1886 45-70 take down - Initial Impressions

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Leaky Waders

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Today we picked up our new 1886 takedown in 45-70. Within the box, one can tell by the respective literature that quite a few companies had their hand in getting this gun to the consumer - and I thank everyone of them. (Davidson's, Winchester, Miroku and last but not least Turnbull).

Upon opening the box in the gun store where it had been shipped in my name, we just heard "That is one beautiful rifle." I agree.

The takedown is operated by a lever on the distal portion of the magazine tube - one simply flips the lever and unscrews it. Next, the foreend of the rifle can be taken down by turning it 90 degrees from the reciever. (The action must be completely open - ie lever down - to turn the barrel.) It's easy.

The rifle has several markings on the semi octagon barrel that I couldn't photograph well: on the right side "1886 DELUXE LIMITED SERIES" "Made by Miroku - Japan -- Imported by BACO. Incorporated, Utah Winchester is a registered trademark of Ol in Corporation"

The left side has "WINCHESTER Model 1886 Deluxe Takedown -- Caliber 45-70 Govt. ONLY"

This rifle was one of the lot that Turnbull made in a run prior to ordering 4 July this year. It features Turnbull case hardening blueing and traditional safety - half-cock, with no rebounding hammer. The area where the safety button used to be had been welded by their master welder and "Turnbull 1886" is tastefully engraved on the tang.

I became enamored with the 45-70 due to a future buffalo hunt that I may be going on in a year or two. Reloading the 45-70 seemed fun compared to my current set-up, and Hickok45's youtube videos as well as the threads in the reloading and hunting section just got me fired up to get something chambered in 45-70. So after looking at various platforms i decided on an 1886. It was just serendipity that Turnbull offered a nice package during the time I was shopping.

After several e-mails and a couple of phone calls to their representative, i pulled the trigger and, thus far, am very happy.

I have lots of starline brass and missouri 405 grains bullets waiting on some powder. I'll keep my loads modest to make it fun to shoot. We'll buy some factory loads to start her out on just to make sure she cycles everything well.

Here are some picture's that don't do it justice...

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Very nice, thanks for sharing the pics.

When you get into loading for the 45-70 you will find there are two paths you can take. Powder like Reloader #7 have a sharp rapport and deliver one kind of recoil to the shooter. Powders like Varget have a much lesser rapport and the recoil is notably different. Ballistics are about the same for both but the felt recoil is more tolerable with the Varget powder. For your gun with the long barrel I would suggest you investigate Varget as a possible powder choice. You might also consider the Hornady 350 grain RN and FN jacketed bullets as an alternative to the 405 grain lead bullet.
 
Gorgeous rifle and ditching the safety and rebounding hammer is a nice touch.

IMHO, the stuff you hear about crescent buttplates is exaggerated. Most folks incorrectly shoulder them like a regular shotgun or rifle butt, into the meat of the shoulder. The crescent butt should actually hook onto the top of the arm, out from the shoulder.
 
Thats a beauty!

I'll second Varget for 45-70. My favorite has to be TrailBoss though, it is just fantastic for light loads.
 
I'll be going to basspro this weekend to see what powders they have on hand - so varget and trailboss sound good. How does IMR 4198 or IMR 4895 compare to those? They seem to show up in a lot of 45-70 recipe's. I'm just looking at several powders to choose from due to some powders may be out of stock when we get there.

I don't want real punishing loads - just modest hunting loads so I can get my ranges down for hunting shots via some long range plinking at stumps and other targets.

The barrel is 26 inches. It's one pretty gun. I hope it shoots 1/2 as good as it looks.
 
Congratulations on a great looking rifle. I have a Browning 1886, and have a Browning Model 71 on the way.
 
4198 and RL7 are very similar.

I like 4198 for my heavier (not warm or heavy) cast bullet loads as I get nice obturation and accuracy. ie: 45.0gr with RCBS 300grFNGC (@ 318gr and bhn of 16) for 1,900fps. Very nice working load from my Marlin 1895GG.

H4895, Varget, and IMR4064 are very close, with IMR3031 working very well, but is splitting the difference between the two groupings above.

H322 is similar to IMR3031 and superlative in the .45/70.

You've got a lifetime of loading opportunities ahead of you with the .45/70.

I also very, very much like Alliant #2400. For very good plinking, all around loads try 25.0gr with the 400gr cast slugs and 30.0gr with the 300gr cast slugs.

Not to mention Unique, Universal, BlueDot (quite good in the 'Gov't), and of course IMR4759 (not 4756) and AA-5744.
 
Beautiful rifle! I have the same rifle but without Turnbull's magic touch. I think my rifle is gorgeous, but yours is even nicer, especially with the case coloring. I love shooting it, it is quite accurate. I load 34 gr of H4198 and Remington SP 405 gr. That load gives me 1440 fps (using chrono.) . From what I've read, the modern 1886's are quite a strong rifle and should be able to take quite a stout load. I'd like to think that they'd hold their value as well. Have fun with it!
 
Thanks for the compliments and relaoding advice! She's a really exciting addition. My wife was like...that would go good with bluejeans :)

I got my lee dies today and only lack powder now. I do have about one pund of universal and 4 lbs of h335. The h335 recipes I've seen are for lighter bullets. I haven't seen any universal recipe, but have seen some unique.

I'll print this thread before I go to the store and powder up.
 
OK, back from Bass Pro...I bought a box of winchester 300 grain jacketed hollow points and 2 lbs of H4198.

I already have quite a few 405 grain Missouri Bullet buffalo #1 and starline brass.

So I figured I'd load some up, run about 10 rounds of factory through her and then see what my loads do.

What velocity should one strive for? Like it seems the trapdoor rifles shoot 1400-1600 fps and they used to kill buffalo just fine.

So, can't one just use trapdoor loadings in a model 1886 and have a good hunting load?

PS JohnnyB, thanks I like the rifle! I had seen some on cabelas new in box without the turnbull touch that were actually a few hundred dollars more than the rifle I got - they have the new safety features. I have an 1895 in 30'06 with those same features and it's not really a big deal. But, when I saw what turnbull was doing to them...making them more original in function and nice looking to boot I couldnt resist.
 
OK...we finally shot the rifle today - very informal plinking.

The first shots were with Remington Express 405 gr SP R4570G. At 30 yards my first shot nailed the mountain dew can that I was aiming for. A Dr Pepper and Pepsi can follwed next. The rifle was emptied into a section of old railroad tie that we had to keep propping up with a 2x4. The rounds penetrated completely, but the wood was pretty decrepid so I wouldn't count that as a penetration test.

Next, my 98 lbs 14 year old shot it with the same factory ammo. He did good, and only had problems cycling the action from the shoulder, he had to bring it down to cycle it.

After that, I shot my homebrew loads based upon some recommendations in this thread and others...405 grain buffalo #1 with 34.5 grains H4198 and winchester large rifle primers. It did have a little more recoil but nothing wicked bad. After 30 or so rounds and a splintered railroad tie we called it a day with the big guns and finished up .22's.

Overall I'm very satisfied with the Turnbull 1886 - it seems to shoot as good as it looks. Now if a stray buffalo roams into our yard, I'm ready!
 
I doubt you're interested in high octane loads....so I won't offer any loads, but H322 was mentioned above.

For high octane loads in 45-70 (405 grain cast bullets @ 1,900 fps) it is an AWESOME powder...accurate, consistent, permits high load density.

But it likes to be at least lightly compressed...when you use it with less than full loads, accuracy suffers, and consistency goes to crap (high ES numbers)

That said...you may like it with 300 grain bullets (still warm, but less recoil)
 
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You can take that 405gr cast bullet, drive it anywhere north of 1200fps and it will fully penetrate any deer that ever lived from any angle. Just get your velocity up to where you can live with the trajectory and recoil.
 
I have had one of those 5-6 years now, not as pretty, not case hardened .

The crescent buttplate is fine for stand up shooting, just don't try it from a bench especially leaning into it. It will plain hurt.

Otherwise a great rifle, a bit heavy to carry, but that helps shooting.
 
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