Its taken me approximately two years of tinkering with this 1887 Winchester shotgun, to work out issues with the shotgun itself, and develop the shot shell load to consistently knock down clays. I feel like I finally have it where I want it. I put together this video to document the changes I've made, along with a range trip to show its performance. Hope you enjoy!
1887 Winchester, Lever Action Shotgun.
- Thread starter Littlef
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Dark Skies
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That is really great that you got that lever gun up and running, congrats on that. Just curious tho about the range you shoot at, since when do range officers have any say about the type of hulls you run through a shotgun? You must have some real Nazis there. I too have some range officers at a publicity funded range that are outta control and need to be reminded that our tax dollars and licence fees support their jobs. Quick note, black powder has never melted a plastic wad in my guns, I shoot a Damascus Parker double and a percussion double using plasic wads and never had a problem. There are guys here that claim it will make a huge mess of melted plastic, I have never seen it. You might try plastic cups and see what happens.
hawg
Member
Thanks!! I'm shooting at a range in the middle of a state park, with hiking and biking trails all around. In addition, the park is surrounded by neighborhoods. So, they have to be extra careful, and make sure nothing is going outside of the designated areas. It was weird, I've been a member there for several years. I had been shooting that black powder shotgun for about a year with no issues, and then one day, the range officers freaked out, and were accusing me of shooting Buck shot or slugs. Black powder sounds different, and its low register carries the sound. It got to be that every time I would bring it, I would be stopped and interrogated 3 to 4 times. They would re-check all my ammo multiple times, and interrogate me on how I can re-load my own ammunition? (which is just bizarre.) They were always confused by the solid brass shot shells. A couple of times they made me stop until they got a manager to drive down, look at it, and inspect my ammo. Then, I was questioned on how could they know if I was lying, and labeled them as birdshot shot, but really put slugs in them. I got into a yelling match a couple times when they accused me of lying. The RSO's on the trap side all now know me, and know I shoot black powder regularly, so its gotten a lot better.
Regarding the plastic, I've heard enough anecdotes about melted plastic, and I've seen photos posted of people cleaning bits of melted plastic out of a pitted barrel. I think if its a clean polished barrel, anything that melts will scrub right out. If its pitted, then the plastic has a place to mechanically bond. Its not worth it to me to run plastic in it.
yep, I started by cutting plastic hulls and roll crimping them. The ends were always melted. Since I acquired some solid brass hulls, that's all I use in my black powder shotguns.
Thank you very much. It was just a matter of trial and error. I've had a ton of missed clays in the beginning, lol.
hawg
Member
I roll crimp mine too but it's not just the ends that melt. They have beads of melted plastic all the way through.
Wow, that's impressive. I'm glad I switched to the solid brass hulls. That complete eliminated the plastic issues. Just a quick bead of waterglass to seal the shot card, and its done. ...And I just think they look really cool.
ShotgunDave
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Sounds like a terrible place to have to shoot at. The range staff could easily pick one of your shells at random and crack it open to verify your loads. Instead of acting like complete asshats.
I use brass shells for all my black powder shotgun shooting. I have used felt wads and plastic shot cups and wads in them. After a prolonged outing with the plastic wads, there is a "bore snake" in each barrel. It's just the plastic that accumulates on the barrel walls. A good soak with water/Ballistol mix and it comes right out in one long piece. Hence the bore snake reference.
Patocazador
Member
Thats kinda scary. Looks like they welded a plate on the side to add some strength. That would make me very nervous. Cool photo!
hawg
Member
And reduced it to a single shot. I wonder how the forearm is attached.
Patocazador
Member
The local I was assigned to had one of his eyes missing because he made a homemade shotgun that blew up when he fired it. He described the gun and it reminded me of a big zip gun.
Glad you're able to clean the plastic out without too much issue.
I was really frustrated and angry at the range at the time. I talked to a few of the RSO's that I knew pretty well that work on the pistol and rifle range side. The RSO that was on the shotgun side that was giving me grief seemed to disappear after that conversation. Maybe just coincidence, but I'm glad I don't have to deal with him. I think they got the message to not hassle me. The last few times I brought the black powder out, I let the RSO know up front, and they responded, "yea, we know who you are." So there have been conversations about it, behind the scenes. Hopefully those troubles are all behind me.
tachelberry
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I have acquire three Winchester 1887's. Two shooters and one parts gun. I did manage to purchase some of the Magtech brass hulls before they became unattainable. Prior to the brass hulls I was using Federal gold metal paper hulls. I would cut these down and roll crimp. In my 1887's the brass hulls seem to feed the best. I like your idea of creating the paper shot cups. I will give this a try. The gun below is a gun I paid $350 dollars for 2 years ago. It was in parts and missing the hammer spring. Lucky for me I was able to fit the hammer spring from my parts gun. I likely have 200 rounds or more through it and It seems to shoot great. I have even managed to bump off a few early season pheasants with it. They are a lot of fun. I have learned to pay heed to the stiff pull bob hammers as they can slip from under your thumb especially when its cold outside.
very nice! I couldn't ever find paper hulls, so I started off just reusing plastic hulls. Some roll crimp better than others.
If you try to make your own shot cups, I took a 3/4" wood dowel, and sanded it down a bit until it fits in the shot shell, and then tune it till you can use it to insert the shot cup into the hull. Use the dowel as a pattern for the cups. Mark a line on the dowel so you make them a consistent height. I bought a package of glue sticks to glue the shot cups. That was the least messy way I could think of. I folded the bottom in 4 corners, like you'd fold a roll of coins. Its best to make the cup height so its flush with the birdshot. When the glue has dried, cut three or four slits, 3/4 down the walls. I found if you use waterglass to seal the shot card, if the paper cup rim sits proud of the shot, it can get "glued" to the card. The slits will ensure it tears apart and separates when it exits the barrel.
If you try to make your own shot cups, I took a 3/4" wood dowel, and sanded it down a bit until it fits in the shot shell, and then tune it till you can use it to insert the shot cup into the hull. Use the dowel as a pattern for the cups. Mark a line on the dowel so you make them a consistent height. I bought a package of glue sticks to glue the shot cups. That was the least messy way I could think of. I folded the bottom in 4 corners, like you'd fold a roll of coins. Its best to make the cup height so its flush with the birdshot. When the glue has dried, cut three or four slits, 3/4 down the walls. I found if you use waterglass to seal the shot card, if the paper cup rim sits proud of the shot, it can get "glued" to the card. The slits will ensure it tears apart and separates when it exits the barrel.
tachelberry
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