Stupid question of the day...

stuff like this bugs me a lot too when trying to search through websites...ill see stuff like brands listed twice

"HK" and "Heckler and Koch" for example...if i want to search through those products, i would have to do two separate searches....a lot of online sites are setup like that, smith, springfield, HK....basically if its got two words, they find a way to list it twice lol

Think about it sir. The 357Mag is named correctly,, the 44 Mag is not.

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It's not quite that simple. One must trace its lineage back to the .44S&W American and the .44Russian to understand "why".

To say nothing about the standard US Army issue for the SAA...the .45 S&W cartridge

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Standard issue for the SAA was the .45Colt, which had a much smaller rim than the .45S&W. There was a possibility of rim inteference when a SAA was loaded with S&W cartridges. Which is why the .45Gov't was created. It had the .45Colt's rim but was the same length as the .45S&W. Which made it usable in both guns. THIS (nothing to do with the .45ACP) is the reason for the incorrect use of ".45 Long Colt". The .45Gov't is long defunct, as is the need for ".45 Long Colt"......but that doesn't stop many people from clinging to it.

It's only called .45 Long Colt by the intellectually challenged. The revolver cartridge is 45 Colt. The autoloading pistol cartridge is .45 ACP. The Glock round is .45 GAP.

Now a Colt 45 is a gun, and can be the revolver, or the autoloader. It is also "the best malt liquor in the galaxy" according to Billy Dee Williams.

The head is stamped 45LC. Therefore the round is a 45LC...and your claims that it is not are a waste of everyone's time.

So...what if the headstamp just says ".45 Colt"?

Here is an exerpt from the history of the cartridge.

Alternate name

The designation ".45 Long Colt", sometimes abbreviated as ".45 LC", originated among military personnel to prevent confusion with the shorter-cased .45 Schofield. It has become a popular, albeit incorrect, alternative name for the cartridge.

Take note of the part where it says "albeit incorrect."

But, really...what difference does it make? If someone says .45 Long Colt, we know what he means, and he is likely just trying to say that it's the revolver cartridge and not the .45 ACP.

I don't get what point you are trying to make. "45 colt" is ambiguous. 45LC is the term in common usage and has been so for over 100 years. arguing that 45LC is technically incorrect for unimportant historical reasons is a waste of time. Denigrating people who do use the 45LC name is way way beyond a waste of time.

1911Tuner said:

So...what if the headstamp just says ".45 Colt"?

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Or the barrel for that matter .... although the "CAL." is redundant as far as I'm concerned. I don't care if someone refers to the .45 Colt as .45 Long Colt ... at least they're making an effort to refer to the cartridge rather than the caliber.

Remo, to avoid wasting any more of your time, I'll make it simple: You're wrong, deal with it.

"45 colt" is ambiguous.

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Wrong! The official name of the cartridge in question, the name registered at SAAMI, is ".45Colt". Not .45 Long Colt. Colt never called it the ".45 Long Colt". There was a .38 Short and Long Colt. A .380 Short and Long. A .41Short and Long. Never a .45 Short and Long. The official name has always been .45Colt. Every loading manual. Every box of ammo. Most cartridge case headstamps. Every firearm. All marked ".45 Colt". Not "LC" or "Long Colt". It is simply an unofficial, completely unnecessary nickname. It was used originally to differentiate it from the .45S&W and .45Gov't. The S&W has another name and therefore the "Long" is unnecessary. The Gov't is loooooong obsolete and therefore the Long is unnecessary. The .45ACP or .45Auto is another cartridge entirely with another name entirely so therefore the "Long" is unnecessary.

Denigrating people who do use the 45LC name is way way beyond a waste of time.

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Nobody's denigrating anybody....except you. Incorrect terminology is simply being corrected. We're all adults here, I think we can survive it. Personally, I like to know when I'm doing something wrong.

...for unimportant historical reasons is a waste of time.

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In the world of firearms, we deal in thousandths of an inch. Relatively tiny details are everything. Now we know why you're such a good source of misinformation. Because you deem anything and everything beyond your realm of understanding as a "waste of time".

I think my head exploded....

Elmer Keith said "Anybody who objects to calling it the .45 Long Colt has not seen the short cased smokeless .45 that Remington turned out in quantity before WW I."

The problem is not that there is no system of caliber and cartridge designations, it is that there are several and you have to know what you are looking at. Plus the many exceptions to the rules. You just have to do a lot of memorizing and keep a copy of CotW handy.

If you want to know why the numbers look strange to the Digital Generation, you have to know the history.

"Personally, I like to know when I'm doing something wrong. "

you got one helluva schnoz

The main Memphis gun store on Summer Ave. has "7.62mm" Winchester again, in the white box and at a good price.

It does not say 7.62 NATO, or anything that indicates NATO, but the designation is "Q 3130".
The tiny encircled cross headstamp means that it is NATO, because I started a thread about this and that was one response.

Is Winchester's vague box label meant to be ambiguous: a legal requirement when they produce military spec ammo for the civilian market?

you got one helluva schnoz

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I love getting into a discussion about shooting terminology, bringing cold hard facts to the table and getting called a liar for my trouble.

Ehh, back when I was a kid, there was the .45 Colt and the .45 automatic. Hoppy used a .45 Colt. In more recent times, that is, the last 30 or so years, this "Long Colt" thing became common for some people, just to make it more clear that it was the revolver cartridge and not the one for the 1911. Lotsa newbies were showing up back then. I kinda tie it to the rise in IPSC popularity, as more people got into the combat handgun deal with 1911s and discovered ".45ACP".

It ain't worth worrying about.