375 H+H vs 300 WM

[Huntolive]

What can the 375 H+H do that the 300 WM can not?
What can the 300 WM do that 375 H+H can not?

Obviously this means extensive training to get the most out of each round, so take that as a given.

Also, please provide practical (not technical) recoil/kick comparisons.

Can both (with the right trained shooter and scope) take large game at 1000 yards?

Is either better than the other under 200 yards on large game?

Do I need a caliber larger than 300 WM to hunt dangerous game in Alaska such as Brown Bear? What about African game (elephants excluded).

 

[silicosys4]

one is bigger
The other is faster.
Both can be loaded with heavy for the caliber bullets with a high BC,
At extended ranges with optimal loads the .375 will retain more energy but go subsonic a little sooner than the .300. This happens well beyond 1000 yards for both.
The .375 is more efficient if that concerns you, giving more energy on target for the amount of powder used.
Both can be used to take game at extended range, with the .300 factory loads being more suited to the task.
You don't need a larger caliber than the .300WM to hunt large brown bear, but many people prefer more, and everything I've read suggests guides usually carry larger
You can use the .375h&h to take elephants, depending on where you are at and their minimum caliber requirements. The cartridge is easily capable.
The .300WM has a reputation for destroying meat at close range.

Overall, from what I've seen the only thing a .375 can't do that the .300 can is destroy meat at close range.

Anyways, I just picked up a .375 h&h but have little experience with it, so I'm sure someone can add more

 

[jim in Anchorage]

What can the 375 H+H do that the 300 WM can not?
What can the 300 WM do that 375 H+H can not?

Obviously this means extensive training to get the most out of each round, so take that as a given.

Also, please provide practical (not technical) recoil/kick comparisons.

Can both (with the right trained shooter and scope) take large game at 1000 yards?

Is either better than the other under 200 yards on large game?

Do I need a caliber larger than 300 WM to hunt dangerous game in Alaska such as Brown Bear? What about African game (elephants excluded).

I have lived and hunted hard in Alaska for 21 years and have slowly narrowed my rifle down to one-the .300 WBY. Not Win, WBY. It is a fantistic do all AK gun.

 

[Float Pilot]

I have owned both chambering in several rifles over the years. I have hunted with both as well. I always end up selling any 300 win mag I own. I have kept a couple of the 375s. The 300 win mags have a fast and sharp recoil. The 375s recoil more like a shove. ( I also own a lightweight 375 Ruger which is not pleasant to shoot). I like pretty much all calibers and rifles so they are all an excuse to try and buy something new. You really do not need a 357 H&H for brown bears here in Alaska, but it certainly does not hurt.

 

[69Precision]

At really long ranges, the 300 has a trajectory edge. At normal ranges of less than 400 yards, the 375 shines in my opinion for grizz/brown bear. Certainly plenty have been taken with the 300 though.

 

[jmr40]

There is nothing in N America that can't be taken with a 30-06. Any of the various 300 mags do the same thing at longer ranges, a 308 at somewhat closer ranges.

The only animal in N America that a 375 is really needed for is the large 1000+ lb. bear in Alaska. While the 30-06 and 300's will take them, a 375 offers better stopping power in case things go wrong. It is also can be used for any of the largest game in Africa. Some consider it borderline for elephant, but it has certainly been used successfully.

A 375 has considerably more recoil than any 300 magnum, about 40 ft lbs vs about 30 ft lbs. Most 30-06 loads are in the 18-22 ft lb range just for reference. 12 ga slugs and buckshot are in the 30 ft lb class. The sharp jab vs shove argument is mostly between the ears of shooters. Light bullets shot fast result in the rifle recoil coming back into the shoulder faster, but not with more energy. The recoil of a 300 loaded with 150 gr bullets is faster than the recoil of a 375 with 270 gr bullets. But load some heavier 200+gr bullets in the 300 and it will slow down how fast the rifle is coming back. Some find that more comfortable.

While overkill for almost everything in NA a 375 is versatile enough to be used on all game here. If someone only wanted one rifle to hunt everything on the planet a 375 would do it. Not the approach I'd take, but it'd do it. Trajectory is similar to 30-06 out to about 400ish yards. Beyond that the better 30-06 loads shoot flatter and will even hit harder. Beyond 300 yards any of the 300's outclass the 375 in both trajectory and energy. If you want to shoot truly long range the 375 isn't a good choice, but 400-500 yards is certainly doable and far enough for most hunters.

Do I need a caliber larger than 300 WM to hunt dangerous game in Alaska such as Brown Bear? What about African game (elephants excluded).

Elephant and all African game have been taken with much smaller rifles. WD Bell took over 1100 elephant, mostly with a 7X57, but today most countries have minimum caliber requirements for dangerous game. A 300 would be a good choice on all other African game, but would not be legal in some countries for stuff that will kill you.

 

[Robert]

Can you hit a paper plate sized target at 1000y 99% of the time? Can you accurately estimate wind at that range? Unless you are extremely proficient at shooting at that range please do not try to take animals at such an absurd distance. The last thing you want to do is wound an animal and not be able to recover it. If you have already addressed this then please ignore this, I am having a hard time keeping g up with all your new threads.

I live and hunt in Colorado with a 375H&H. It is very well suited to the areas I hunt. I can regularly hit a target at 500y in a group about the size of the palm of my hand. It is an amazing round and capable of any game on the planet. I'd rather have my 375 than a 300wm or 338wm any day of the week.

 

[Predator55]

You would be handicapped with the 300 if you wanted to hunt Cape buffalo, elephant but other than that you could take any other game animal you choose.

 

[Huntolive]

Thanks Jmr40 that was very helpful, also to others thanks.

Looks like it is 300 WM for my purposes.

Jim in Anchorage, what do u like so much about the 300 WBY that makes it worth the xtra recoil and ammo cost?

IF I wanted a 375 H+H what would you recommend with reasonable price tag and good accuracy; lower recoil also a plus

 

[Dr T]

If the range were short and the game dangerous and malevolent, I would prefer to stake my life on a 375 H&H.

 

[NickEllis]

Quartering away, follow-up shot on an elk? 375H&H for penetration.

 

[Gordon]

I saw the .300 weatherby mentioned. Yes the .300 Weatherby outshines the .300 Winchester in all ways, except cheaper factory ammo.
That said the .338s carry better a extreme ranges at which you probably shouldn't be hunting that the .375s .
The .375 H&H kills way out of proportion to it's medium bore size in my opinion and as an all around big game cartridge is hard to beat tout to 500 yards.
In my opinion a well stocked 9 pound .375 H&H licks less than the same weight .300 Win mag with 200 grain or heavier bullets, it is a much sharper recoil sensation, ditto for the .338s.
I have 3 .375H&H currently and I had 6 (two Weatherby improved) , I have one .300 Weatherby (had three) and it shoots amazingly flat , but recoils more than the .375- no doubt !
All are good is you want the next jump up over the .30-06 and .308 teir which are perfectly adequate thru elk in most circumstances

 

[tdbmd]

.375 H&H is a great round. It can do anything up to the biggest dangerous game. Is it the best? Depends. If you are all about the long range shooting (and it sounds like you are), then the .375 is not the round. But at sensible distances (<400 yards) it will do anything you need. The .300 mags are great cartridges, no doubt. Not really dangerous game rounds per say, but they can do it in NA. Not legal in most places for dangerous game in Africa. Although the .375 recoils more, I find it's recoil easier to handle than the faster, sharper recoil of the .300 magnums, especially those bigger than the Winchester. But that is just my opinion. .375s are usually heavier guns than what a .300 will be, so if you are going to be carrying it up and down the mountains, keep that in mind. I have loaded down 235 grain bullets in my .375 to shoot deer and hogs in the past but usually stay with the 270 grain slugs.

 

[Flatbush Harry]

I have a wonderful Sako Bavarian in .300 WSM and a .375 H&H that I and and a wonderful local gunsmith built. Both shoot to less than 1 MOA with both high grade factory and hand-loaded ammo and both will stop anything in North America (and the .375 H&H anything on this planet). My .375 is built from a Rem 700 XCR II, glass-bedded in a B&C Weatherby configuration bedding block stock and fitted with a Timney trigger and scopes in Leupy Quick Release bases and rings for both dangerous and non-dangerous game.

The .375 H&H, which is quite manageable to shoot, will accompany me this December when I try to fill my Elk tag in Western CO. I've practiced with it extensively and know that it will get the job done if I can do my part. I can almost taste the steaks now.

Harry

 

[Deaf Smith]

A 375 offers better stopping power in case things go wrong.

And that is its reason for being in Alaska. The .300 is better for hunting, the 375 better if things go wrong.

Deaf

 

[Huntolive]

Thanks, I got my 300WM, so which 375 H+H do I Get?

Thanks, very helpful.

I got a Brown. 300 WM A-Bolt Stainless Stalker today for $500 w/ a built in BOSS in near-new condition w/ Bushnell Banner 4x12x40, box of ammo and hard case and nice sling. Couldn't turn that deal down! Has a sweet trigger, and i actually think it is the A-Bolt 2 w/ adjustable trigger.
I already took the Bushnell off and mounted Vortex Viper 3.5X10X50 which I had bought on sale and had on hand.

How do you adjust the trigger, and more importantly How and why/when do you Adjust the BOSS? My version has about a 3/4" array of wholes in the middle all the way around like a pepper box style muzzle break, and a dial on the end w/ numbers. It was factory mounted.

So I need some advice on a 375 H+H to buy. I have no idea the price range and what brands to beware of and what to seek out, other the obvious great top tier brands that I probably can't afford, since this is getting pretty far away from the "need" category even by my Broad definition But I do want dependability and accuracy w/ as reasonably low recoil as can reasonably be expected in a dragon slayer like this.

Oh by the way I PROMISE NOT to shoot it beyond 500 yards

 

[jim in Anchorage]

Thanks Jmr40 that was very helpful, also to others thanks.

Looks like it is 300 WM for my purposes.

Jim in Anchorage, what do u like so much about the 300 WBY that makes it worth the xtra recoil and ammo cost?

IF I wanted a 375 H+H what would you recommend with reasonable price tag and good accuracy; lower recoil also a plus

Ammo cost is no issue as I reload for it and I bought 250 brass at pre Obama prices.
The gun[a Rem 700] has a break and dosn't kick to bad but yes it is loud.
What really charmed me on it was the trajectory. As a life time 30-06 shooter the flat shooting just wowed me. Also I consider the 30-06 "adequate" on moose. I've killed plenty with it but never really trusted it past 200 yards
The .300 gives me just that much more steam that I never worry up to 500 yards, my limit.

 

[axxxel]

The only game animal that I would not use .300 win mag on, but that I would use .375 on, is buffalo and other large and dangerous game, specifically the african big five, for which the .375 is the minimum required caliber.

People hunt brown bears with .308, .270 and similar calibers. A .300 win mag would handle that just fine (with hard bullets on the heavy end, like a 180 gr TSX or nosler partition), although I can understand why somebody would chose the .375 over the .300 for big bear hunting.

 

[Pete D.]

300 vs. 375

beyond that the better 30-06 loads shoot flatter and will even hit harder. Beyond 300 yards any of the 300's outclass the 375 in both trajectory and energy.

Energy....I wonder about that. I just ran a number of loads through a ballistics program - using 180@3200fps/190@2900fps/200@2800fps for the .300 and 270@2700fps/300@2600fps for the .375. Relied on published data for velocity.
I could not find any .300 load that had more energy at 1000 yards than the .375.

Trajectory is something else.

 

[lemaymiami]

My brother has lived up in Alaska for many years now and every year kills a caribou or two and takes a moose as well (all the meat in his house is game meat and has been for all those years). He hunts the caribou on the tundra (long shots, usually) and the moose at pretty close quarters on timbered hillsides... His choice for a rifle? It's the 375 H&H - he has three of them that he hand loads for.... In his area (the Mat-Su valley and points north and east) the interior bears have learned to associate a rifle shot with a feeding opportunity - that's the main reason he likes the 375 -and has a lot of confidence in it. I should also note that he tries to never hunt on his own since you're a long way from any assistance most days in the field (and it's handy to have someone doing lookout while you're field dressing a kill..).

I keep inviting him to come down and fish in the Everglades with me - and he keeps asking my to come up there and hunt with him....

 

[Grumulkin]

I have a 300 Winchester Magnum, a 300 Weatherby Magnum and two 375 H&H Magnums (one rifle and one handgun). Some observations:

1. The African big five are Leopard, Lion, Cape Buffalo, Rhinocerus and Elephant. A 375 H&H Magnum is not required for Leopard and, in some countries, the cartridge used is up to the discretion of the professional hunter or game scout. Hippo is not one of the big five but a 375 H&H Magnum would be a good idea.

2. There is not a lot of difference between the 300 Win. Mag. and the 300 Weatherby. I have loads with 200 gr. Accubonds for each. The Encore in 300 Win. Mag. has a 28 inch barrel. The Blaser in 300 Weatherby has a 25.5 inch barrel and guess what? The muzzle velocity for each is about 2,850 fps.

3. Though the 375 H&H Magnum is considered adequate for the heavy members of the big five, those who don't wish to have the necessity of back up shots from their professional hunter carrying the big gun will probably want more; like a 458 Lott, etc. on the heavy ones.

4. The 375 H&H Magnum has plenty of energy for long shots. The problem is hitting what your aiming for. For long shots you would need a good range finder, an accurate rifle and a VERY good idea of bullet trajectory. The two 300 WMs make long shots a lot easier because of flatter trajectory.

5. I've heard the story of some cartridges giving a "big shove" and others having a painfully brisk recoil. I just don't get the big shove thing; if you're not recoil tolerant they're all going to bother you.

6. If you really want to cut down on recoil, a suppressor is the way to go and you have the benefit of less noise. Of course your barrel is then about a foot longer.

 

[Robert]

My 375 is a Winchester M70 Safari Express topped with a Leupold VX3 2.5-8x36 scope. Whole thing weighs about 10lbs and cost in the area of $1500 total. It's not a light rifle but if this out of shape asthmatic guy can carry it up and down mountains then anyone can.

 

[Dr T]

In light of Deaf's comment regarding stopping power, it is interesting to compare the relative momentum (Bullet Weight* Muzzle Velocity/1000) of the loads listed by Pete D. above. Relative momentum is a proxy for stopping power. As you can see from the table, the 300 WM is not in the same league as the 375.

Bullet Weight /Velocity /Relative Momentum
180 /3200 /576
190 /2900 /551
200 /2800 /560
270 /2700 /729
300 /2600 /780

 

[Huntolive]

Thanks, I got my 300WM, so which 375 H+H do I Get?

That was very helpful.

I remain tempted to and curious about getting a 375 H+H.
(glutton for punishment?)

I have Identified these possibilities, and if I can save $$$ and still have an ACCURATE and RELIABLE rifle, that would be great:
Weatherby Vangrd. Synthetic

Brown. XBLT Hunter Medalion or Stainless Stalker

Wincstr. M70 Safari Exps.

I would plan to limit my range to 400 yards (and that is AFTER lots of practice) but would still mount a scope. So how important is it to also have iron sights?
I notice many models come w/ them, and some do not. I like the idea of having good irons on a rifle like this, not sure why, cause if scope had problem, even w/ quick release, not sure a follow up shot would be quick enough on a charging Moose/Buffalo/Brown bear after removing quick release scope. Your thoughts?

Or should I quit while I'm ahead w/ the 300 WM? Hell, that's no fun
I am concerned about factory ammo prices w/ 375 HH: even Sportsman's guide the cheapest was over $50 a box! I do have the GOAL of re-loading, but havn't yet, though i have made some arraingements, and have some supplies, as I also shoot 454 Casull and lots of hunting 357 rounds.

 

[Deaf Smith]

So I need some advice on a 375 H+H to buy.

Oh by the way I PROMISE NOT to shoot it beyond 500 yards

Does not have to the THE .375 H&H.

There are others near that bore diameter that will do the same task.

.350 Remington Magnum 250 gr SP at 2,576 ft/s
.358 Norma Magnum 250 gr Bonded SP at 2,756 ft/s
.35 Whelen (handload 250 gr RN at 2,523 ft/s)
.375 Whelen (handload... 270 gr bullet at 2400 fps.)
.375 Ruger 300 gr at 2,660 ft/s

.375 H&H 300 gr SP at 2,645 ft/s

As for guns... Ruger (but in .375 Ruger, not H&H) Winchester, Remington, and Browning.)



Deaf