2Q, smallest snubbie and are .357 and .38 snubbies usually the same size?

[Radium]

lately I have been having dreams about a snubbie (ok last few years).

and I have been wondering which is the smallest snubnose revolver?

do the five and six shot snubbies differ in size?

and are .357 snubs usually a bit bigger then .38 snub revolvers?



I have been thinking about getting myself a snubnose for killing wounded moose.

since we hunt with dogs over (here usually just one) i figure its a lot easier to finish of a big moose while holding the dog from the color with one hand and shooting with the revolver from the other hand.

then doing the same but instead using a big bolt action rifle.


so what kind of a snubie would u guys recommend?

I want small / lightweight as possible in .38 or .357.

thanks =)

 

[JWF III]

i want small / lightweight as possible in .38 or .357.

Though there are answers to all your other questions, to save time I'll answer what (I'm guessing) is the main question.

S&W M&P 360-1 7/8" barrel, 5 shot, .357 magnum, weighs 13.3 oz., exposed hammer
S&W M&P 340-1 7/8" barrel, 5 shot, .357 magnum, weighs 13.3 oz., internal hammer
S&W M&P 340PD- 1 7/8" barrel, 5 shot, .357 magnum, weighs 11.4? oz. (titanium cylinder), internal hammer -- (not listed on their site ever since the changed it's format. Discontinued? maybe. There is also a lot more missing models that I never would've thought they would drop.)

Wyman

 

[Radagast]

For your purpose:
S&W six shot snubs are built on the medium K and L frames These are larger guns, but easy to handle one handed. They are also steel framed and weigh over 30 ounces.

Colt 6 shot snubs were built on the slighlty smaller D frame in .38 special with a steel frame (Detective Special) or alloy (Agent). Also in .357 magnum as the stainless steel Magnum Carry. All are now discontinued.

S&W 5 shot snubs are buit on the J magnum frame and weigh from 11 ounces ot 23 ounces depending on whether steel or alloy framed.

Older S&W snubs in .38 special were built on the slightly smaller J frame, the only difference with the J magnum is thickness of metal and a 10th of an inch in the cylinder.

Much older S&W snubs were built on the smaller I frame in .38 S&W, a much lower powered round.

Recoil in the alloy framed guns with magnum loads is not fun, even the steel framed J frame has a definite bite.

For your purposes, I would suggest you look at the steel framed S&W Model 60 with a three inch barrel and adjustable sights. Still concealable if needed in an inside the pants holster, it will also be a useful small game gun as well as a moose masher.

 

[Radium]

Thanks for the answers

I guess im going to go with the S&W revolvers.
what are the round/lifetime with these alloy vs steel guns?
for practise im just going to use .38spl and for finishing of the meece/mooses (?spelling?)
unless i get a HUUUGE one i will keep atleast 1-2 .357 in the drum.

i also shoot a ipsc sorta shooting with my glock so i will be using atleast a few hundred .38 and .357 every summer with it.

 

[jfh]

Alloy-steel round counts:

1. AFAICT, the scandium-framed guns are probably as tough as the steel framed-guns. The aluminum-framed guns are NOT as tough--but they are, for the most part, only available in 38 Special.

2. I've personally put 20,000 rounds or so through a 640--the steel 2" DAO. About 85-90% of that shooting was 38+P / 357-lite loads; perhaps 5% were full house magnum loads. I just had it gone over by S&W--no particular frame problems noted.

Jim H.

 

[Radagast]

There have been quite a few reported problems with the alloy framed and scandium guns.
The clear coat finish will erode if cleaned with some aggressive cleaning products.

The top strap may be subject to flame cutting at the barrel cylinder gap.

IIRC there have been issues with the frame cracking where the barrel is screwed into it.
Light weight bullets in the .357s can pull free of the cartridge case under recoil and bind the cylinder.

There has been one reported case on the gun forums of a shooter ending up with stress fractures in the bones in his hands after shooting 400 rounds of full house magnums in one sitting.

The airweight magnums have a place, they are for deep concealment and last ditch self defence where a decent belt and holster are not an option. For your stated purposes a steel gun will be a better option.

Scandium is a rare earth metal, the amount used to alloy the aluminum frame is minuscule, the alloy prevents the gun from cracking when it distorts under the pressure of firing.

Some years back I had a steel framed .357 magnum Model 60. At 15 meters with .38 special loads I could group 5 shots into two inches. The time I shot it with .357 magnums I had a group of seven inches at seven meters. Now halve the weight. Unless you are going to practice a lot, you wont necessarily hit the brain unless you shoot from contact distance.

If you wear a decent belt and holster the steel gun will not be a burden in ther field.

 

[gunnie]

Radium.

dunno how big the moose get in your area, but i had a HP 230gr .45ACP flatten out almost completely on a 600lb (+,-) cow's skull. centered between eyes, 1" higher in alaska, same ended up on the porch at my bud's house. looking like a pancake with an upside down cupcake in the middle. upon relating the story to a coworker, he said he had similar results with .44M 240gr HP.

use ONLY tough bullets unless you are shooting in from behind/under the skull cap.

gunnie

 

[MachIVshooter]

The top strap may be subject to flame cutting at the barrel cylinder gap.

The magnum J-frames have a stainless steel insert to prevent flame cutting.

S&W M&P 340PD- 1 7/8" barrel, 5 shot, .357 magnum, weighs 11.4? oz. (titanium cylinder), internal hammer -- (not listed on their site ever since the changed it's format. Discontinued?

It's still there (and still spendy):

http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/...57768_757767_757751_ProductDisplayErrorView_Y

the 12 ounce exposed hammer 360 PD is also still listed

Radium:

The Scandium S&W's (340/360) are absolutely brutal to shoot with .357 loads. In a SD situation, the adrenaline will most likely make recoil unnoticable. But for woods use, such as coupe de grace on an elk or moose, you're gonna feel it. The all-stainless model 60 2" and similar are still pretty light (22 ounces), but much more pleasant/controllable with full loads. Also have a longer service life and a smaller price tag. As well, the Ruger SP-101 is a bit larger and heavier than the J-frame, but pretty easy to pack in the field. Charter arms offers their 23 ounce Mag Pug in .357 too, for about $350 US NIB.

 

[scotjute]

For what you describe, I'd stay with a full frame revolver with a short barrell (2-3") rather than J-frame. If you do go with J-frame stay with all steel gun and perhaps beef up the handle grips. Nothing less than .357 mag.

 

[Q!!]

Get yourself a Ruger SP101 and don't look back. Built better than the Smiths IMO, and will last you a lifetime.

 

[JWF III]

It's still there (and still spendy):

http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/w...layErrorView_Y

the 12 ounce exposed hammer 360 PD is also still listed

That makes me feel a little better. I just looked at the "M&P" column. But I still can't find any 3rd Gen. metal framed pistols. :banghead:The end of a good thing?:banghead:

Wyman

 

[Radium]

oh crap. i had just written a 24 page answer and then i mistakenly pressed the back button well. here comes a quickie sry for typos and crapaticle grammer because they will come this time.

Gunnie, yeah i know those skulls are HARD!!

i know 2 stories, one form a guy hunting in the dark winter shot a moose cow with a finn mosin nagant with tracers. betweent he eyes, the tracer hit and did a 90 degree turn right up into the air, the whole village saw the little firework and wondered *** it was

second story about a wounded bear a scrared hunter with a 9.3x62 rifle shot the attacking bear hit it , bear goes down. hunters wonder why its still breathing,

The bullet never penetrated the skull and only knocked out the bear

so i will only be shooting them from the side/behind into the head.

and then about using hot loads .357 in a Jframe.

well im not going to use it that much in the woods, it will probably be with me everytime just incase i need it.

but i will only use it IF.
A. a bad shot on the moose (spine shot,magicbullet hitting and breaking all the legs)
+
B the dog is near,next to the moose and i cant leash it to anything = i need to hold it with one hand= im one hand short

+ the big thing about that WE over HERE cant use guns to defend ourselfs.

so those few times in going to use a .357 is not often so i guess i can manage with a J frame since i want a light and small gun that wont be in the way when imma inna woods

 

[Radium]

btw i found this gun in a webstore that to long for me to drive to.

is this a fullframe or a J frame revolver?

the guy said all he knew was the barrel was shortened. its cheap but its only .38 :/

oh and its a S&W

 

[MachIVshooter]

and then about using hot loads .357 in a Jframe.

The alloy J's are inteded for limited use of full power ammo. A steel J can handle quantities of normal .357 without ill effects, but I wouldn't push it with the heavy stuff from Buffalo bore, etc. If you wanna use those hot loaded hard casts and the like, get a steel L-frame gun (or a GP-100, Colt I frame).

The 686 plus (7-shot) comes in a 2.5" model, as does the standard 686.

Sometimes you just can't have your cake and eat it too, and I personally wouldn't punish small (S&W J) and medium small (Ruger SP-101, Colt D, S&W K) with the real sledgehammer loads. You want the power, you gotta take the weight.

 

[gunnie]

..."is this a fullframe or a J frame revolver"...

neither, couldn't expand the picture, but looks like it's a K frame.

gunnie

 

[Radium]

so im back again, i can get this gun really cheap, 200 euros + 70 for the license...

what i now understand is its a smith n wesson 14-2 ?model. six shot .38spl. it had a 4"barrel that is cut down to 2"

and then i got a Smith & Wesson 13-3 kal .357 Magnum for 350 euros.



does the size differ much between these two ?

 

[MachIVshooter]

does the size differ much between these two ?

No, they're both K-frame guns.

The larger L-frame will be denoted with a 3-digit number. 386, 586, 686, 696, etc.

 

[bigtubby]

If you want a small snubbie get a S&W terrier, built on a I frame in .38 S&W. About 6" total

 

[Radium]

that terrier seems very nice

 

[Radagast]

The Terrier is in .38 S&W, not .38 S&W Special. The .38 S&W can be hand loaded close to standard .38 special rounds, but that's about it. They also have not been produced for 49 years, so parts would be a big issue. The J frame model 60 is only slightly longer as the I frame was stretched to accommodate the longer .38 special and again for the .357 magnum. Personally I would not use the terrier for your purposes. Better to run away.

Of the two guns you are comparing, I would go for the model 13-3. The heat treating is different to the .38 special gun, so magnum rounds in it will be safer than hot handloads in the .38 special, the fixed sights are less likely to hang up on drawing, there are many off the shelf holsters for the 13-3, not so many for shortened barrels with high square sights.

 

[sharpblade]

This Ruger is pretty small.