30.06 to 35 whelen

[WisBorn]

Thanks for the in depth explanation. I have thought about rebarreling a rifle in the past. I'm left handed and there was a time that there were very few manufacturers making lefties and few cartridges to buy them in. If you wanted a special round rebarreling was the option. Today there are many more options available.

Thanks again.

 

[mjsdwash]

After reading a thread where a shooter's barrel rebored barrel blew up on the first shot with factory ammunition, and it was a barrel that had been rebored from 30-06 to 35 Whelen, I became leery of reboring. I did weigh a F34 contour barrel in 30-06 and 35 Whelen, these were barrels from Midway, and the 35 Whelen was three ounces lighter than the 30-06. A barrel is the most important pressure vessel in the system, it carries almost all of the cartridge pressure, the locking lugs carry very little compared with the barrel. And barrel were not meant to be reused. No one makes the things under the assumption that once the original service life is over, that material can be removed, (weakening the thing) making the old barrel serviceable for another lifetime of shooting. (No one makes tires under the assumption they will be re treaded, and just look at all the tire debris on the road!) It is just safer to buy a new barrel. However, most hunting rifles have less than 100 rounds through them, so maybe reboring a like new barrel is not so risky. But, I don't know if the material and heat treat are any different between calibers, I doubt they are for small arms, but I don't know. I would not rebore a barrel with worn rifling.

Most heavy commercial tires are built to be retreaded, and that tire debris is almost always from those retreads, your right about reusing an expended pressure vessel.

 

[taltexan]

Thanks to everyone who replied. The 35 is just different bird I have not shot. The 338.06 is another to think on. I like the BAR’s because they soften the recoil but they might not be the best for barrel work.

 

[Slamfire]

Reboring rifle barrels is a widely accepted practice, the US Army even did it to many thousands of rifles after the US Civil War.

Safety standards were somewhat different in the 19th century. Things were expensive and people were cheap. The US Army made 1 million low number 1903 receivers that were so defective that their own tests indicated 33% of the receivers would come unglued in over pressure events. The Army kept these rifles in service until the barrels wore out, or the receivers blew up in front of the user's face. Would that be acceptable today?, it was Army policy till WW2 with these 03's.

How do you feel about the Tuskegee syphilis experiment? What sort of trouble would medical facilities get into if they knowing did that today? Would it be considered ethical to conduct the same experiment today?

I have another rifle I once sent to P. O. Ackley to be rebored from .30 caliber to .375”. He did a great job and 40+ years later the rifle still functions fine. Done correctly there is absolutely nothing wrong with reboring a rifle barrel. Done wrong, well you get the picture..

The barrel is a pressure vessel, removing material does not make it stronger. There used to be a good M1a barrel blow up investigation on a now defunct website. The barrel was made out of inferior materials and it split through the chamber. The barrel had not been shot enough to wear out the rifling. The shooter did not loose a hand because the rifle was rested on a bench, but based on the destruction of the barrel, action, stock, if his hand had been up there, it might not have remained attached. Now, based on long observation, I have observed that you only get one lifetime, and that permanent injuries to your one and only body do not go away. It is my desire to live as long as possible and be injury free. Others are more risk tolerant, like BASE jumpers, and you know, I heard there is only one fatality per 500 BASE jumps. Join the sport and maybe you can be listed on the wall of fame. I am not interested flying into a rock face or eating a tree, nor will I reuse old, worn out pressure vessels. (I also replace ten year old tires no matter how good they look!) I will take the low risk approach.

 

[Slamfire]

Most heavy commercial tires are built to be retreaded, and that tire debris is almost always from those retreads, your right about reusing an expended pressure vessel.

I am unaware of OEM tire manufacturer's who retread their tires, maybe you know of some, I thought it was only by independents. I know that several European countries do not allow retreads on their roads because the things kill people.

this report on retread tire debris is no longer on Government Web sites, DOT HS 811 060 December 2008 Commercial Medium Tire Debris Study
but is at the link I provided. There were a number of studies, this text is from the report on one study:

3.3.3 Study Period The Virginia study was conducted over an eight-week period during the summer of 1999 (May 30 to August 30).


3.3.4 Locations The interstates to source tire debris were heavily trafficked sections of Interstates 95, 81, 77, and 295, all within Virginia. 3.3.5 Methods Highway maintenance officials from the Virginia Department of Transportation (VDOT) were tasked with collecting and weighing tire debris found on the designated interstates. Retrieved debris was then placed in secure VDOT highway maintenance facilities for further examination. A sample of the debris was then examined, coded, and photographed by a tire expert in the presence of VDOT officials.


3.3.6 Results Approximately 42,997 pounds of debris were collected from I-95; 42,475 pounds from I-81, and 42,050 pounds from I-295 and I-77. In total more than 127,000 pounds of tire debris were collected from 658 miles of interstate during the eight-week survey period. The Virginia report gives detailed findings for 27 tires only, which are summarized in Table 3.3

 

[WisBorn]

As a retired truck driver, I will say that retreads aren't worth the price difference. Time is money and safety is everything!

Sitting at the side of the road waiting to have a tire change costs drivers money. An injured motorist is much worse!!

I think rebarreling is a better option from the comments on this thread.

 

[DM~]

I've had 25+ rebores done, never had a problem with any of them.

I wouldn't be afraid to get another done, as long as you have the work done by a guy that does quality work.

As far as I'm concerned, rebores are a non issue...

DM

 

[mjsdwash]

I am unaware of OEM tire manufacturer's who retread their tires, maybe you know of some, I thought it was only by independents. I know that several European countries do not allow retreads on their roads because the things kill people.

this report on retread tire debris is no longer on Government Web sites, DOT HS 811 060 December 2008 Commercial Medium Tire Debris Study
but is at the link I provided. There were a number of studies, this text is from the report on one study:

3.3.3 Study Period The Virginia study was conducted over an eight-week period during the summer of 1999 (May 30 to August 30).


3.3.4 Locations The interstates to source tire debris were heavily trafficked sections of Interstates 95, 81, 77, and 295, all within Virginia. 3.3.5 Methods Highway maintenance officials from the Virginia Department of Transportation (VDOT) were tasked with collecting and weighing tire debris found on the designated interstates. Retrieved debris was then placed in secure VDOT highway maintenance facilities for further examination. A sample of the debris was then examined, coded, and photographed by a tire expert in the presence of VDOT officials.


3.3.6 Results Approximately 42,997 pounds of debris were collected from I-95; 42,475 pounds from I-81, and 42,050 pounds from I-295 and I-77. In total more than 127,000 pounds of tire debris were collected from 658 miles of interstate during the eight-week survey period. The Virginia report gives detailed findings for 27 tires only, which are summarized in Table 3.3

its been about 5 years since I've touched a truck tire, so I have no idea what the current state of the industry is. You're almost certainly right that manufacturers are not retreading their own, but as far as I know the DOT still allows it. Here in northernmost section of I-5 blowouts are still very common, but Canadiain trucking is probably 80% of whats on the highways. BTW, I would have no reservation of reboring a rifle to a bigger, correspondingly lower pressure round, to keep it on topic.

 

[CraigC]

Rebarreling is probably going to be a better option. Not because there's anything wrong with reboring but because there are so few shops that do it. I can just about guarantee you could get a rifle rebarreled in a fraction of the time of a rebore. My biggest hesitation here is sinking a bunch of money into a Remington semi-auto.

Other than recoil what do you expect to gain over 30-06? I've BTDT with both 35 Whelen and 338-06. When I came to the conclusion that a 200 gr from a 30-06 does everything a 225 gr does in 338 or 35 and a 220gr from a 30-06 does everything a 250gr does from 338 or 35 I sold them both.

Yes and the .30-30 is a more potent cartridge than the .45-70. Every step up is an incremental increase in terminal effect. Sorry but there's no valid argument that bigger bullets are not more effective.

We have people killing elk at 1/2 mile with 243's.

We do have much better bullets but in no way can that ever justify shooting elk at a 1/2 mile with a .243. Or even 100yds. There are better bullets but as-of-yet no magic bullets.

When I was a lot younger I had thoughts of hunting moose, elk, big bear, caribou, basically everything in North America. For whatever reason Africa never called my name. But as you get older reality sets in. When working and raising a family taking tme off during the Fall just wasn't a reality. I taught and coached HS football. All of my hunting was in late November-January before retiring.

Moose is just too expensive and hard to get tags for. Alaskan Brown bear is EXPENSIVE. Figure about $20,000 for a hunt and much more is possible. The taxidermist that I used found it was a lot cheaper to go to Russia to hunt brown bear than Alaska. That was a few years ago, not sure if that still holds true. I will visit Alaska one day, but I won't hunt there.

I've made elk my bucket list game animal and one day I might spend the money for a guided hunt for a really big whitetail. Both of those are realistic and possible with my finances. I've spent quite a bit of time traveling, hiking, and camping all over the west in prime elk country. But most of that was during summer months. I've had a chance to hunt there twice since retiring without scoring. But will continue to try DIY mountain hunts as long as my health lets me. I really want to do this without a guide, but if I don't make it happen in another year or 2 will hire one.

After reading this post in another thread, I'm curious what critters you shot to determine that the .30-06 is just as good as the .338 or .35Whelen???

 

[natman]

I have a question. What is the difference in cost of reboring versus rebarreling a rifle?

And other than cost is there an advantage in one versus the other?

JES reboring will rebore a rifle for as little as $250. You won't be able to buy the barrel for that, not to mention the labor to install and chamber it. Also a rebored barrel will fit your stock just as well as the original, since it is the original.

 

[adcoch1]

I built a 35 whelen from a savage 110 30-06 and the only reason I didn't rebore was just that the 30-06 barrel was too short for what I wanted. That and the extra pound of barrel helps a lot with recoil. But the reason I wanted a 35 instead of a 30 was a bigger hole to start with. And to use cast bullets, much more easily used at the velocity a 35 whelen throws a 250 than what a 30-06 throws a 190. With cast the 35 will usually out penetrate the 30 on big animals.

 

[Elkins45]

I hear nothing but good things about JES reboring.

 

[Mr. Zorg]

I've considered having JES rebore a 20" barrel full stock rifle that I otherwise like except for cartridge chambered for, or has a poor bore, or both, to 9.3X62mm. I haven't come across the right candidate rifle at a realistic price yet though.