Haha, great idea!
What does it take for a local gun store to be successful?
- Thread starter Bob01
- Start date
- Status
Haha, great idea!
Murphy4570
Member
- Joined
- Oct 14, 2010
- Messages
- 433
mizzlep said:
I disagree. Sales tax is levied against the purchaser of a product, not the seller.
oneounceload
member
The store is responsible for collecting it from you on behalf of the state. If you want to get really technical most states require you to voluntarily remit the appropriate sales/use tax on interstate purchases as well.
Even if his cost is above that? Seems you really don't know anything a out running a business. He has to make a profit and pay for that brick and mortar store. If your online place is such a great deal buy it there. You sound like the person who screams about wanting all the customer service without being willing to PAY for it
The first thing you need is the ability to motivate yourself when things aren't looking great.
Things that will feed your exhisting business with revenue from other related areas, like training, courses, ccw courses, home defense, family defense courses.
And the knowledge of how to promote your business in a way that is afordable.
Going the extra mile to introduce clients to weapons that may be better for their situation than what they now have taking into account their likelly objections and having the answers ready before they ask.
Doing or having a gunsmith on site. and being able to do Duracoat and parkerizing, etc.
Having a spray booth and air compressor set up to do work in house.
Being able to guarantee all of the work you do for a reasonable time.
Including installation along with the price of night sights, Just charge a little more, say 10 dollars or include it in the price. if you make a killing on a scope and mount, give the guy a discount to mount it, or do it free if it's a high profit number. Sight or help sight in the optics you sell. People are sometimes embarrased to ask, so the worse thing is to spend a thousand or two and not be able to put whatever you bought on the gun. offfer help, you retain customers that way.
A lot of folks are too proud to say they don't know how to do something, after they have been talking to you for a few days or even minutes. Offering them the "service", takes a load off their mind and allows them to retain their dignity. Oh you guys do that, I would do it myself but since you do it I may as well let you put it on since it's here anyhow.
That's how you build a client base and a business.
Things that will feed your exhisting business with revenue from other related areas, like training, courses, ccw courses, home defense, family defense courses.
And the knowledge of how to promote your business in a way that is afordable.
Going the extra mile to introduce clients to weapons that may be better for their situation than what they now have taking into account their likelly objections and having the answers ready before they ask.
Doing or having a gunsmith on site. and being able to do Duracoat and parkerizing, etc.
Having a spray booth and air compressor set up to do work in house.
Being able to guarantee all of the work you do for a reasonable time.
Including installation along with the price of night sights, Just charge a little more, say 10 dollars or include it in the price. if you make a killing on a scope and mount, give the guy a discount to mount it, or do it free if it's a high profit number. Sight or help sight in the optics you sell. People are sometimes embarrased to ask, so the worse thing is to spend a thousand or two and not be able to put whatever you bought on the gun. offfer help, you retain customers that way.
A lot of folks are too proud to say they don't know how to do something, after they have been talking to you for a few days or even minutes. Offering them the "service", takes a load off their mind and allows them to retain their dignity. Oh you guys do that, I would do it myself but since you do it I may as well let you put it on since it's here anyhow.
That's how you build a client base and a business.
dogtown tom
Member
Care to narrow it down a bit?
You've described an area bigger than some states.
.
Obviously, if a price is below his cost, I can understand that. However, we're talking about a gun that he doesn't have in stock. I'd prefer to give my money to a local brick and mortar store, that's why I mentioned the fact that they should price match (or close to it), but I'm not going to pay more than the online price, plus tax, for something they don't have in stock. I mean, I'm flexible within reason, but a lot of shops are out of their minds. I'm not trying to nickel and dime anyone, just not going to pay $200+ more dollars for no good reason. $50 or $60 more than cost should be more than enough for a gun that you DON'T HAVE IN STOCK.
Most states can require me to cluck like a chicken and lay eggs for all I care. I'm not paying sales tax if I don't have to.
mgmorden
Member
Realistically, you're going to be competing a lot with online sellers that you might not be able to beat on price. You have two choices there: Complain about it (and get nowhere) or, recognize that that's the market at work, and work around that the best you can. With that in mind:
1. As you mentioned, a range is incredibly nice. You end up essentially just selling a space with little overhead, and you'll sell a lot of other accessories than you otherwise would (ie, targets, ammo, etc. heck I've even bought holsters and magazines on a whim while visiting the local indoor range/gunshop).
2. As noted, you're going to be competing with internet sales anyways. People need transfer guys for this. If they aren't getting you to do it, then they will find someone else. Don't turn that money away. Set a fair price - $25 or so - and offer that service. No sense in letting that money go to someone else.
3. Recognize that powder and primer are expensive to ship due to hazmat fees. Those are things that people tend to buy locally keep a good selection.
4. Price your guns reasonably. You're never going to make up lost profits by raising prices further and reducing your volume even more.
5. Offer gunsmith services - even if you have to outsource it. Shipping guns is a pain - particularly handguns. People like to work on things locally. You might be able to find an smith who isn't a "people person" and doesn't want to work a counter that will work on your guns. One of the gunsmiths I use occasionally is like this. He will offer his services separately, but most of his work is subcontracted from a local gun shop (where they charge an extra 20% on top of what he does to turn a profit).
6. Presentation. You'd be surprised how many people ignore this, but a depressing store leads to depressed shoppers, and depressed shoppers don't spend money. Keep the store's lighting BRIGHT. Keep the store decorated with appropriate posters and promotional material. Keep it CLEAN. Keep the paint fresh, and the floor tiles (make sure its tiles not not plain cement) shiny. You want them to feel like they're in a retail establishment, not some shady back alley shop.
7. (last on my list, but the MOST important). Attitude, attitude, attitude. Your customers are your lifeline. Treat them with respect. Too many gun store owners seem to act as if you should be groveling at their feet just for them daring to allow you into their holy shrine. Be courteous, friendly, and don't talk down to anyone. If a customer literally knows nothing about guns, don't sneer at them. Help them and realize we were all at that point once upon a time.
1. As you mentioned, a range is incredibly nice. You end up essentially just selling a space with little overhead, and you'll sell a lot of other accessories than you otherwise would (ie, targets, ammo, etc. heck I've even bought holsters and magazines on a whim while visiting the local indoor range/gunshop).
2. As noted, you're going to be competing with internet sales anyways. People need transfer guys for this. If they aren't getting you to do it, then they will find someone else. Don't turn that money away. Set a fair price - $25 or so - and offer that service. No sense in letting that money go to someone else.
3. Recognize that powder and primer are expensive to ship due to hazmat fees. Those are things that people tend to buy locally keep a good selection.
4. Price your guns reasonably. You're never going to make up lost profits by raising prices further and reducing your volume even more.
5. Offer gunsmith services - even if you have to outsource it. Shipping guns is a pain - particularly handguns. People like to work on things locally. You might be able to find an smith who isn't a "people person" and doesn't want to work a counter that will work on your guns. One of the gunsmiths I use occasionally is like this. He will offer his services separately, but most of his work is subcontracted from a local gun shop (where they charge an extra 20% on top of what he does to turn a profit).
6. Presentation. You'd be surprised how many people ignore this, but a depressing store leads to depressed shoppers, and depressed shoppers don't spend money. Keep the store's lighting BRIGHT. Keep the store decorated with appropriate posters and promotional material. Keep it CLEAN. Keep the paint fresh, and the floor tiles (make sure its tiles not not plain cement) shiny. You want them to feel like they're in a retail establishment, not some shady back alley shop.
7. (last on my list, but the MOST important). Attitude, attitude, attitude. Your customers are your lifeline. Treat them with respect. Too many gun store owners seem to act as if you should be groveling at their feet just for them daring to allow you into their holy shrine. Be courteous, friendly, and don't talk down to anyone. If a customer literally knows nothing about guns, don't sneer at them. Help them and realize we were all at that point once upon a time.
The main thing a local gun store needs to be successful is margin.
In general, that's going to mean having, and carefully managing, a good inventory of supplies and accessories. Knives are also good margin, and fit right in. (And if you knock a couple bucks off full MSRP, unlike most stores, folks will just buy local instead of waiting for an internet order.)
The guns themselves, if not used (and get some of those), don't carry a lot of margin. Accessories and knives typically have a lot of margin. Also, and services you can provide that don't require additional manpower beyond your routine staffing, such as FFL fees are good margin. Being the cheapest FFL transfer fee in town, even if by a little bit, can make you some serious cash. (A lot of price gouging that way around here.)
In general, that's going to mean having, and carefully managing, a good inventory of supplies and accessories. Knives are also good margin, and fit right in. (And if you knock a couple bucks off full MSRP, unlike most stores, folks will just buy local instead of waiting for an internet order.)
The guns themselves, if not used (and get some of those), don't carry a lot of margin. Accessories and knives typically have a lot of margin. Also, and services you can provide that don't require additional manpower beyond your routine staffing, such as FFL fees are good margin. Being the cheapest FFL transfer fee in town, even if by a little bit, can make you some serious cash. (A lot of price gouging that way around here.)
olafhardtB
Member
- Joined
- May 8, 2011
- Messages
- 393
gun stores
I am amazed that nobody has mentioned the two things that I think are most imporant. First the store must take guns as trades. Wally world doesnt. Second the store must have a viable layaway policy not possible at a gun show. These two tactics define the local gun store for me. I have found in selling luxury items people often want to be deceived and overcharged. If he buys a two carat cubic zirconia for way more than its worth and they both think its a diamond they will be happy. Some guys just know a Browning has to be a better gun than a Savage.. Ziess must be better than Bushnell (because it costs more). I missed that deer because I didnt have Weatherby, but I'll get that SOB this year. He will take the remington on trade for a down payment on the Weatherby. The dealer makes margin off the trade.
I am amazed that nobody has mentioned the two things that I think are most imporant. First the store must take guns as trades. Wally world doesnt. Second the store must have a viable layaway policy not possible at a gun show. These two tactics define the local gun store for me. I have found in selling luxury items people often want to be deceived and overcharged. If he buys a two carat cubic zirconia for way more than its worth and they both think its a diamond they will be happy. Some guys just know a Browning has to be a better gun than a Savage.. Ziess must be better than Bushnell (because it costs more). I missed that deer because I didnt have Weatherby, but I'll get that SOB this year. He will take the remington on trade for a down payment on the Weatherby. The dealer makes margin off the trade.
NoVA Shooter
Member
- Joined
- Jul 13, 2009
- Messages
- 178
1) Competitive pricing makes all the difference. Nothing is more discouraging than to see a LGS price guns at MSRP (or higher) when everywhere else has the same gun for 10-20% off MSRP. I don’t expect the price to be the lowest I can find, but the bigger the gap, the less likely I will even show interest.
2) Be willing to negotiate. If you can’t go lower on the price of the gun, throw in some other perks such as ammo, range time, etc. Even a token offering goes a long way. If a stores is unwilling to budge on price/perks (within reason) when it means the difference between a sale or no sale, that tells me they don’t need my business.
2) Be willing to negotiate. If you can’t go lower on the price of the gun, throw in some other perks such as ammo, range time, etc. Even a token offering goes a long way. If a stores is unwilling to budge on price/perks (within reason) when it means the difference between a sale or no sale, that tells me they don’t need my business.
Last edited:
JustinJ
Member
"I have found in selling luxury items people often want to be deceived and overcharged."
Hmm, sounds someone has gotten so good at deceiving people that he can even do it to himself now.
Hmm, sounds someone has gotten so good at deceiving people that he can even do it to himself now.
One more thing:
Have a website that doesn't look like it was created (and last updated) in 1997. Nothing makes me angrier than the "Coming Soon!" page, when in fact it's not coming soon. It's not ever coming.
I automatically assume that if your website is dumpy and half done, your store will be the same. It also says you're a crotchety old-timer that doesn't have any customer service skills, and you'll only interested in selling guns 20% over MSRP to 19 year old kids trying to impress their girlfriends (or whatever).
Have a website that doesn't look like it was created (and last updated) in 1997. Nothing makes me angrier than the "Coming Soon!" page, when in fact it's not coming soon. It's not ever coming.
I automatically assume that if your website is dumpy and half done, your store will be the same. It also says you're a crotchety old-timer that doesn't have any customer service skills, and you'll only interested in selling guns 20% over MSRP to 19 year old kids trying to impress their girlfriends (or whatever).
Well, every gun store in my area couldn't possibly be run worse. No service, no product costing < 10-15% over MSRP, horrible hours, and add to that you have a better chance of hitting the Powerball than of getting them to successfully order something. All that said 90% of these stores have been in business 15 years minimum.
Evidently its a foolproof business, at least around here. I think having a basic level of commonsense will put you miles ahead of other stores, if this area is representative of the rest of the country.
Evidently its a foolproof business, at least around here. I think having a basic level of commonsense will put you miles ahead of other stores, if this area is representative of the rest of the country.
ErikO
Member
Here's my recipe for those that want me to come back in the door:
Good selection on hand, ability to check stock at the distributor with either a quick phone call or a visit to their web page - web page is possible if they go through Acusport or Davidson's.
An unbelievable lay-away program. No set down or set period to pay, order the firearm in to teh store after the dealer cost is covered by the layaway and do final transfer from stock when the whole cost is in the store. This is how my FLGS does it and it works great for him. The cost of the firearm is there, he keeps it at his warehouse and once the cost + tax is in the purchser get the firearm. This is only done on new orders, used guns have a 90-day plan to be covered.
Friendly service to the whole family. Treat everyone in the door like they are welcome, especially new shooters and younger family members of new shooters. Ask questions and give answers of the person who is speaking, especially when its a woman being helped. Reward well behaved kids, especially if there are poorly behaved kids in the store as well.
'Frequent shoper' specials. If someone buys high-margin items from your store that they can get elsewhere, thank them by dropping your margin on new firearms. Establish a 'membership' club that is free after you've purchased over $750 worth of firearms in a six month or less period of time, including lay-away. Give them 10% off of $200+ orders of in-stock items.
Either have your own indoor range or if space doesnt permit, establish a relationship with a local range.
Good selection on hand, ability to check stock at the distributor with either a quick phone call or a visit to their web page - web page is possible if they go through Acusport or Davidson's.
An unbelievable lay-away program. No set down or set period to pay, order the firearm in to teh store after the dealer cost is covered by the layaway and do final transfer from stock when the whole cost is in the store. This is how my FLGS does it and it works great for him. The cost of the firearm is there, he keeps it at his warehouse and once the cost + tax is in the purchser get the firearm. This is only done on new orders, used guns have a 90-day plan to be covered.
Friendly service to the whole family. Treat everyone in the door like they are welcome, especially new shooters and younger family members of new shooters. Ask questions and give answers of the person who is speaking, especially when its a woman being helped. Reward well behaved kids, especially if there are poorly behaved kids in the store as well.
'Frequent shoper' specials. If someone buys high-margin items from your store that they can get elsewhere, thank them by dropping your margin on new firearms. Establish a 'membership' club that is free after you've purchased over $750 worth of firearms in a six month or less period of time, including lay-away. Give them 10% off of $200+ orders of in-stock items.
Either have your own indoor range or if space doesnt permit, establish a relationship with a local range.
mgmorden
Member
Absolutely. This one didn't spring to mind (surprising as stuff like this is how I make my living
), but by all means maintain a professional looking website. If you contract it out, make sure that whatever web designer you choose puts the domain in YOUR name, not theirs, and reserve it for as long as you can (10+ years). Even if you're not in business that long, the different in cost is trivial for the extra time (we're talking around $100-150 or so total). Also, from experience I know the mere thought of this will somehow offend many old-timers, but for goodness sakes setup a Facebook page for your business. You'd be surprised how many people will 'Like' a store that they visit a lot, and once they do that, you're free to post sales, information, etc, and all your fans will see it showup in their news feed. I can honestly say that from an online store perpsective I love seeing J&G Sales and AIM Surplus post stuff on their Facebook - often times its stuff that I would have otherwise not noticed. My local shop does it too though, and they advertise specials on various guns. Sometimes they even offer free range time early in the week to any Facebook friend that comes in an mentions it.
Keep them feeling like they're INVOLVED.
I will say though that I disagree with the bit about "negotiating" on the price. Again, possibly a generation difference here, but I personally LOATHE price haggling. I'll do it occasionally if something is just flat out overpriced, but here's the reality: people who are in areas where they often price haggle just end up setting their prices too high to begin with, because they're building in some haggle room. While that might work for some, a lot of other potential customers just walk in, see the initially high prices, and walk out without bothering. Notice how many people seem to prefer internet shopping these days? Notice something that is not much of a factor when buying from net-based stores like Buds, J&G, or AIM: price haggling. Their price is their price, and because they're not building in wiggle room to start with, there's no sticker shock.
If you want to provide some perks to your customers like free range time (which is essentially free to you unless you're booked to capacity anyways - you're already paying for the lights and the building), then that's fine, but if I have a choice between going into a store and buying a $415 gun straight up, vs seeing the same gun for $475 and talking them down to $400, I'll pay the extra to avoid the headache every time.
Last edited:
olafhardtB
Member
- Joined
- May 8, 2011
- Messages
- 393
gunstore
justin j takes me down for saying people want to be deceived and the next bunch talks about how you can tell a good GUN store by thier WEB site as if you can google a limit of ducks. There is no game in North America that cant be very adequately hunted with a $500. 00 dollar gun. If you cant capitalize on customers who want to pay extra for something "special" you will have a tough time at a gun store. You got to provide what Wally world, gun shows and the web cant. For me thats trades, layaways and legal transfer. People want to buy more than they got cash for LAYWAY. They get tired of what they have soTRADE. Most of us want to feel legal and dont mind paying a little to do so. These folks need a friendly FFL helps. It really helps to know a bit about guns.
justin j takes me down for saying people want to be deceived and the next bunch talks about how you can tell a good GUN store by thier WEB site as if you can google a limit of ducks. There is no game in North America that cant be very adequately hunted with a $500. 00 dollar gun. If you cant capitalize on customers who want to pay extra for something "special" you will have a tough time at a gun store. You got to provide what Wally world, gun shows and the web cant. For me thats trades, layaways and legal transfer. People want to buy more than they got cash for LAYWAY. They get tired of what they have soTRADE. Most of us want to feel legal and dont mind paying a little to do so. These folks need a friendly FFL helps. It really helps to know a bit about guns.
CutMan
Member
I'm pretty sure that I would be loyal to a store that actually 'had' friendly employees. I'm pretty tired of the gun-snob and grumpy old man types that work in a lot of the stores in Dallas. That's my primary reason for buying online. I'd be willing to actually pay more if I actually felt welcome in a given store..... and knew I wasn't going to have to hassle with 'tudes if I had an issue of some kind.
mgmorden
Member
Did you not read what was written? A website an amazing way to keep in touch with customers and push out information in the modern market. Even the local stores in my area that I frequent all have a good solid web presence.
Sorry, but the scoffing at new technologies like this is exactly the type of "grumpy old man" attitude mentioned by others that is killing a lot of gun shops. That's not an attack on the older generation in general, but rather those that believe that the world never changes and get "stuck in their ways". It's a business - you have to adapt to the market as it changes or you risk going the way of the buggy whip makers.
oneounceload
member
SO? If I do not have it in stock, that means I have to special order it. That means that MY cost might be higher than the online Bud's who has no inventory but does turn some product. Any GOOD gun store is going to tell you they can't compete and go from there.........if all you care about is a low price, then make Bud's your shop and hope there is still a local shop to do the transfer
I don't know about gun shops in particular, but I do have a couple of things to emphasize.
1) All retail is hard. The hours are long. You can't do it all yourself. You can't hire people as good as you need them to be.
2) The most important thing may well be fixed costs: rent, utilities, taxes, insurance, etc. If your rent is too high, the location won't work. When you see a store that only does a little business, chances are he is his own landlord.
3) Know your local customers. If you're on the eastern shore of Maryland, you really want to know waterfowl. Somewhere else, maybe cowboy gear. Another place, maybe tactical.
4) I'm sure the point about making more money on accessories is true.
5) I see lots of stories about people hanging around gun shops talking. Try to find a way to make money off them. (Sell'em coffee and donuts.) If you can't, encourage them to congregate elsewhere. Most of the stories are about how the make it hard to do business.
I think the point about layaway is interesting. I see more mention about layaway on gun boards than anywhere else. In fact, I don't ever see any mention anywhere else. It took me a while to figure out why, and it goes with another odd fact about the gun business: it can be hard to find the gun you want. A production run of a given model at Ruger or S&W is probably less than one gun per gun shop. No one can stock them all, even with major capital. The big distributors have to guess which are going to be popular (and sell out and be hard to find) and which are going to be less popular so they don't get too many (and sell out and be hard to find.) Which is why buyers have learned to put their name on what they want when the see it.
1) All retail is hard. The hours are long. You can't do it all yourself. You can't hire people as good as you need them to be.
2) The most important thing may well be fixed costs: rent, utilities, taxes, insurance, etc. If your rent is too high, the location won't work. When you see a store that only does a little business, chances are he is his own landlord.
3) Know your local customers. If you're on the eastern shore of Maryland, you really want to know waterfowl. Somewhere else, maybe cowboy gear. Another place, maybe tactical.
4) I'm sure the point about making more money on accessories is true.
5) I see lots of stories about people hanging around gun shops talking. Try to find a way to make money off them. (Sell'em coffee and donuts.) If you can't, encourage them to congregate elsewhere. Most of the stories are about how the make it hard to do business.
I think the point about layaway is interesting. I see more mention about layaway on gun boards than anywhere else. In fact, I don't ever see any mention anywhere else. It took me a while to figure out why, and it goes with another odd fact about the gun business: it can be hard to find the gun you want. A production run of a given model at Ruger or S&W is probably less than one gun per gun shop. No one can stock them all, even with major capital. The big distributors have to guess which are going to be popular (and sell out and be hard to find) and which are going to be less popular so they don't get too many (and sell out and be hard to find.) Which is why buyers have learned to put their name on what they want when the see it.
ThePunisher'sArmory
Member
Customers 
..............good prices, and customer service.
..............good prices, and customer service.Black Butte
Member
- Joined
- Jun 21, 2008
- Messages
- 888
Simple, the right products offered at the right prices. The higher those prices climb as compared to other sources, the better the level of service needs to be.
olafhardtB
Member
- Joined
- May 8, 2011
- Messages
- 393
gun store
I have worked in a gun store. These are some things I observed. One the owner loved to hagle and wanted the staff to also. Two all us really wanted people to hang arround shoot the breeze and fondle the merchandise. People wanted to be reassured that there rifle would "knock him down way out yonder", Any rifle from 243 up is adequate for most of us, But who wants adequate. Some do so you sell them a trade in. Often a fondler will sell himself a gun usually some hagleing takes place. One of our sales staff who had lots of satisfied customers was a real liar. This is a store that is a local land mark, been in business for decades and sells everthing from antiques to ARs and silencers too. To you guys who dont want to hagle, dont but you will miss some deals and fun. Order it of the net if you have the cash or credit. If you dont have the ready cash or want to work it out of your pocket money layaway may be an option and who will know. I will say that if you have got to ask what it takes you probably aint got it, but you might. We still did transfers at reasonable prices some times free, had a public restroom and welcomed ladies and kids.
I have worked in a gun store. These are some things I observed. One the owner loved to hagle and wanted the staff to also. Two all us really wanted people to hang arround shoot the breeze and fondle the merchandise. People wanted to be reassured that there rifle would "knock him down way out yonder", Any rifle from 243 up is adequate for most of us, But who wants adequate. Some do so you sell them a trade in. Often a fondler will sell himself a gun usually some hagleing takes place. One of our sales staff who had lots of satisfied customers was a real liar. This is a store that is a local land mark, been in business for decades and sells everthing from antiques to ARs and silencers too. To you guys who dont want to hagle, dont but you will miss some deals and fun. Order it of the net if you have the cash or credit. If you dont have the ready cash or want to work it out of your pocket money layaway may be an option and who will know. I will say that if you have got to ask what it takes you probably aint got it, but you might. We still did transfers at reasonable prices some times free, had a public restroom and welcomed ladies and kids.
Sebastian the Ibis
Member
Try to sell something different. The fantastically successful LGS near me makes its money selling equipment to PD's and Latin American Gov/Mil.
I'd also get an import license and import Commie 9mm, .223 and 7.62x39. There is a pretty insatiable market for cheap ammo.
I'd also get an import license and import Commie 9mm, .223 and 7.62x39. There is a pretty insatiable market for cheap ammo.
lizziedog1
Member
Have an attractive, scantily dressed women working behind the counter.
- Status