12 or 20 for Upland Game

[huntershooter]

By it's nature, "upland" hunting involves a lot of walking-and carrying a shotgun.
Hence my preference for a 20 ga., SXS.
Ugartechea and AYA sidelocks are favorites-the Uggie with 26" barrels for quail, the AYA with 29" for pheasant.

 

[Pete D.]

Upland

The weight of the gun is the biggest reason that 20s are often touted as a good choice for Upland hunting.
As noted, there is a lot of walking involved and the lighter the gun, the more I am able to walk comfortably.
Nowadays I hunt with one of three guns: a 12 gauge SA that weighs under six pounds (either a Winchester model 59 or a Franchi AL48) or a 16 gauge flintlock fowler that weighs just a tad more than six, despite a 42 inch barrel.
Amount of shot....assuming number six shot for the Upland, 7/8ths ounce has a nominal count of 197. One ounce has 225 and the typical 12 gauge 1 1/8th ounce has 253 nominal.
I dearly love SXSs and I own a few but none of them break the 7 1/4lb level.
Pete

 

[huntsman]

You must be a body builder!..
Seriously, I prefer a 12 to weigh about 6#-12oz, a 20 to weigh between 6# and 6#-4oz, and a 28 to weigh right at 6#

yeah a sub 7lb SXS would be a dream and I carried a 7-1/4lb 16 gauge for years but then I started hunting with an 8-1/4lb semi so 7-1/4lb felt light

 

[drcook]

my 1956 Ithaca 37 16ga weighs just a tad over 6lbs, the new one I just built gets closer to, if not over 7lbs.

Still a lot lighter than my 12's.

a late 50's Ithaca 37 20ga, while it won't handle 3" shells, is still a dream to carry, is built on its own receiver, in fact all 3 gauges of Ithacas have their own receiver size.

as long as you can shoot lead, than a 20 or 16 ga Ithaca 37 is hard to beat

 

[dak0ta]

How does the plain barrel 12ga 30'' 870 Wingmaster rate as a upland game gun? It's pretty much the workhorse of pump guns. I think I might just get the choke opened up to LM since it's the most affordable option, and there's NOTHING wrong with a 70s era Wingmaster right? It's about 7 lbs, and the plain barrel makes it balance really nicely. Plus it's silky smooth. =D

 

[PabloJ]

Hi,

I'm torn between a 12 Ga SxS or 20 Ga Ithaca 37 for upland. Which would be better for grouse and pheasants? The SxS is fixed choke Mod and IC.

Would the 12 ga using target loads destroy too much meat? And how much less shot does the 20 ga have than the 12 ga?

The 12br can be very light as in "pull apart open" French vertical gun. I believe Verney Carron still fields those. Some are chambered for 9,3x74R big game cartridge so there is no doubting strength of the design. There is no lack of ammo selection for the 12br either. There are: 2", 2.5", 2.75" game loads so amount of recoil can be controlled by wise ammo selection. The 16ga is worth two farts and 20ga just one fart.

 

[dak0ta]

What do you guys think of the venerable Winchester Model 12?

 

[PabloJ]

What do you guys think of the venerable Winchester Model 12?

The for upland game standouts are standard 16ga Model 12 and 12ga Featherweight Model 12s both coming in at about 6.5lb. With 16ga being worth just "two farts" that leaves seldom seen Featherweight Model 12. The problem is if non-tox is mandated for all upland gunning the cost of soft shot variety is $100 per 25 cartridges. That is why I chose Charles Daly Ithaca 37 12ga with choke tubes. At 6.75lb it is still light enough to be useful.

 

[huntsman]

How does the plain barrel 12ga 30'' 870 Wingmaster rate as a upland game gun? It's pretty much the workhorse of pump guns. I think I might just get the choke opened up to LM since it's the most affordable option, and there's NOTHING wrong with a 70s era Wingmaster right? It's about 7 lbs, and the plain barrel makes it balance really nicely. Plus it's silky smooth. =D

I bought a early 70's 870 wingmaster 16gauge, it was a sweet gun and at 6-3/4lb decent weight but a couple of carry issues kept me from a pump as my upland gun.

I think if you're more of a pheasant hunter or stay out of the thick stuff a pump would work but when I hunted grouse and woodcock I was hardcore and did a lot of brush busting and that sweet light pump seemed to get twigs in the action bars or snagged in the brush all the time.

 

[wolf695]

A12 is a bigger bore so more shot in a shell, but a 20 has more range. tighter patterns on a 20, but chokes can make a 12 shoot like a 20. IC (improved cyl) 0.10 than cyl, 0.00 mod.0.25/ tighter. If it was me experment with both! Have fun!

 

[dak0ta]

With regards to ammunition choice, could I just use the Remington Gun Club in 7 1/2 shot 1 1/8oz of shot at 1200 fps?

Does the upland specific ammo have any advantage over consistent trap loads?

Kent, Winchester, Federal, Remington, Fiocchi - any brand favored?

 

[TonyT]

I used the best of both worlds a Browning Double Auto Twentyweight. It is a 12 ga. 2 shot semi auto with an aluminum receiver and very light profile barrels which weighs a bit over 6 1/2 lb. unloaded.

 

[MCgunner]

20s are generally lighter and are quicker on target. That's important on flushing game. I even prefer the 20 for doves.

 

[PabloJ]

I used the best of both worlds a Browning Double Auto Twentyweight. It is a 12 ga. 2 shot semi auto with an aluminum receiver and very light profile barrels which weighs a bit over 6 1/2 lb. unloaded.

If one wants extra light alloy-framed semi-auto they can still get Browning-designed Franchi 48AL (works like old FN Auto-5).

LGS bought like new late 50s 16ga 28" Model 12 so I got chance to compare it directly to 12ga 26" Wingmaster with 'Light Contour' barrel. In handling the Remington was surprisingly close to venerable Model 12. Little extra weight gets one 12ga 3" capable VR pump with choke tubes.

 

[Pete D.]

Patterns

Q...?

but a 20 has more range. tighter patterns on a 20, but chokes can make a 12 shoot like a 20. IC (improved cyl) 0.10 than cyl, 0.00 mod.0.25/

Respectfully disagreeing here. Shot at 1200 fps from a 12 gauge is going to go just as far as shot at 1200 fps from a 20 gauge and there will be more shot in the pattern. Gauge has nothing to do with range.
Similarly chokes - though individual firearms may pattern differently - in general patterns open at the same rate per yard regardless of the gauge. Nominal rate for a FC is one inch per yard whether it be a .410 or a 12.
Pete

 

[MCgunner]

I shoot 1 ounce loads in 20 and 1 ounce loads in 12. More shot in the pattern? It's true that the 12 CAN shoot heavier loads, but dove loads tent to run 7/8 or 1 ounce in both gauges. In my experience with equal loads either gauges is as good as the other. I can knock down dove at 40 yards with either properly choked. Recoil force of the 20 tends to be lighter as it fires less powder, but that's countered by the fact that most 20s are lighter weight guns.

Six of one, half dozen of the other, really, but I like the 20 for some things, the 12 is superior for others. I've not found 3" 20 gauge steel to pattern worth a toot with steel shot. 12 gauge is my duck gauge and I love to duck hunt.

 

[CraigC]

I have a nice Fabarm 12ga double that I love and hit well with but I always wish it was a 20ga. My Merkel 28ga sees more action than anything.

 

[huntsman]

In my experience with equal loads either gauges is as good as the other

IIRC a gun scribe(Zutz or Brister maybe) claimed that equal shot size and weight fired from both a 20 and 12 the 12 would fill the pattern more evenly thus giving a better more lethal shot string, I can't remember where I read it and my books are inaccessible now to me.

 

[45crittergitter]

20, hands-down, no contest. I kill 3 times as many birds with my 20 as I ever did with any 12. In my case it may simply be due to gun size/weight/fit, as I'm a fairly small guy. But carrying a 5.5# gun sure is nice.

 

[oneounceload]

I shoot 3/4oz for both 12 and 20 for practice. The 20 gauge version seems to pattern a tad tighter, but both do the job - and for dove/quail birds, it is all you need - if in doubt look at the 28 gauge payload and success. Personally, I think the 20 gauge 3/4 load patterns better than even the venerable 28