12 States Now Considering Allowing Campus Carry

Status
Not open for further replies.

Winchester 73

member
Joined
Apr 10, 2007
Messages
1,576
Location
Miami,Florida
Push to permit guns on campus

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2008-02-14-guns-shooting_N.htm

By Marisol Bello, USA TODAY
Even before a gunman killed six people and injured more than a dozen others in a lecture hall at Northern Illinois University, a small but growing movement had been underway at universities and state legislatures to allow students, faculty and staff to carry guns on campus.
Twelve states are considering bills that would allow people with concealed-weapons permits to carry guns at public universities. The efforts were sparked by the Virginia Tech massacre last April.

Students for Concealed Carry on Campus, an Internet-based organization with 11,000 members in its Facebook group, is calling attention to the issue with a protest from April 21 to 25, a week after the one-year anniversary of the shootings at Virginia Tech on April 16.


CAMPUS HORROR: Gunman kills 6, self at Northern Illinois University

"The only way to stop a person with a gun is another person with a gun," says University of Cincinnati sophomore Michael Flitcraft, 23, a mechanical engineering major who has a license to carry guns but is prohibited by university rules from bringing one onto the campus.

So far, 1,600 students on 500 campuses have signed up on Facebook to participate in the protest by wearing empty holsters to class. W. Scott Lewis, the group's spokesman, says about 530 students from 125 campuses joined a similar protest in October.

"School is the only place I'm not allowed to carry my weapon," says Washington State University senior Kristin Guttormsen, 35, one of the group's student leaders. He carries a .40-caliber Taurus Millenium Pro handgun.

"I felt defenseless and it started to bug me, especially with all the school shootings," he says. "We're not talking about convincing people to get licenses, we're talking about people who already have their licenses. And for the most part, they are older students."

South Dakota is the latest state to join the debate. The state House approved a bill last week that overturns the policy of the state's six public universities prohibiting guns on campus. A state Senate committee voted down the bill on Monday, but efforts continue to push the bill to the full body for vote. Other bills are pending in Alabama, Arizona, Georgia, Indiana, Kentucky, Michigan, Ohio, South Carolina, Tennessee, Virginia and Washington.

"This is the piece of legislation of the year" among state lawmakers nationwide, says Kentucky Democratic Rep. Kathy Stein, who opposes it.

In her state, there is a battle over a bill that would allow a gun on campus if it is locked in a car. Stein says public universities should be allowed to set their own policies.

Kentucky's eight public universities bar guns on campus, including parking lots.

The Kentucky bill's sponsor, Democratic Rep. Robert Damron, says college campuses should be treated the same as every other place in Kentucky, where gun owners can keep firearms in their cars, regardless of whether they are on public or private property.

Only Utah allows permit holders to carry guns on the campuses of its nine public universities. Thirty-eight states and the District of Columbia prohibit guns in schools; 16 of those specifically prohibit guns in colleges and universities.

The push to allow guns on campus rankles Garrett Evans, who was shot in both legs during the Virginia Tech rampage, and Omar Samaha, whose younger sister, Reema, was killed.

"Having guns in the classroom only makes things worse," says Evans, 31. He says the Virginia Tech gunman, Seung Hui Cho, walked into his German class and began shooting so quickly that no one would have had time to shoot back.

Samaha says guns on campus are a risk in an environment where young people drink and fight and are not always able to control their emotions.

"It's kind of a crazy notion to think about," he says. "It takes us back to the Wild, Wild West."
 
"Having guns in the classroom only makes things worse," says Evans, 31. He says the Virginia Tech gunman, Seung Hui Cho, walked into his German class and began shooting so quickly that no one would have had time to shoot back.
Mr. Evans obviously didn't get killed in 2-3 seconds when the gunman appeared, so how would he not have had time? It only takes 2-3 seconds to draw and point.

Samaha says guns on campus are a risk in an environment where young people drink and fight and are not always able to control their emotions.
Older people never drink, fight, or get mad.

"It's kind of a crazy notion to think about," he says. "It takes us back to the Wild, Wild West."
Never mind that people in the "13 original colonies" were required to own guns. But then again, there haven't been movies about rough 'n tough Bostonian gunslingers to show people. Thanks for dropping the ball, Hollywood.
 
It's Time for Common Sense

It's a shame that legitimate CCW permit holders are prohibited from carrying their sidearms on campus. In my state, the University prohibits carrying on campus unless written permission is obtained from the chief of the university police. So I gave it a try. I was told by the duty officer that I could carry and he gave me a 'note' that was to be with me while on campus.
 
I carried a gun in college and no one knew it.

Whoopee.

What have you done LATELY? The group on facebook is 11,000. We've got 60,000 folks here, who COULD make a sizable difference, but no...

It's video games, 9mm vs. .45ACP, and tearing apart journalists' logic and reasoning (or lack thereof). Thing is, NONE of that furthers our cause.

Step back, open up your mind, and ask "hey, what could I spend five minutes doing today, which can help further second amendment rights across the country?"

Or you can continue to be powerless political losers, unable to ensure that your children will have even a fraction of the same rights that you're taking for granted today, much less any more...

Members: 62,850

Mostly useless.
 
I didn't know there was a bill in SC...

Too late for me, but, it would be nice if it goes though, of course.
 
MaterDei, while I can't speak for bogie, he's just venting his frustration. THR has more than 60K members. Assuming they were evenly dispersed, that's 1,200 per state. Imagine if the presidents of each state's public universities received 1,200 unique e-mails demanding CCW on campus. Imagine if the same 1,200 also e-mailed their state legislators and governors.

It'd be even better if the NRA's 4+ million members did the same thing.

Bogie's point, the way I see it, is that the bulk of the members here will bicker about 9mm vs 45, preach to the choir about how stupid a journalist is, and then say, "Hmmm, I wonder what's on TV?" It'd be nice if people took 5 or 10 minutes from their busy schedules and called, e-mailed, faxed, or wrote the decision makers.

It's frustrating.
 
I, for one, have no idea what I would say in an email to a dean/president/congressman about RKBA. I have no problem sending an email, but don't really know what to put in it. If somebody threw together a few templates, maybe that would help.
 
The NRA is estimated to have closer to 27 million members its just only 4 million keep up with their dues.
 
Quote: Whoopee.

I'll plead the 5th.

If I could do it, every day, someone else may do it too.

If someone wants to kill students, he will ignore the law; it's not hard to do.

Point of fact: the guy that was interviewed and worried that guns in the school is too dangerous, may have them all around him already and doesn't realize it.

If someone lost control of his senses and fired on students, he would be at their mercy, unless some very unusual circumstance occured.

I write my legislators if I have a displeasure, but my legislators are pretty good in this state.
 
Last edited:
Okay, Keegan...

Tell ME about why you are concerned about campus safety, or just gun free zones in general.

Me. Just one person. I'm also a relative nobody. No fancy title (I am president of my own company, but I'm also the janitor...).

All you gotta do is type the first few words, and the rest will follow.

All I sent was...

Sir, my girlfriend and I plan on taking some graduate classes at your school next fall - However, I'm concerned about our safety, after incidents like those at Virginia Tech and NIU. Does _______ have a plan in place to prevent such violence from occuring?

And I'm following up this afternoon with...

Sir, still haven't heard back from your office. Since my girlfriend and I both have concealed carry permits, issued by the state of Missouri, we're wondering if we could be adversely affected academically if we were faced with a situation where it became necessary to defend ourselves or others.

(the problem with templates is that people use them - and they get lazy, and copy them. Word for word. And they don't change a thing. And when the university gets 300 e-mails, and they're all the same, it's "just those gun nuts." NOW TYPE 3-4 LINES OF YOUR OWN!!!)

And follow up. You have to keep at it. Preaching to the choir doesn't do squat. Asking one question doesn't do squat.

62,849 to go...
 
One of the problems of schools alowing guns would be liability.
Many people own CCWs but most people don't carry liability insurance to care for the man you put a bullet into, or any collateral damage.

I would probably wager that the average gun owner doesn't have a criminal lawyer on retainer, but it would be in your best interest.

If you are a school administrator, YOU are liable for any decisions you make that are not part of the Standard Operating Proceedure (SOP) for the school.

When a shooting occurs and a student is hit by a stray bullet from the ensuing gunfight, there will be hell for the administrator to pay after the media is finished recognizing the hero of the day.
Some will compain of deafness, hit by fragments, riccochets, stray rounds, etc.

It puts him between a rock and a hard place.

If you want to talk about wasted political power, look at the truckers. They could get guns back on their trucks if they unite, but they won't.

Hardly anything in your house was never in a truck, and if they stopped driving/delivering until they were alowed to carry guns in their "home away from home" they would succeed, but they won't.
 
Dear Mr. University Guy:
In light of the recent campus shootings at Virginia Tech and Northern Ill. Univ., I have become more concerned about my own personal safety while on campus. Considering that "Gun Free Zone" policies are obviously not working, what is XYZ University doing for student safety?

I am particularly interested in proactive measures, not reactive measures. It is of little consolation that I'll receive a text message about a killer on campus after he has already hurt me.

Respectfully,
John Q Student
 
Samaha says guns on campus are a risk in an environment where young people drink and fight and are not always able to control their emotions.

Yeah??? In class???:confused: We're not talking about arming every student, only those who are of age, and meet each states criteria for CCW. This guy needs some real-world education, or else he's been drinking the Bradys kool-aid.


If you want to talk about wasted political power, look at the truckers. They could get guns back on their trucks if they unite, but they won't.


Since when is it illegal to have a gun in a truck? Some states may restrict truck carry, but no more than automobile carry if you have CCW permit.
 
In her state, there is a battle over a bill that would allow a gun on campus if it is locked in a car. Stein says public universities should be allowed to set their own policies.

I do not think that they should be to set their own policies

The state sets the standard and issues the permits and the state university's are run by state funds (meaning the tax payers). Why are the universities aloud to trump state law. We as taxpayers should demand that the universities follow state law.

Which I know in most states the law states you can not carry, so I guess that is the place to start, with the law makers.
 
I am interested in attending CSM next fall however, I am worried about the saftey of myself and others on campus. In light of the recent incidents at VT and NIU I would like to know what CSM's plan to protect its students from such shootings and other crimes.

Thanks,
William


Took all of 30 seconds. Now your turn.

DAMN IT!!
I just got another email informing me that my message didn't go through. This is the third CSM email that I have tried. This is really getting irritating.
 
Last edited:
One of the problems of schools alowing guns would be liability.

Schools care infinitely more about political correctness and liability than students' lives.

What's needed, obviously, is to take decision making out of the hands of pettifrogging school administrators. Works in Utah. It could work in the remaining 49 states just as well.
 
Dear Chancellor Carney,
I'm an Undergrad at the Missouri S&T, and will soon be given the right by our state to conceal and carry a handgun. However according to the policies of this campus, this right will be revoked once I set foot on campus.
With school shootings becoming more frequent and the incident that occurred on our campus last February 27th in mind, I was wondering what plan of action, other than a notification system, does the University have to stop a shooter on campus? The campus police would be at least five minutes away in the event of any incident. With the odds stacked very heavily in the shooter's favor, any number of unarmed students could be killed before an officer was on the scene, and long before I received a text, facebook, or email message telling me, of all things, to stay where I am or take cover. Such a message would not have helped the victims at VT.
If there is a proper channel that I must follow to be allowed to carry on campus as well, please make it known to me, as well as the student population. The public knowledge that there are students on campus legally and safely carrying a firearm may frighten a few, but will definitely dissuade a potential shooter. Thank you for your time and consideration.

My name



How's that look? If nobody objects, I'll send this to him some time soon and then probably one to my state legislator as well. I like the idea of taking action rather than talking it.
 
How's that look? If nobody objects, I'll send this to him some time soon and then probably one to my state legislator as well. I like the idea of taking action rather than talking it.

Look's good to me.Any action is better than no action as several poster's have succinctly(or perhaps more directly!) pointed out.
Go for it.
 
misternothingman:
I would like to see sentence #1 ended; "after investing ($) for (license) (training) and putting in the time for (instruction, law, safety, competence). Just what you needed to do in your state to qualify for CCW - most states differ in some way. Also, sentence #1; I would use "licensed" in place of "given the right to", and in sentence #2; "this license will be revoked". The US Constitution, and most state constitutions, recognize the Rights, which are not given. Don't mean to nit-pick, just to make the impact more convincing. Glad to see an effort to try to push ahead on this concept. :)
sailortoo
Semper Paratus, too
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top