M1A

^ Just one question: What is an M1a? Is it a Garand, the Carbine, or something different?

Edit: The M1A is a civilian version of the M14, made by Springfield Armory.


Depends. What do you want?

If you want a rifle to use for a little bit of everything, both ranged and close in quick acquisition, get the standard.

If you want more precision sights that might help you aim a bit better at range, and a few other goodies, get the loaded.

If you want the best accuracy, get the national match. Be advised, that stock in the national match is bedded to the action, and accuracy will decrease as the stock is removed for full cleaning. It will also be a very tight fit.

Personally, I chose a standard over a loaded, because I could acquire the sights faster, and the gun has the same accuracy either way, you just need to do your part.

I can get close to 1 MOA off rest with non premium commercial ammo at 100 yards with mine. I am sure handloads, premium commercial, and more range time would close that up.

I like the synthetic stock on my standard, the plastic handguard goes well with it. I dislike the plastic handguard with the wood stocks, although I do like the M1 Garand's all wooden stocks.

I am satisfied with my standard, and it is my favorite rifle, of about 10.

For all the M1a info you need http://m14forum.com/. Also check the classifieds for M1as

I think it is worth it.

The loaded model has a medium target barrel, NM front sight and tuned trigger. The NM has a larger stock and a heavier barrel. Generally they get 2.5 moa for standard, 1.5 for loaded and moa for NM. (your results may vary)

hawmanai said:

For all the M1a info you need http://m14forum.com/. Also check the classifieds for M1as

I think it is worth it.

The loaded model has a medium target barrel, NM front sight and tuned trigger. The NM has a larger stock and a heavier barrel. Generally they get 2.5 moa for standard, 1.5 for loaded and moa for NM. (your results may vary)

Click to expand...

This has been my experience also. I think the loaded is the best value, NM barrel, narrow front sight blade, 4.5lb trigger.

Everything you need to know about the M1A/M14. Great how-to's on NM prep.
http://www.m14tfl.com/upload/

I have owned a Springfield NM M1A for several years now and mine will shoot under 1'' if I do my part. My rifle is scoped with a SA third generation mount and a Nikon 3-10X scope. However one disadvantage of the NM rifle is it's damn heavy wood stock. Keep that it mind if you plan on buying a Springfield Armory M1A.

I can get close to 1 MOA off rest with non premium commercial ammo at 100 yards with mine. I am sure handloads, premium commercial, and more range time would close that up.

Click to expand...

One of the big problems with putting accuracy claims into perspective is we have to consider repeatability and the number of shots measured. Box-stock, my standard would regularly put 3 shots into an inch at 100 yards. I wouldn't call that a 1MOA shooter though. Also is stock form, it would regularly put 10 shots (of it's preferred commercial load) into 2MOA, and statistically speaking that is a much more realistic meaurement of the rifle's accuracy.

I'm skeptical that any Springfield Standard will put 10 shots into an inch at 100 yards. If such a rifle exists, and yours is the one, then it is a rare bird. After some modifications, I've managed to get consistent 10-shot groups measuring 1.5MOA, but I don't believe it is reasonable to expect that kind of accuracy out of a box-stock Standard rifle. Most people have found that their Standards are anywhere from 2MOA to 4MOA, using 10-shots as a measuring standard and using ammo that the rifle likes.

I prefer the standard M1A. Yes the wood stock is heavy but I sold the replacement plastic stock it came with and use the wood stock. Whichever you get you will not be disappointed if you are looking for a sturdy rifle you will love to shoot.

The M1A is a civilian version of the M14 made by Springfield Armory INC. (SAI)

http://www.springfield-armory.com/

The original government run Springfield Armory built actual M14 service rifles for our nation's military.

Springfield Armory Inc. and Springfield Armory are NOT the same thing by a long shot.

Just wanted to clarify this.

FWIW....... My M1A-A1 Bush (rifle at top in following pic) will consistently put 3rds of FED 168gr OTM at a 1.5inch spread at 100yrds.


The other one shoots a tad better, but it's not an SAI M1A...so doesn't pertain to your question.
Note: Both sport synthetic M14 service rifle stocks. The M1A-A1 pictured above weighs out at 8.3lbs as pictured, minus the mag.
Note: The M1A-A1 also sports a std rear sight aperture, and NM (0.062) front sight post. This combination works well with the 18in bbl's sight radius of 22.75 inches.

Here is how I view the various models of M1A and their best suited applications...so to speak. ( Based on personal experience with all of them, as well as personal preference)

* Socom/Scout/Standard
General purpose rifle, and makes for a decent medium game hunting rifle, and well suited for a defensive weapon, depending on the nut behind the butt..
They are lighter in weight compared to the other models because they sport std weight tubes and do not sport bedded stocks.


* National Match/Super Match/ M25 Whitefeather
Best suited for use at the range and ...well...... matches.
NM = medium weight tube, while the others sport heavy weights.
Note: The Whitefeather is specifically set up for optics.
For all out precision, the Super Match and M25 lead the pack.

* M1A Loaded sort of "splits the difference" between the std and the NM. Medium weight bbl.

Be advised that SAI is not the only company producing M14 types nowadays..

LRB Arms
762MM Firearms
Fulton Armory

The above companies build complete rifles.

M14TFL is an excellent source of information regarding this type of rifle.


Good luck with your decision.


11B

I forgot to mention this, so......

The M1A-A1 Bush rifle is no longer offered by SAI, but the Scout Squad model is very close to the same thing. You get a muzzle brake instead of a flash hider, and a "Scout mount" along with a cutout in the hand guard that allows the mount to protrude through it...vs the Bush rifle's std hand guard.

Both can be had in either wood or synthetic stocks, and both sport the same length std weight 18in non chrome lined bbl.

Barrel twist rate = 1/11in , but some of the thicker tubes sport 1/10in, depending on what bbl your looking at.

11B

Out of the current SAI offerings, if you are planning to do some practical, non-competitive, out in the woods and fields shooting, then I would go for the Loaded for a full length version and the Scout for a shortened version.

The reason I say the Loaded is because it only has the accuracy improving features of the NM that you would want in a woods/field rifle, and not the ones that would help on the firing line, but be a hindrance elsewhere. What I mean by that is this:

• The heavy contour bbl makes the NM unbalanced, and heavy towards the front. Some shooters put lead in the butt stock compartment to balance it back out (as well as reduce recoil), but then your already heavy rifle is even heavier.
• The hooded rear aperture is awesome in good light, but it makes the image darker than the standard rear aperture, and therefore your sight picture and ability to pick up the front sight is greatly diminished in poorer lighting.
• The bedding is a great accuracy improver, but if the rifle will be a "utility" rifle, then it will get dirty, and wet, and the receiver taken out of the stock to be cleaned/dried. You don't want to do this to a bedded rifle.

The things that come on the Loaded that make it a better choice than the Standard IMO:

• Thinner front sight post makes distance shooting easier.
• Better rear sight adjustment than on the Standard.
• Comes with the same trigger group as the NM
• Medium contour bbl is a good compromise between the accuracy of the heavy bbl, and the weight/balance of the standard bbl.

Now that I've said all that, if it's for target use only, get the NM or SM. Also, although I like the Loaded, I have to admit the Standard balances a little better due to the std bbl contour.

For a shorty:

I'm not a big fan of the SOCOMs. The irons aren't great for distance shooting, and the rails add (IMO) unnecessary weight, and last I heard, are not milspec M1913 rails anyway. Seems I recall some folks' accessories not mounting properly. They may have changed that though. Also, I believe the gas system is different in order to make it cycle properly with the shorter bbl. I'm not big on that.

I would go with the Scout for those reasons.

HTH.

Jason

What do you want to do with it? Do you care more about light weight, or the best possible accuracy? The barrels in the Loaded and NM definitely add weight.

Personally, I don't care for any of the current SAI offerings because they don't offer the option of a chrome lined barrel with any of their models. This was standard on military M-14s and greatly improves barrel life, corrosion resistance, and reliability of cycling. For a true battle rifle, those things are pretty important.

If I were in the market for an M-14 type rifle, I would be looking for an older M1A with GI parts; a new rifle from 7.62mm Firearms, LRB, Smith, or Fulton; or a Chinese Norinco or Polytech.

My standard M1A ,scoped off bench on a very good day has put 10 rds in 1 5/8 inch group with Surplus German MEN Ammo

Nice shooting Orlando. My rifles love that German surplus too. I would like to stash about 5k rounds.

Same here regarding MEN. Very consistent milsurp ammo imo.

Great shooting Orlando.

That std of yours is defiantly a keeper

11B

My standard shoots like Orlando's. My National Match rifle shoots one ragged hole at 100 yds about the size of a quarter. I was surprised how accurate the standard was and trigger is fine. I put it in a fulton armory USGI contour stock that I finished myself and its sweet

Bought an M1A National Match. From the very begining it would not group with a variety of ammo. A shooter at the range used headspace gauges in it and found it would accept a "go", "no go", and "field" gauges even though the paper work it came with was certified by a technician to be within specs. I sent it back. Upon return there was a target enclosed showing a very tight group supposedly fired at 100 yards with Federal Gold Medal .308 ammo. I bought 5 boxes. Grouped as before, all over target. Bought gauges. Still accepts all three sizes. Upon last firing a case head ripped off and the body stuck in chamber. Can't get it out by using a variety of methods including two different designs of broken case extractors. Any suggestions or comments here?

Bought an M1A National Match. From the very begining it would not group with a variety of ammo. A shooter at the range used headspace gauges in it and found it would accept a "go", "no go", and "field" gauges even though the paper work it came with was certified by a technician to be within specs. I sent it back. Upon return there was a target enclosed showing a very tight group supposedly fired at 100 yards with Federal Gold Medal .308 ammo. I bought 5 boxes. Grouped as before, all over target. Bought gauges. Still accepts all three sizes. Upon last firing a case head ripped off and the body stuck in chamber. Can't get it out by using a variety of methods including two different designs of broken case extractors. Any suggestions or comments here?

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Tell SAI what you said here.

Jason

MSgtUSMC said:

Bought an M1A National Match. From the very begining it would not group with a variety of ammo. A shooter at the range used headspace gauges in it and found it would accept a "go", "no go", and "field" gauges even though the paper work it came with was certified by a technician to be within specs. I sent it back. Upon return there was a target enclosed showing a very tight group supposedly fired at 100 yards with Federal Gold Medal .308 ammo. I bought 5 boxes. Grouped as before, all over target. Bought gauges. Still accepts all three sizes. Upon last firing a case head ripped off and the body stuck in chamber. Can't get it out by using a variety of methods including two different designs of broken case extractors. Any suggestions or comments here?

Click to expand...

Call SAI customer service. They should take care of this. The gauges you used, .308 or 7.62? There is a very slight difference in maximum head space between the two rounds. The bolt should not have closed on either .308/7.62 field gauge, that's not good.

SAI should send you a prepaid shipping box if you need one. They have had fast turn around time the one time I sent a rifle in for a new recall bolt.

I have a top-of-the-line SA NM M1A, as marketed circa mid 80's.

No glass bedding, but decent trigger, a heavy barrel, wood furniture, NM sights, and its too dang heavy to lug around. It needs a modified grocery cart to tote the load.

Sights aren't distinct, except out of doors. Thats with the sun just right, and me wearing a floppy hat.

Std GI issue configuration would have suited me much better. If I got it right, a 3 MOA rifle/ammunition combination, its going to print about 1.5" from point of aim at 100.

That isn't exactly awful.

I am trying to convince one of my sons to buy a std 80s SA and swap with me for the 80s NM.

salty

If you want a semi .308 before you buy the M1A you owe it to yourself to take a look at the FNH AR heavy fluted barrel, 20 rounder, 20 inch barrel...


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