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.22 extra long

Discussion in 'Firearms Research' started by Phil from Kansas, Jun 26, 2020.

  1. Phil from Kansas

    Phil from Kansas Member

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    I'm bidding on a winchester model 1904 rifle that is stamped .22 short, long, or extra long. Is it safe to use long rifle rounds in this? What is the difference between extra long and long rifle?
     
  2. Monac

    Monac Member

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  3. troy fairweather

    troy fairweather Member

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    Ya longs are fine the x-long are just longer then a stinger but low pressure. I wouldn't use any high velocity stuff.
     
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  4. Phil from Kansas

    Phil from Kansas Member

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  5. whm1974

    whm1974 member

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    Well the guns made in the 20th Century most likely be safe to use .22 LR HV, but I think the owner would have increased wear and tear by doing so. Is .22 Long still being loaded? I have never even seen a single box of that cartridge sold anywhere... Just .22 Short and .22 Long Rifle.
     
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  6. natman

    natman Member

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    CCI still loads 22 Long and 22 CB Long (low power, low noise). Winchester loads 22 CB Long.

    The CB longs are very quiet from a rifle, but be careful; they ricochet like crazy.
     
  7. whm1974

    whm1974 member

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    Thanks, I didn't know that as I have never seen the round for sale before.
     
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  8. 792mauser

    792mauser Member

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    Never seen one outside of cartridges of the world.
    Neat.

    I still have a box o hi-vel 22long that I shoot rarely.
     

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  9. Steel Horse Rider

    Steel Horse Rider Member

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    I bought some 22 shorts to run through an old Winchester pump rifle of that vintage a few years ago. For target shooting(cans, spinners, etc) there is no reason to shoot anything bigger. I remember shooting sparrows in our barn with a Winchester pump with 22 shorts as a teenager because I couldn't afford the longs or long rifles. Dad was never very happy about the holes in the roof though.
     
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  10. Monac

    Monac Member

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    I think there may be some misunderstanding here. The OP is not asking about 22 Long, which survived until fairly recently. He is asking about 22 Extra Long, which was produced for a fairly short period a long time (100+ years) ago. Some of the guns that could accept it still survive, and he has one of them.

    I hope I am not the one doing the misunderstanding. If I am, I apologize.
     
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  11. Carl N. Brown

    Carl N. Brown Member

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    Monac, I think you are right.

    Extra Long was longer than .22 Long, held more black powder, and had a 40 gr bullet.

    Then Stevens (I believe) mated the .22 Long case with the .40 gr bullet to create the .22 Long Rifle and the .22 Extra Long lost its reason for being. The switch to .22 LR in smokeless powder with high velocity hollowpoint bullets in the 20th Century doomed the .22 Extra Long to oblivion.

    You can shoot .22 Short, Long, Long Rifle in a .22 Extra Long chamber, but most guns chambered Extra Long were made in the black powder era. If the gun is in super good, well maintained condition, standard velocity ammo with lead bullets wax lubricated might be safe. I'd ask a qualified ginsmith to examine the gun. I have refurbished an old BP era .22 single shot but I would only shoot CCI .22 CB Long (29gr) or Quiet-22 (40gr) both ~710 feet per second velocity and very low pressure rounds.
     
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  12. Carl N. Brown

    Carl N. Brown Member

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    From my notebooks
    Code:
    .22 Rimfire Timeline
    Year Cartridge   Case  Bullet  Overall   Description
    1845 BB          .284"  20 GR   .343"  Flobert Bullet Breech cap round ball
    1857 Short       .423"  29 gr   .686"  Smith & Wesson cartridge #1
    1871 Long        .595"  29 gr   .798"  ¨Frank Wesson?
    1880 Extra Long  .750"  40 gr  1.160"  ¨?
    1887 Long Rifle  .595"  40 gr   .985"  J. Stevens Arms & Tool Co
    1888 CB          .284"  20 gr   ----   Conical Bullet version of BB*
    1975 CCI Stinger .710"  32 gr   .985"  almost extra long case, semi-Short bullet
    ---- Aguila SSS  .423"  60 gr   .985"  Short case, Long Rifle overall length
    
    The CCI .22 CB Short and CCI CB Long are loaded to air rifle velocity (720 fps) 29 grain bullet,
    The CCI Quiet-22 is almost a CCI CB Long Rifle (710 fps) 40 grain, 44 ft/lb energy.
     
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  13. PRD1

    PRD1 Member

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    FWIW, if the rifle is intended for the .22 Short, Long and Extra Long cartridges, it will have the rifling pitch intended for the 29 grain bullets they all used (normally ca. 1 turn in 22"), rather than the faster pitch needed, and standard, for the 40 grain bullet of the Long Rifle (1 turn in 16"), which faster pitch is also standard in later arms intended to use the Short, Long and Long Rifle interchangeably. The slower pitch will not stabilize the 40 grain bullet of the Long Rifle, though the chamber would accept the round. You would need to stick with the Short or Long ammunition, and, in the 1904, which is not a strong action, with standard velocity or reduced loads, like the CB Long.

    PRD1 - mhb - MIke
     
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