1922 fn 32 cal

[pahuff1]

I have a 1922 fn in the 70000 series serial number. The pistol with 1 round or 5 rounds in the mag will only fire 1 round. The ejector, which looks great and seems to be working as it should, extracts the round from the chamber and generally pushes it straight forward again when the slide moves forward. The pistol is cocked again as the slide comes back so I know the slide is coming fully back. The spent shell has a nice, deep dimple in the primer so the striker/firing pin is doing its job. The striker is also supposed to eject the shell. But the shells don't come out the port. The gun is what might be 90 % condition.

Does anyone know or have an idea as to why this gun won't eject the empties?

Thanks
Pahuff1

 

[rattletrap1970]

Without seeing it, it's hard to say, especially with no pictures. I would hazard a guess that the extractor is not releasing the shell. This can be because the extractor has been rendered immobile by rust, debris, or any number of things. So it snaps onto the rim, but can't let go, so it just shoves the shell right back in.

 

[Onmilo]

There is an ejector stem located at the inside rear of the breechface.
This could be battered or chipped but I think the likely cause of your problem may be this,,,

Field strip your pistol and pull the striker assembly out the rear of the slide.
There should be three pieces to the striker assembly, the firing pin, the firing pin spring, and the rear cap which looks like a short nail without a point.
The stem of this cap fits into the spring with the head facing to the rear of the slide.
Sometimes folks put these caps in backwards or omit them entirely and this can cause functioning problems and misfires.

Check this first and we will go from there. hth

 

[pahuff1]

I have taken the gun apart a few times. The extractor was a little rusty looking but cleaned up very well. The striker assy itself, the firing pin, firing pin spring and firing pin follower/guide are all there and in good looking condition. The pin itself does not look broken or chipped and puts a nice rounded dimple in the primer. The firing pin itself locks back in the cocked/firing position after firing off a round. The spent shell usually says in the mouth pointing forward position, jambed up against the barrel in some fashion, but always out of the chamber. If I have more than 1 round in the magazine then the next round is jambed in ther too.

I can't tell from the parts drawings just how long the firing pin should be but it seems to stick out of the bolt face sufficiently to put a very nice hit on the primer. And I can't tell how strong the spring should be. According to Cruffler, the firing pin is the ejector so I am inclinded to think there is something wrong in this area but don't have enough info. I don't want to buy new parts and find the gun still doesn't shoot more than 1 round.

Thanks
pahuff1

 

[Onmilo]

Are you using just one brand of ammunition?
Can you reach into the breech and pull the extractor away from the breech area?
Does it spring back into position if you can?

1. the ammo may be too weak for the action.
2. the extractor may be frozen.
3. The recoil spring may need replaced. too weak, too strong, too many coils.

I assure you there is an ejector on the slide at the breech, it may be chipped, worn, or filed off on your pistol.

 

[pahuff1]

1922 fm

If you would reread my last post, I did take the extractor out and cleaned it and it seems to be working. I would be able to tell if it were frozen because it would not fall out in my hands when I pop then retaining pin out.

If you look at the Cruffler web site it states that the firing pin is the ejector. There is nothing else in the bolt face area that will contact the head of the shell. http://www.cruffler.com/historic-may01.html

There is one other item in the bolt area but it appears to be a guide only, tapered on the shell rim side as if to guide in the alignment of the shell, or centering of it. Even if the pin moved it would not contact the side of the shell.

I have only tried PMC ammo. But again the slide is driven to the rear far enough to engage the firing pin onto the sear.

 

[Onmilo]

OK, follow cruffler then, I have done all I can do for you on a website.
Good luck.

 

[Jim K]

Wow! Doesn't anyone know that the ejector on a Browing M1922 (also on the M1910 and the Colt 1908 .25 caliber) is the firing pin?

The firing pin tip is extra long and when the slide comes back, the tip pushes out of the firing pin hole and kicks the round free. Often that tip breaks off, and people who don't know any better smooth up the tip and think because the gun fires they have fixed the problem. Replace the firing pin and the ejection problem will go away.

Jim

 

[pahuff1]

Jim

thanks for the positive statement. You are the only one of many I've talked to that is so positive that it is the firing pin. I think I'll order one.
Thanks

 

[Nicodemus38]

haved you tried using EUROPEAN loaded ammo? those are generally closer to the original power levels of the 1920s and 30. so if that ejected fine youd know the pmc at least was to weak.

 

[Jim K]

I know that because I replaced enough of them; it is a common problem with those pistols. The firing pins for the three pistols I named are the same, so if you can't find a Browning firing pin, order one for the Colt. FWIW, I just checked the Gun Parts Corp. (www.gunpartscorp.com) catalog and, as expected, they show the same stock number for the Browning and Colt firing pins. If you are going to shoot the pistol, buy two (not cheap at $22, though), and do NOT dryfire the pistol without a snap cap.

Jim

 

[pahuff1]

Thanks again Jim. I ordered a firing pin and new spring this morning. It was in stock, should have it in a few days. I will try to remember to let you know if it worked or not

Thanks

 

[Onmilo]

I understand the misconception of the firing pin being the ejector but this simply is not true. This is the ejector;


The firing pin pushes the extractor out away from the slide and this little piece kicks the casing free and directs the casing to the right and out of the ejection port.

You say "there is one other item in the bolt area but it appears to be a guide only,,," and that is exactly what it is, it guides the casing to the right and out the ejection port.
If it is chipped, broken or ground away the firing pin will not direct the casing, the slide will reach the rearmost direction of travel and the casing will drop free from the extractor causing a malfunction.

For the sake of a too short firing pin being the culprit, measure the overall length of your firing pin and let me know what the measurement is, millimeters or inches, doesn't matter.

I am not trying to claim expert status or any other such nonsense.
I am trying to help you fix your pistol, free of charge.

 

[pahuff1]

Onmilo

I am trying to resolve the issue with this gun and sometimes get a little impatient

I've attached a firing pin picture for you to see

Thanks





Onmilo

 

[Onmilo]

OK, in this case I am going to go with Keenan.
The firing pin should measure between 1.125" and 1.130" end to end and yours does look short.

The ejector looks good.

The case is coming back and hitting the ejector but there is insuffucient length on the firing pin to push the extractor away from the frame and release the case.

I was hoping, best case scenario, the firing pin spring was weakened allowing the firing pin to move back farther into the breech, that is an easy and inexpensive fix.

I was dreading, worse case scenario, the ejector was ground or chipped, an expensive welding job or replacement of the slide.

You should order a new firing pin and while you are doing that, since shipping tends to run high anymore, order a fresh firing pin spring and recoil spring.

Best function will be with factory 7.65mm marked magazines though in a pinch the 9mm/.380 marked magazines will work in the .32 acp guns.

In about nine out of ten pocket guns I have worked on, bad springs are usually the culprit of poor functioning.

 

[pahuff1]

Onmilo
Good morning

Thanks for your continued conversation. I am using this as a learning tool so your discussion is appreciated. In the end I will be smarter than when I started.

In your last post you state "The case is coming back and hitting the ejector but there is insuffucient length on the firing pin to push the extractor away from the frame and release the case". I will respond to that with another possible problem? I don't think that there is any contact between the firing pin and extractor on my gun. If there is it is ever so slight that I haven't noticed. One end of it it pressed against a small spring. Towards the middle is a curved pivotal area where the retaing pin holds it in position and the other end is the claw.

The extractor does require quite a bit of pressure to get it to move. I have taken it out and cleaned it (pretty dirty). Without the spring in place, the extractor moves freely in its grove.

 

[Old Fuff]

The long nose on the firing pin is indeed the ejector, so be extremely careful when extracting and ejecting loaded rounds!

What I have seen happen is that someone will either break off the long nose, or shorten it because they think it is too long. Round the tip and everything is fixed, they think. It is not.

Jim is correct in that the Colt 1908 Vest Pocket Pistol, as well as all FN-made Browning pistols in .25 (6.35mm), .32 (7.65mm) and 9mm used this ejection system - with one exception.

I believe that replacing the springs, and installing a new firing pin of correct length will cure your problems.

 

[pahuff1]

new pin

As you can see by the photo there is significant differences between the old pin, the short one, and the new pin. I make the new pin to be about 2/16 of an inch longer. The proof will be when I get to the range and try it.

Different question. How do you get pictures that stay large on the screen versus a click to enlarge?

 

[pahuff1]

firing pin

Got the new firing pin and slipped it into the gun. The empty brass flies about four feet now. Thank you again for all the advice.

But there is another problem now. 1 ,2 or maybe 3 rounds will work and then one will fail to slide into the chamber. The round comes up the ramp and jambs, sitting with the nose up, started into the chamber. The bullet is resting at about a 45 degree down angle. I polished up the ramp and cleaned the chamber and will try again .

 

[Onmilo]

probably need a new magazine or magazine spring.
International Military Antiques has replacement magazines for a good price.
http://www.ima-usa.com/product_info.php/cPath/161_155/products_id/437

 

[Jim K]

Hi, Onmilo and guys. The projection on the side of the breech face opposite the extractor is NOT the ejector. The "misconception" is correct; the firing pin IS the ejector. What that projection does is support the case against the extractor; in other words, as in other guns (like the Mauser 98 rifle, say), the cartridge case is trapped between the extractor and an opposing projection in order to hold it for the ejector.

The projection can't act as the ejector because it is part of the slide and is moving with the cartridge case.

Also note that on a blowback pistol, the extractor extracts nothing when the gun is fired. The gas pressure blows the fired cartridge case back out of the chamber (hence the term "blowback"); the extractor serves only as a pivot point for the ejector and, of course, to remove an unfired round from the chamber. Proof is that some blowback pistols don't have extractors at all.

OK, Old Fuff, you said all the FN Browning pistols in .25, .32, and 9mm used the same system with one exception. Which one were you thinking of? The BHP and Model 1903 both are hammer guns, so the only other one is the Model 1900, and you are right, it uses a different ejector (a separate part riveted into the frame on the left side as a permanent assembly). But I did miss the .25 FN; it was the first to use that type of firing pin, but I was thinking of obtaining a new one and searching for parts for the FN Browning Model 1905 would probably be a lost cause.

Jim

 

[Onmilo]

I won't argue the projection holds the case head in a flat plane with the extractor but I will argue the projection also directs the case to the right and out the ejection port.
In my way of thinking that makes the projection an "ejector".
My opinion is mine and it won't change as it was formed from working on a 1922 with that projection very badly chipped and battered.
The gun would not reliably eject until a replacement slide was found, the firing pin would simply kick the case off the extractor and drop it on top of the feeding cartridge creating some very interesting jams.

The 1903 uses a seperate cartridge guide and ejector on both the US made .32/.380 caliber pistols and the 9mm Browning long FN and Swedish made guns and the 1900 does use a seperate ejector rivited to the frame, no arguement there from my camp.

I am glad the OP got the pistol mostly functioning, from the troubles, it strikes me as a very well used pistol.

 

[pahuff1]

2nd hurdle passed

Hi guys

Thank you all again for becoming involved with my problem.

I did take the magazines apart. The springs looked good, not broken or bent. Nothing that would lead me to change out the springs. So I did a little stretching of the springs. Again not being too sure on how much stretching is too much I just gave them a good stretch. I can now load up the 2 magazines with 5 rounds and shoot off 4 from each magazine. The last round in both magazines doesn't make it all the way into chamber. Locks up in at that 45 degree nose up angle. The bullet is headed into the chamber.

It seems if I pull the slide completely to the rear with only one bullet in the magazine it feeds fine. I would think the slide spring, the spring that fits over the barrrel, could be bad but if it were weak wouldn't it be a problem with the other rounds too? It is just that last round that doesn't feed.

 

[Old Fuff]

When you get to the last round the magazine spring is at its least compression, and therefore is at its weakest. At this point it can't push that last cartridge up fast enough for the slide to pick it up where it should. This weakness can allow the follower to dip too. New magazine springs should solve the problem. You can streach the old ones, but as you may have discovered they quickly take a set again.

When the magazine is loaded with more rounds the spring is more compressed, and therefore pushes up the top one faster. As a result it feeds as it should.

 

[Onmilo]

Wolff Gunsprings offers a service pack of replacement springs for the 1922.
This may be your logical next step to getting this pistoil running 100%http://www.gunsprings.com/Semi-Auto Pistols/BROWNING/1910 and 1922 7.65 & 9mm/cID1/mID3/dID51