.223 Sizing problem with LNL...

[rino451]

Anyone else have issues getting the shoulder knocked back enough on their LNL? I tried the resized cases in three different guns and all three have issues going into battery. I'm trying to resize to the tightest chamber but even hitting the shell plate, I can't get them sized down enough after trimming and crimping. I've tried my old RCBS FL die and a Hornady New Dimension FL die (bought specifically b/c of this issue) in the LNL and both just don't set the shoulder back enough. I dropped the RCBS dies back in my Lee Classic touching the shell holder and, bingo!, trimmed, crimped, and it chambers in my tightest chamber just fine. Am I stuck with grinding the bottom off one of the dies? Has anyone else had to do the same?

ETA I'm using the RCBS lude die in both the LNL and when using the Lee Classic and have removed the spindle from both dies when in the LNL to try and rule out any case stretch due to lack of lube in the case mouth.

Any ideas/help would be great!

Thanks!

 

[rundm]

I think that if you make sure the sizing die is touching the ram on the upstroke and then you let the ram down and turn the die a quarter turn more you should be able to set the shoulder back the way you need to. RG

 

[jenrob]

Don't know but you could try a Small base sizer die.

 

[ocabj]

I think that if you make sure the sizing die is touching the ram on the upstroke and then you let the ram down and turn the die a quarter turn more you should be able to set the shoulder back the way you need to. RG

This is correct. Even if your die is touching the shell holder, you can still turn the die down further to get more shoulder setback.

 

[mdpresco]

I have had that problem too!

I have a LNL press with the Hornady dies for my RRA. I found the problem when I gently closed the bolt on the first round from the magazine. The bolt did not go into battery and I could not easily get it to open . Letting the buffer spring close the bolt, there was no problem.

I believe this is caused by flex in the LNL turrent caused by the force required to resize the case. Clean, lubed cases can reduce the problem and prevent a stuck case in the resizing die by reducing this force. I have found that reloading only brass shot in my firearm also helps. I picked up some once fired .223 at the range from a gun chambered for 5.56. It has been a pain to resize.

Are the chambers that much different on your various rifles?

 

[Idano]

Unless there is something wrong with your press the problem has to be with your setup. I have a LNL and have loaded thousands of .223 for my AR without any feed issues. One thing you do have to watch out for is improperly or not swagged primer pockets. A tight pocket can keep you from achieving the full stroke which will affect your full length resizing and bullet seating depth. This can definitely be an issue if you routinely scrounge bass like I do. I would have to say that at least 70% of progressive reloading issues I have run into can be contributed to the condition of the brass and 90% of those being with military brass. The solution that works for me is to swage all .223 brass before it is used. However, since I scrounge a lot of brass I will usually run it through my Dillon Super Swagger. The swagging station on the Dillon 1055 is definite what makes that press so damn reliable on feeding IMO would be the only other press I would consider if I were to replace my LNL.

 

[jenrob]

Idano
One thing you do have to watch out for is improperly or not swagged primer pockets. A tight pocket can keep you from achieving the full stroke which will affect your full length resizing and bullet seating depth.

Idano I have been loading for a while have swagged many thousands of .223 .45acp and a few 30-06 and have never had a problem other than not being able to get a primer to seat. I gues my ? would be how does a cartridge with a tight primer pocket affect my full length size when I do this before I ever swag the pockets. I'll bite on the OAL if you don't get the primer seated and you set a bullet if the case is riding around on a primer that is not fully seated. That's a guess but sounds like it is possible.

 

[agd1953]

I had the same concern with my .223. I found that the OAL was a little off and it caused the same symtoms. shortern one by a few thousenths and try it again.

 

[Idano]

jenrob;

I guess I am assuming everyone sets up their dies one station at a time with one cartridge. If this is the case you set your resizing die with no cartridge in the priming station so the primer punch has no resistance. However, once you start loading if you encounter a cartridge with tight primer pocket that prevents you from achieving the full stroke the cartridges in the sizing and seating stations will be affected.

However, even though I have a progressive I deprime and resize all my brass as a separate step so I haven't had any issues with resizing but I have seen OAL affected in the past. However since I have made sure all newly acquired brass has been run through my Dillon Super Swagger first I haven't had any further issues.

 

[mdpresco]

LNL vs LNL Progresive

I have a LNL Progressive. I deprime and resize in the progressive before I trim. Hornady makes a LNL that is not progressive where the ram force is in line with the cartridge, not offset like the LNL Progessive. There in may lie some of the confusion and my problem.

Since my post I have been measuring my resized cases in a head space gauge. They do not quite have enough case neck setback. I have the die touching plus 1/4 turn. That leaves the rim sticking up above the gauge about 0.005 to 0.010" after resizing. Factory ammo sits flush in the gauge. I don't want to screw the die down any more, causing more deflection in my press.

To solve my problem, I am going to purchase a non-progressive LNL or Lee just for the depriming and resizing. A progressive is excellent for pistol reloading and completing the rifle reloads. But for centerfire rifle, it may have some limitations.

 

[rbernie]

Just to level-set things - are the brass all verified as trimmed to the min OAL, and are you testing just brass or brass with seated bullets?

 

[shadeecat]

Tumble, resize, trim ...

1/108--Tuesday

Have used a progressive press on both new and range .223 brass. The range brass needs tumbling first. Then resize it and reprime. And in my situation, to also reneck it up from .223 to 6x45mm. Hornady One Shot spray lube has worked the best so far to do this. Then trim the cases that need it back to 1.7505 inches. Free bore is usually not so much a problem. But cases in excess of 1.7600 inches need triming back.
The play in the rotating shell plate on progressive presses will affect the seating depth of the bullet by + - .0001 or .0002. Which isn't a big deal for pistol plinking ammo. But for benchrest it is better to march the resized cases out of the progressive and into a loading block after they have received the charge of powder. Then use a single stage press to seat the bullets to a consistent depth. The factory ruger mini 14 mags will accept a max COL of 2.267 inches and still feed smoothly. Longer than this and they hang up in the magazines. So for smooth feeding from the mags and for maximum powder capacity on mag length .223 cartridges, it is best to have a single stage press on hand as well, to seat the bullets.

 

[VARifleman]

Thank Oleg for THR! I ran into this problem and thought it had to do with getting a slightly stuck case. I didn't have the full length sizer adjusted down far enough as stated earlier. I put the bushing into my LNL, then threaded the die down as far as I could with the ram all the way up, and then lowered the ram, and adjusted the die down another full 1/4 turn. Things are working now. Thanks again!

 

[jeepmor]

This is all due to your press stretching a little bit under load. The extra 1/4 turn or so will account for this and should be all you need to do. At least you found this out before you rolled oodles of rounds that chamber tightly. If you are on that side of the fence, I'd recommend a LEE FCD (full lenght crimp) die that sizes everything once it's loaded.

And now, having read this, I have some rounds I need to check.


Whew, they're okay. I rolled about 5-6 hundred a few weeks ago and don't recall doing the chamber check before going into production mode.

 

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

A couple suggestions:

1. Follow the other fellas suggestion about turning your die a bit further into the press. This will get your shoulder bumped down enough to get the proper dimensions. You don't need to get another single stage press.

2. Because you should be trimming AFTER you resize, you're probably better off running the brass through to size them, then trim off press, then go back on press to finish performing the rest of the reloading process. This seems inconvenient and it is, related to pistol reloading, but it provides one a better end product and is worth the effort.

Regards,

Dave

 

[30Cal]

Case lube is important. If you're using a die with an expander ball, there's a good chance you're actually pulling the shoulder forward rather than setting it back. Make sure you're lightly lubing the inside of the case necks.

Hornady One shot is not a good lube IMHO.

 

[snuffy]

If you are on that side of the fence, I'd recommend a LEE FCD (full length crimp) die that sizes everything once it's loaded.

Lee FCD for bottle necked cases does NOT resize anything. It simply crimps the neck by giving it a hug with a collet. You're thinking of the lee FCD for pistol/revolver rounds.

Not having a LNL progressive, I can't speak to the problems the OP and others are having. Any time the force for resizing is off-center from the centerline of the ram, there's a chance for deflection. How solid the shell plate back up is, will have an influence on if the shell plate will still be square to the bottom of the die, and remain tight against the bottom. Use of a case/cartridge gauge will tell if everything is kosher.

And now, having read this, I have some rounds I need to check.

Yeah, I just ran back to do that check on 500 .223 rounds I just loaded on my 650. Like you said, PHEW! They're okay, right on the high limit. But my bushy AR isn't fussy, it eats about anything I feed it!