300 blk what IS it?

[cfullgraf]

So, what makes a cartridge a rifle cartridge and what makes it a hand gun cartridge?

Well, I will answer my own question. In my opinion, a cartridge is a cartridge is a cartridge.

Some work better in short barrel hand guns and some work better in long barrel rifles and some go both ways.

It is kind of like you would not enter a Yugo in a Formula One race and a Formula one car makes a lousy economical family mover.

Note, alot of hand gun loads use powders developed for shot shells, so does that make them shot shells?

 

[R.W.Dale]

Note, alot of hand gun loads use powders developed for shot shells, so does that make them shot shells?

You can't compare metallic to shotshell. If handgun v rifle rounds are apples to oranges then shotshell is comparing those to a 1956 Buick roadmaster.

Does 300blk shooting light bullets just north of 2000fps and heavy ones subsonic on a sub20 grain case full of ww296/h110 have more in common with 357 or 44 mag or 308/30-06 with a 40grn+ case full of varget or slower with 2x the pressure and another 1000fps with all bullet weights?

The 300blk similarities to "handgun rounds"
Similar bore case ratio
Similar propellants
Similar carbine velocities per bullet weight to mag revolver rounds
Similar effective range on game


Similarities to rifle rounds
Bottle necked case
30 caliber


I have a bolt action and rolling block 357 mag. Does that make the cartridge a rifle round?

I had a 30-30 revolver, does that make the cartridge a handgun round?

 

[oldpapps]

Paddy,

The 300 AAC Blackout is a rifle cartridge, because that is what the makers wanted to call it.

Just like the .44 Rem Magnum is a pistol cartridge, because Remington said so when it was first introduced.

It doesn't make any difference if that same cartridge can be fired from a pistol or short barred rifle or long barrels rifle. The name is the same.

Do I care? No. I fully agree with you, it is a fun round to shoot.

Oh crap.... I've used some shot gun powder to load 'it'. Now it must also be a 'slug' shot gun too. I'm getting so confused.

 

[blarby]

300 blk what IS it?

#1- a way to shoot slow, heavy, suppressed 30 caliber bullets.

#2 A way to shoot slower, heavy, unsurpressed 30 caliber bullets.

Not sure why folks like #2, but these uppers sell like hotcakes.

 

[R.W.Dale]

2 A way to shoot slower, heavy, unsurpressed 30 caliber bullets.



Not sure why folks like #2, but these uppers sell like hotcakes.

I think by in large folks are using these as a way to get 30 caliber performance on game in close in hunting with supersonic loads.

It's what I would primarily use one for if I had never come to the realization that 223 works on deer sized game just fine

 

[mstreddy]

RW Dale, good points, but remember that in some states 223 isn't allowed for hunting.

 

[Paddy]

It's seems an odd choice for hunting to me. I was thinking it was more tactical/training/plinking fun round than anything designed to put food on table. But I suppose if you only have one gun, an AR lower would be the most flexible.

 

[Mr.Revolverguy]

In 2011 Advanced Armament Corporation (AAC) introduced the 300 Blackout often referred to as the 300 BLK or 7.62x35mm. As I understand it through my research this cartridge was based off the 300 Whisper though interestingly enough there is no difference in the cartridge . The difference lies in the rifle chambers where the 300 Blackout chambers are a little longer than the 300 Whisper, and the lineage of the 300 Whisper began in 1990 by J. D. Jones who neck up a 221 Remington Fireball case to accept a .30 caliber.

According to Robert Silvers Development Director for AAC the 300 Blackout was created as a Low Visibility Carbine that’s as quiet as the MP5 with three times the distance.

You can read about my 300 Blkout Journey with over 100 pictures and many developed loads shot across the chronograph here
http://www.dayattherange.com/?page_id=3460
http://www.dayattherange.com/?page_id=3807
http://www.dayattherange.com/?page_id=3817

 

[R.W.Dale]

RW Dale, good points, but remember that in some states 223 isn't allowed for hunting.

And I think that's its unsung niche.

Much more cost effective than 6.5g or 6.8spc not to mention the big bores. Yet powerful enough that a whitetail inside 100yds will never know the difference

 

[mstreddy]

And, it can handle the wide range of weights on the bullets. All in an AR platform or bolt gun. I don't know, but how many bolt guns out there in 6.5 Grendel or 6.8 SPC? A 300 Blk bolt gun keeps talking to me from my LGS -- saying, "come on, take me home"

 

[R.W.Dale]

And, it can handle the wide range of weights on the bullets.

Yes and No depending on what your goals are. If paper punching or steel ringing is your goal then yes. But if your goal is to send bullets into flesh and bone then your options for projectiles that can expand within 300blk's velocity envelope are quite limited.

A 300 Blk bolt gun keeps talking to me from my LGS -- saying, "come on, take me home"

I wouldn't. A can of trail boss powder in the 308 or 30-06 you already own will do the exact same thing for a fraction of the cost.

 

[mstreddy]

RW, I already have a 300 Blk upper for my AR. A bolt would allow me some experimentation without having to worry about action cycling issues, particularly whenever I get the suppressor.
As to the bullets, yes, all of them won't work for all things, but you can tune for what you need. What is the range of bullet weights available in the other calibers?

 

[Walkalong]

I already addressed that

That was helpful. Thank you.

 

[jmorris]

And the 221 Remington Fireball that began life as a hand gun cartridge and now is considered a rifle cartridge

And that is what we are talking about, a necked up .221 Fireball.

That being said the "thumper" AR rounds like the 45 BM, 458 SOCOM and 50 BEO all use magnum pistol powders too.

 

[R.W.Dale]

What is the range of bullet weights available in the other calibers?

Quit a bit more than you'd think.

For example 30caliber goes from 100-220 grains, probably a little less staying with what will feed in an ar mag.

A suppressed non revolver 38/357 would have bullets ranging in weight from 90g all the way up to and north of 250g drawing on the selection of .358 rifle bullets

A 44 180 all the way up and over 340

 

[bluetopper]

I've thought all along the 300 Blk is a fad and whose popularity would fade rather quickly because the niche it fills isn't a niche I'm interested in. I may have been wrong however. If I was going to shoot a wildcat caliber from 223 brass it would be 7mm TCU. No cutting of the length of brass casing which greatly diminishes powder volume and power.

I still don't see the point. Other calibers leave it far behind in the dust.

 

[R.W.Dale]

I've thought all along the 300 Blk is a fad and whose popularity would fade rather quickly because the niche it fills isn't a niche I'm interested in. I may have been wrong however. If I was going to shoot a wildcat caliber from 223 brass it would be 7mm TCU. No cutting of the length of brass casing which greatly diminishes powder volume and power.



I still don't see the point. Other calibers leave it far behind in the dust.

But not coming out of an AR15 mag on a stupid common piece of brass AND all standard (but the bbl) parts

None of the TCU wildcats will work in an ar with bullets heavy enough to matter

 

[mstreddy]

RW, I was asking about the 6.5 Grendel and 6.8 SPC. I don't own either so, to be honest, I haven't looked up their capabilities beyond some of the comparisons/contrasts in range/muzzle velocity.
I'm thinking and commenting about the AR platform as those 3 calibers are some of the answers to stepping up from 223 in the platform.

What convinced me to go with the 300 Blackout was the ease at which it can be suppressed, and the apparent flexibility in creating the cases, loading, and the wide availability of the projectiles themselves.

7mm TCU, now, I have to learn something new.

 

[kelbro]

I like it for all of the above reasons and it plays into my caliber consolidation plan. Makes it easier to buy/cast bullets. 300BLK, 308, 30-06, and 30-30. One BIG tote of 30 cal bullets and just a few molds.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

I envy all of you folks that are able to purchase SBR's and suppressors and standard capacity magazines.

When I leave this sinking wasteland of California, I will join the rest of free America and shoot my Short barreled, suppressed, 300 blk.

Not if you move to New York, New Jersey, MASS, Illinois, Washington DC or a few other similar "wastelands" that are also not free. I know because I left NYC 9 years ago.

 

[Elkins45]

I still don't see the point. Other calibers leave it far behind in the dust.

Yes, the 300 Weatherby certainly beats it for velocity, but I have a really hard time squeezing them into my AR magazine.

The appeal for me, as I have stated many times before, is that it's an economical way to get trigger time with the AR platform. My cast bullet loads probably cost around $0.10/round, maybe $0.20 if you don't amortize the brass cost. Jacketed bullets (not loaded rounds) alone probably cost more than that for .223.

 

[Arizona_Mike]

Next you'll be telling me the .30 Remington wasn't a rifle round

Mike