Not intended to adhere to The Hague Convention.


However, the OP is looking for the most under appreciated round. I think 5.45x39 certainly qualifies, since there is by far more cheap ammo in that caliber than anything else.
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That may be true but you don't have to compare it to the .17HMR to make your point.
 
7.5 Swiss: Great semi auto cartridge. Very accurate as well.
.260 Rem/6.5x47 Lapua: great ballistics for long range. Highly accurate.
.30 BR: For score and agg.

I dont hunt.. so am more interested in accuracy.
 
krochus, if you think the WSSM's would be great in the AR platform, you should look at the .358 Grant (shortened WSM case). You could apply the same principle for the 6.5 and 7mm calibers.


In no particular order, starting at the lower calibers and working up

.257 Roberts
6.5x55 Swede
.260 (especially in the AR-10 platform)
.280 (arguably better than the .30-06)
7mm-08 (popular, but way under appreciated)
.284 Win (this WILL be the next big 1,000 yard cartridge after they've wrung everything they can out of the 6.5-.284)
7mm WSM (this will be the cartridge they look to after they've wrung everything they can out of the .284)
8mm-06 (arguably better than the .30-06, forgotten when the 8mm Mauser supply dropped)
338-06 (arguably better than the .30-06)
.358 Win (if it weren't for being introduced in a lever action and round nose factory loads -- I know, I know, it was also introduced in the Model 70 Featherweight *ouch* -- this would be the do-it-all short action 35 cal for everything in NA out to 300+ yards -- which is where most game is taken. Instead it's a "brush gun".)
 
I'd have to say the 6.5 Grendel. The slippery ballistics of the 6.5 mm bullet coupled with the shortness of the cartridge give this a NICE "smackability" at long ranges.

Another one I'd say is the 7.62X39. This is generally used for blasting out of SKS and AK-47 rifles. However, throw it into a bolt action when it's been handloaded and WOW.
 
I'm going to say the 30-30. When I tell folks that's my deer rifle caliber, quite a few think I'm under powered. I'm not going after grizzlies with it.
 
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