22 year old Sister Issues

[LoneStarWings]

Hi,

I'm a 26 y/o single guy who is a homeowner. I rent a room to my 22 y/o sister. I am out of town for 3 and 4 days at a time for work. While I'm at home I keep a handgun loaded in my bedroom (under my bed). When I leave the house I unload the gun and secure it in a case.

My sister says she wants access to the gun (a .40 s&w semi auto) because she gets scared while I'm gone. However, whenever I ask her if she wants to go to the range with me to learn how to use it she say something like "nah, I don't really feel like it". Obviously I say "well the gun is going to be inaccessible while I'm gone then", and then she complains about how that's unfair. She told me a story about how she heard a noise in the middle of the night while I was gone and had to call a neighbor to come look around the house with her, and that she really wishes she'd had the gun.

My questions....should I handle this differently? While I value my sister's safety, I feel it's probably more unsafe for her to have a gun and not know how to use it properly than it is for her to not have it at all.

Also, am I being negligent by keeping the guns loaded & under the bed while I'm at home? I recently took an NRA intro pistol course and the instructor said we should always keep the gun in a locked safe all the time unless we need to use it (in case friends come over, etc). I realize I might get flamed for these questions, as they are probably basic gun safety, so I apologize in advance.


Advice appreciated,

LSW

 

[Duke of Doubt]

Strange that she's interested in the gun but not in learning how to use it.

 

[2RCO]

Don't worry about getting flamed.

If your sister won't learn how to use the gun properly it is likely more dangerous than not having it at all. So she is "safer" without it.

Maybe the range is too threatening to her take her to a family farm or somewhere else to practice. Teach her the basics it shouldn't take more than an hour to familiarize her enough to make her safe with it if she listens.

 

[KarenTOC]

Strange that she's interested in the gun but not in learning how to use it.

What's to learn? You grab it, point it, and pull the trigger. The bad guy flys across the room from the impact, slams into the opposite wall, and falls down dead.

I suspect the young lady watches too much TV.

 

[RavenVT100]

I'm an NRA Instructor.

In Basic Pistol, you learn how to use the pistol safely for recreational purposes such as target shooting and competition. SOP in that environment is to keep the pistol unloaded and in a secure location when not in use.

Keeping a loaded firearm for self defense isn't part of the NRA Basic Pistol curriculum and that is why you were told what you were told. I would recommend a real self defense/judicious use of deadly force course such as Massad Ayoob's LFI course if you want to learn about the realities of keeping a pistol for self defense.

Personally I believe you are right in not giving your sister access to your pistol. From what you've stated, it doesn't look like she is interested in learning how to operate the pistol. It could be a liability for you both if she thinks that a pistol is something you can use for self defense without knowing how to operate. Also, you never mentioned anything about her knowing what the legal issues are, because those are just as important.

The bad guy flys across the room from the impact, slams into the opposite wall, and falls down dead.

And then Jerry Orbach shows up with a clever one-liner.

 

[bang_bang]

If she isn't familiar with firearms safety, then she shouldn't be allowed access to the firearm. Tell her that in order for her to gain access, she has to prove that she is able to understand the function of the gun (load and unload safely), practice shooting, and know some rules and laws around them.

As for keeping it loaded...I don't think you're doing anything wrong. I don't have a safe or lock-box to put my firearms in, instead the long guns rest in a decorative gun cabinet while the pistols reside in my room. At this moment, I have a Witness .45 chambered in my dresser drawer, my Para P10-40 with 10 in the magazine behind me (polishing it), and a Dan Wesson 357 loaded with HP ammo in the computer desk drawer.

Unless your lock-box has an electronic locking device, gaining access to your firearm may be time consuming. Time is one precious thing that needs to be in your favor in a home invasion.

But seriously, she has to know the basics of firearms. Handling a pistol calls for a lot more caution than a rifle IMO.

 

[sturmgewehr667]

always keep the gun in a locked safe all the time unless we need to use it

a criminal will not give you a chance to unlock your safe and unload your gun, unless you have small children or stupid friends, you are not being negligent keeping the guns loaded while at home.

it's probably more unsafe for her to have a gun and not know how to use it properly than it is for her to not have it at all.

there's your answer

if she is not willing to learn how to handle and shoot the gun, she should be just fine with a machete and a flashlight, which is actually what i used to use for HD when i couldn't have access to guns lol

you are not going to get flamed for these questions, they are legitimate questions.

 

[sturmgewehr667]

just to keep up with the trend of describing our home defense arsenals, i have a mossberg 590, loaded, with bayonet fixed sitting beside my bed at night.

 

[Sam1911]

There is a LOT that goes into responsible gun ownership and gun use. You are doing the right thing by keeping it secured when you aren't around (assuming that you can't carry it with you in your location).

If you spend any time studying the threads in the Strategies and Tactics board and the Legal section here on THR you'll begin to see what an incredible weight of responsibility rests on your shoulders when you pick up a gun to defend yourself. While there is nothing on earth that equalizes violent person-to-person interactions as capably as a properly wielded firearm, the repercussions of firing that weapon -- whether justified OR NOT -- can haunt you for the rest of your life. Even if you never fire a shot, simply having that gun present in an encounter can end very poorly for you if you aren't completely certain of your rights and the legal standing of your actions (in your specific jurisdiction).

Those of us who choose to purchase, maintain, study, and practice with firearms face those issues with all the understanding we can muster and hope and pray that we will make the most educated and legally justifiable choices possible in that fearful instant of need.

Is your sister ready to make the same choices and commitments? Does she understand the laws of your state as they pertain to self-defense and possession of weapons? Would you trust her judgment as much (or more) than your own if she's faced with a shoot/no-shoot situation -- knowing that the target of her fear (and her bullets) may be anything from a home-invasion gang, to a drunk and confused college kid, to a parent or friend playing a practical joke, to some lost kid trying to find their way home after dark, or any number of other stressors.

If the answer is no (and I'm guessing strongly that it IS) then no, you do NOT want to be supplying her with easy access to your gun.

She's 22. You can't stop her from going and buying a gun if she wants to. But if she's not ready to even get a little familiarization training with the gun, then it seems VERY unlikely she's going to study the laws pertaining to deadly force, or the strategy of using it properly. She's also probably unlikely to go to the effort of buying her own -- and that might be the best thing for her. At the very least, it's not on YOUR hands -- and you may just impress upon her how serious this all is if you stick to your answer. If you give up and say, "oh sure...just try not to shoot yourself," she'll probably never learn.

The (next to the) LAST thing I'd want is to think of her investigating strange noises outside the house waving your gun around! Recipe for DISASTER!

-Sam

 

[cleardiddion]

No worries, you're doing the right thing.
It's the same deal when I'm at home really.

Tons of rifles, shotguns, and a couple of handguns. My Dad's ex-army, Mom learned basic marksmanship way back when, and my sister shoots my pellet gun all the time. However, everything is kept away from prying hands when I'm not at home since people tend to not want to learn to properly use what they assume that they know how to use.

 

[rbernie]

My questions....should I handle this differently? While I value my sister's safety, I feel it's probably more unsafe for her to have a gun and not know how to use it properly than it is for her to not have it at all.

I would do the same thing as you. If she's not motivated enough to learn to use it, then she must not be very scared she'll need to use it.

I will tell you this - my wife never believed how HARD it was to accurately shoot a pistol until she tried it. Your sister may not know just how hard it is for some people to even to keep a 12" group @ 3 yards first time out, and therefore doesn't see the value in practice. That is likely the hurdle you need to overcome.

Also, am I being negligent by keeping the guns loaded & under the bed while I'm at home?

An unloaded and locked-up firearm is unless as anything other than a paperweight. If you intend to have it for self-defense purposes, you should keep it loaded and accessible.

I have small children, so I secure my (loaded) HD pistols in small push-button lock safes bolted to various bookshelves. That way I have almost instantaneous access, but without the fear of somebody (friend, child) inadvertently getting their hands on them.

 

[NG VI]

I recently took an NRA intro pistol course and the instructor said we should always keep the gun in a locked safe all the time unless we need to use it (in case friends come over, etc). I realize I might get flamed for these questions, as they are probably basic gun safety,

Make her take the same course. In my area, it only costs about $60 I think, pay for it if she agrees to go. For that price and the likely benefit, you could even take it again with her.

Let her know though, that you are happy that she realizes she will have to be her own first line of defense in a bad situation, but that she needs to actually learn to safely and properly use a firearm before you give her full access to one.

You didn't say your make and model either. My .40 pistols are a Glock 23, HK USP, CZ 40B, and a Glock 27. A lot of variety in there, what's yours?

 

[LoneStarWings]

Thanks for the feedback everyone. We do have a family farm so maybe I'll wait until we're both back home and use that opportunity to teach. I can't carry my weapon with me to work since it involves air travel.

You didn't say your make and model either. My .40 pistols are a Glock 23, HK USP, CZ 40B, and a Glock 27. A lot of variety in there, what's yours?

It's a Smith & Wesson M&P .40, full size, which does lend some concern that it might be too much pistol for her. She's 5'5" ~ 120 lbs-ish. I might try and get her to shop for a pistol of her own. My dad wants to get her a Taurus Judge but that seems like a bad choice IMO. I've read "the cornered cat".

 

[kingpin008]

I'm with the others - she doesn't want to familiarize herself or practice with the gun, she doesn't get to even touch the gun. Period. She can whine and stomp and tell me how unfair it is all she wants, she still wouldn't lay a finger on it.

 

[Leanwolf]

Lone Star Wings, if you can convince your sister to become familiar with a handgun and the fundamentals, safety, accuracy, etc., etc., do yourself and your sister a favor by starting her out on a .22 L.R. handgun!

Plus hearing and eye protection.

With a .22 L.R. handgun, she'll learn without having to deal with heavy recoil, loud report, etc., and it won't cost a small fortune for her to become proficient. Then, once very familiar with the fundamentals, etc., move her up to the heavier caliber.

My suggestion.

L.W.

 

[ThrottleJockey]

I agree with the others. You are handling things well. My wife is 5'5" 120ish, and handles my Beretta 90-two .40 just fine, also does well with my SAXD.45 full size.

 

[ArmedBear]

I have one of those quick-access pistol safes. I think it's a good compromise: it doesn't take any more time to get a pistol than reaching under the bed would, but it's automatically kept safe from curious hands.

 

[Prince Yamato]

Strange that she's interested in the gun but not in learning how to use it.

I'm going with Duke on this. I don't know your sister. Maybe you're both great church-going folks and she is just naive; does she give you any reason to think that there's a less-than-genuine reason she would want access to the gun? You obviously don't have to post the response on THR, I'm just offering up a possibility.

I'd keep the gun locked up. She'll do more harm than good if she tries to use it with no experience.

 

[offthepaper]

Sounds to me like she's a lot more interested in getting her hands on it, more than wanting to actually protect herself with it when you're gone.
I would be VERY, VERY wary.

just my 2 cents.

 

[MaterDei]

You're doing the right thing, me thinks.

Some people have a hard time learning from someone they are close to. You might want to consider giving her a list of basic pistol classes and letting her go on her own.

Good Luck

 

[Starcheck55]

I know one of my ex's wanted me to leave a gun at her place for her protection...I told her if she went to the range with me, learned about firearm safety, etc.

She was not interested in it, so I dropped it. Few weeks later she starts asking questions about the range, I told her about it and she reaffirmed her position about not wanting to go there. Turns out she was afraid she'd be embarrassed by not knowing anything and basically looking like an idiot. So I instead took her to a friends farm where there would not be an "audience" judging her.

In retrospect, it makes sense. She wanted to take a group dance class, and I said hell no, I'm not getting in front of a group of people and looking stupid. So we took some private lessons together first, and once I realized she was worse than I was....we joined the group classes.

 

[TexasRedneck]

Actually, it's a pretty common female thought process. They want to wave the gun as a threat, so they don't REALLY think they'll need to use it.
Ask her if she'd allow someone who'd never driven a car to drive HER car. Then point out that while THEY might hit a tree, someone handling a gun without proper training could easily KILL themselves or someone else.
A buddy's g/f asked me to take them to the range and teach her how to shoot, stating she wanted to get a gun for home defense. Before we headed out to the range, I pointed out to her that she needed to be willing to *kill* someone to defend herself. She got a funny look on her face, and you could see that it was the first time she actually thought it through. Told her to think on it, and if the answer was "yes", then I'd be happy to teach her - otherwise, it could get her killed.
She thought it over, I took them to the range and ran her through everything from .45's to .380's. She absolutely *nailed* the 10-ring with my Beretta 86 Inox Compact .40, so I'm now helping her locate one (didn't realize how hard it'd be ta find!).
Bottom line - until she's ready to KNOW how to safely use the gun - keep her away from it!

 

[XavierBreath]

If she didn't know how to drive, you wouldn't give her the keys to your car in case she wanted to go to the grocery store. Giving her access to your firearm without any training is just as dangerous.

Offer her training, and if she wants a gun, point her in the right direction towards chosing her own.

Send her to The Cornered Cat in the meanwhile.

 

[dcloco]

Two words - Louisville Slugger

 

[Permafrost]

You can take a beginners class at many gun ranges and learn a lot in just a quick 2 hour course or so... Not really any excuse not taking it if you want to have firearms around.