Ok... maybe I need to get back to the drawing board on rifle buying

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Rmeju

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About me: I'm not a new shooter, but I'm new to bolt guns. I reload (a lot) and I'm not at all worried about cost of ammunition or my ability to work up a load. My club has a 1000 yard range. I want to use this gun mostly for target shooting, but I may use it occasionally for hunting, and whether or not I "need" it for target shooting, I just want to get a caliber that retains its punch at distance. I don't much care about recoil, even in magnum calibers. I am not considering any ultra mag calibers.

Originally I figured I'd pick up a Rem 700 (XCR Tact, 5R, Sendero, etc.) in 300 WM. I figured Rem 700 variant because it's "the standard" (which is nice since there's lots of confusing choices) and 300 WM because I have a friend who started working with it in the army and really likes it over the 308. After looking through these boards though, I thought maybe I should take a step back and ask more questions.

Some here appear to find 300 WM less accurate (not to say it's inaccurate) than other choices at 0-1000 yards, and wears the barrel out much more quickly than other calibers. 300 WM might outdo other calibers at ranges over 1000, but I won't be doing that, so maybe I don't need a 300. I hear 300 WSM or various 7mm's (among others) might do me right. Also, Remington seems to have mixed reviews, and other manufacturers (particularly Savage) might be just as good for less money.

I know a lot of this is subjective, and I'm probably opening a can of worms asking about good caliber and rifle choices, but given my interests, what would you High-Roaders suggest?
 
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Don't have one but a friend of mine who is shooting 338 Lapua says it will reach out there and touch something at 1000 yards. Reloading could keep the cost of this otherwise expensive ammon within reason.
 
300 WM is great if you need to knock something down 1000yd away. it's a horrible caliber to learn on though and it's not good for target shooting. if you want to occasionally shoot something like an elk or a couple targets, then it's great. if you're going to go shoot a 3x1000 NRA match, your scores will probably drift lower and lower as the day goes on.

the caliber is not inherently accurate or inaccurate. that depends on your gunsmith, and getting quality ammo.

if i just wanted a target gun, i'd go with a zippy 6mm cartridge. but since you do want some energy, i'd go 6.5mm.
 
I'll weigh in on the Remington 700 question. You have to look at it like this, off the shelf Remington, Savage, Winchester and Weatherby are all going to be hunting rifle accurate. It's when you start looking for upgrades that the 700 shines. If you plan to leave your rifle stock than any other of the shelf rifle will be okay. However, 700's give you every option imaginable. Depends on how much money you want to sink into them.
 
I'll add to that, Milliradian, that if you just want to leave your rifle stock, you should buy a Savage, as they're the most accurate out of the box and will shoot sub-MOA stock. But if you plan to upgrade it extensively, the 700 has the most options. That being said, people are now taking note of Savage and there seems to be more options available nowadays for them.

How does 7mm Rem. Mag stack up at those ranges? That might be another option.
 
Does 7mm Rem Mag or 300 WSM seem like it would fit the bill? Both? Either? Neither?
 
Have you considered calibers like .30-06 and .308? You say you want a caliber that retains its punch at distance. At what distance though? 1000 yards? Those calibers will still pack a punch at 1k.
 
I have considered 30-06. I am not interested in .308 (it's a great caliber, I'm just working up loads with it on a different gun). I already have 30-06 dies, etc. I also have a lot of .308 bullets lying around, so any of the 30 cals are a plus for that reason alone.

How does 30-06 stack up accuracy wise to 300WSM and 7mm RM?
 
Calibers are not accurate or inaccurate. Accuracy is a function of the individual rifle and ammo.
 
.270 WSM - It has the same energy at 1000 yards as a 7mag, with less drift and less drop. It actually has less drift and drop than a 300 Win Mag, but about 10 % less energy at 1000 yards. It still has 736 ft/pounds @ 1000 yards. Recoil would be about 30% less than a 300 win mag and about 15% less than a 7mag.

The above figures are using the Nosler Accubond bullets as loaded by Federal.
 
Rmeju, could you give us a clear picture of your specific purpose (90% paper at XXX yds., less than XX lbs., etc.), your accuracy goals, whether you intend to upgrade and something of a budget guideline for the rifle alone?
 
You are right, you absolutely opened with a subjective question, but a healthy discussion is always fun to read and learn from.
Any of the calibers mentioned will reach out to 1000 yards. a 300WM will probably burn out a barrel faster than the others mentioned. For my money i'd probably chose the 300wsm as it has a fine reputation for accuracy and I'd chose it on a savage action. Mostly because I have a savage rifle and I love the action and trigger, and i've heard some negative things about remington lately on the boards.
300wsm gives you the .30 cal which you say you have bullets for already, it provides almost as much punch as the 300WM a bit more efficiently, and doesn't have the reputation for barrel wear that it's bigger brother does. it'll also serve you quite well as a hunting round also.
Good luck and have fun in the decision
 
@ Skylerbone: ~90% target shooting is about right. I have a slight preference for heavier weight for recoil purposes, and I don't mind lugging around a heavier gun for the times I might hunt.

Assuming I'd be doing my part on the bench at home and on the firing line, I'd want to definitely be under 1 MOA. I don't know how much under 1 MOA is realistic, based on the rifle (and assuming proper handloads).

To give you an idea of my rifle budget, I was looking at Rem 700s (XCR Tact, 5R, and Sendero II SF) but those models don't seem available in the calibers I'm looking at. I was also looking at this 300 WSM Savage or this 7mm RM Savage, but I don't know how much better/worse it is than those Remmy models.

Honestly, I don't know what upgrades I might do down the line. I'll probably keep it stock for a little while and see what it does before I get into any of that, unless there are some "no-brainer" upgrades that anybody would want for this kind of rifle.

Any thoughts?
 
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Here's a bit of light reading that may help you determine which caliber will work best for your usage and why. Many of those listed will require some additional reloading effort on your part to be practical price wise to shoot but may point you toward other more popular chamberings with similar performance. http://www.eabco.com/Reports/report03.html
 
The Savages are honestly better rifles out of the box. You'd have to put a few hundred dollars into a Remington to get it to the point where a Savage is bone stock, and the Savage is usually cheaper to begin with. Chances are you won't have to change anything on the Savage to get it to where you want it. I'd say go for something in 7mm and invest in a nice recoil pad; you'll need it.
 
Hard to beat the BC of the 6.5mm family.

.260 Remington is hard to beat. Less recoil than .308, and 6.5 bullets have been killing game for years in the 6.5x55.
 
Or a 6.5-06, if you are up for forming brass, or 6.5-284 you are up for paying Norma prices. :D

For long distance shooting, and forgive me, Taliv, if I'm speaking out of turn here, but from what I've read and learned from speaking with those who do it, it's the barrel, the trigger, and the scope that you have to worry about. The stock is for fitting the rifle to the shooter, the barrel for precision, the scope for seeing what you're trying to hit, and the trigger for releasing the round cleanly.

Caliber is nearly irrelevant. You can shoot very precisely with nearly any cartridge, if the rifle is built well - compare a Finn M39 Mosin to most of the Russian built ones. The Finn is better built, has a better barrel and trigger, more ergonomic stock, and has the potential to be much more accurate. You pick a caliber that has the ballistics to stay supersonic out to the range you want to shoot at, buy a good barrel, build your rifle with a good trigger and stock, mount a good scope, learn the cartridge's ballistics and go shooting.
 
I gotta ask, what range do you want do your hunting at?
If you want to punch paper at a grand but arent going to hunt any more than 400 yards, 6.5x55 or a 260 rem?
 
DRYHUMOR said:
Hard to beat the BC of the 6.5mm family.

.260 Remington is hard to beat. Less recoil than .308, and 6.5 bullets have been killing game for years in the 6.5x55.
Click to expand...
The 6.5x55mm has been used and are proven killers for polar bears by Scandinavian Arctic explorers.
 
Rmeju;

Considering your desire to accurately paper-punch at extended ranges, t'were I you, I'd start making contact with the bench rest guys in your neighborhood. Attend a couple of matches, talk to the shooters, see what is in general working for them. For that matter, it's not a fantasy to run across someone willing to sell a bench gun with target proof of accuracy at a match. Guy get old & so do the eyes, and bench resters tend to be mature individuals to begin with.

And, FWIW, take a note of what actions their platforms are based on. This will change by class from pure BR actions such as Stolle & Defiance, to production based actions like the Remington. But do note what seems to work for these guys, there's a huge experience pool there if you will but be polite and interested.

900F
 
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