.32 or .38

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Regarding .32 Mag hot load(s)

The Ruger SP101 could certainly handle that hot Georgia Arms .32 Mag load the other fellow mentioned. Rugers are built strong.

However, I don't know if your girl friend could handle it. I don't know that she needs to either.

Most countries in the world find a .380 to be an adequate defense round and they think of a 9mm Para as a Magnum.

Only in the USA are we obsessed with power. We are like the Tim the Tool Men of handgun power in this country. I don't think it's necessary. For a woman it might be detrimental.

The hot Georgia Arms .32 Mag load would be great for the Ruger if she can handle it, but then her recoil is back up to .38 special +P range in a midsize gun. Ouch (for me or her). That hot .32 Mag load would probably be great for you (healthy man), but it is appropriate for a recoil sensitive woman who really wants a .32 ACP?

I think the normal .32 Mag loads would be good for her. If they turn out to be easy for her, she can alway step up to the hotter load.

A hit (or two) with a normal .32 Mag load is better than a miss from a power house.

I think the nice thing about the SP101 in .32 Mag is that it offers a great range of power from .32 Long up to those hot .32 Mag loads, and the normal .32 Mag loads are in between. That's great because she can start light and work up to whatever she can accurately and comfortably handle.

I doubt my hands could take those hot loads from Georgia Arms, but it's nice to know they're available if I ever want to step up. Same for your g-friend.
 
The Georgia Arms loads will recoil about like a mid-to-high range 38+P. Which, in a 4" barrel SP101 will be a pussycat.

Sigh.

Look, Americans are generally BIG. Some of the biggest average weights, shoe sizes, belt sizes in the world. We also have excellent emergency medicine so we're less scared of low-powered handgun wounds. A lot of gunshots "stop" people because they get scared of taking more damage, not because they're significantly damaged! Better trauma centers means less fear, never mind that some drugs *eliminate* fear flat-out.

Second, we have high rates of drug addiction and mid-range crime rates.

Add that up and yeah, we favor some pretty stout loads, with good reason.

38+P horsepower is widely viewed as a minimum, which is at the bottom end of 9mm performance. Right now there's a sum total of ONE 32Mag load that will get you there.

I suspect that will change, eventually.

Meanwhile, talking about what the Europeans or Chinese or whoever else does bangthings ignores our situation.
 
I can't see investing in a defensive firearm for which there is precisely one and only one good defensive load. I still recommend at least a .38 if a Ruger is chosen, even for women ;) . If the one good defensive load in .32 mag shoots like a full 38+P, why not just get a .38, have a huge variety of both practice and defensive ammo to choose from, and not have hunt around or pay way too much? If the power of +P is too much, defense ammo is made in standard pressures.

Also, the Ruger SP-101 in .32 mag is actually heavier than the .357 mag by one ounce. This is comparing the 3" models (28 oz. to 27 oz.). The 4" model is 30 oz. There may be a good reason to get this gun in .32, but being lighter is not one of them.

Cheers.

~Ichiro
 
Look, I just sold my 432PD because I found a 332 with no lock. And I have owned a 340, and a 342. The recoil on the GA 85 grain 32 H&R load, and (YES THEY ONLY CURRENTLY SELL THE 85 GRAIN LOAD, THEIR WEBSITE IS WRONG, CALL THEM IF YOU HAVE ANY DOUBTS) is less than any .38 special load. I found the Speer GD 135 gr +P to be painful, and the GA 32 H&R 85 grain in my opinion was about 25-35% lighter than regular pressure 130 grain loads.

And yes the 432PD is 1.5 oz heavier than a 340/342, but that is very little difference.

I disagree with Jim March's opinion that the GA round recoils like a mid to high range .38+P, and I'm curious if hes shot both to compare. Get her a 32 H&R mag, if she's concerned about recoil then I think even in a heavier "Airweight" at 15 oz with even standard pressure loads will most likley be too much for her. The 32 H&R displaces very close to the energy that many .38+P loads do, give you one more round, and has less recoil.

Yes a good .38+P round is more effective than a 32 H&R mag round when it comes down to it, I dont' dispute that. But, the difference in performance is pretty close, and when you're talking about a small, lightweight gun, you should consider all the factors.

I would not get an SP101 in .32 H&R mag. The gun weighs 25ozs (2.25 IN), and recoil with even Speer's 38+P 135 grain .38 load doesn't produce much recoil at all in that gun. If you're going to get an SP101 you should get a .357 one.
 
She's not concerned with recoil at all. She shoots my .44 mag redhawk like a champ. I took her out with a few buddies from work, and she never flinched at all. She just grinned and said, "I like the big ones." She got her brother to lend me his S&W 500, and again she shot it like she was born with it in her hand. For the life of me, I don't know how such a small woman can handle such a thing. After a few rounds, I'm done with it. She must have been Rambo's love-child. Once again, she's not wanting to carry this on her. She wants to keep it in her truck, because she drives through the bad side of town to get home. Recently we've had stories of carjackings at stopsigns, or even rapes. She wants something that looks mean.
 
1. Last time I checked, the only .32 H&R Magnum round that Georgia Arms has in stock is its 85 gr JHP load (which uses a Hornady XTP bullet), not the 100 gr JHP load Mr. March refers to (which uses a Speer bullet).

That doesn't necessarily mean the 85gr GA load is inferior. We just don't know. I've not read any actual, independently chronoed velocity figures for the lighter weight load. The company, however, claims it should move around 50-100 fps faster than the 100 gr bullet, which clocks around 975-1000 fps from a 2" snubby like the S&W 432PD. If they're correct, that would mean the 85 grainer is good for around 1050 fps from a 2" snubby (even more from an SP101 with its longer barrel).

Suppose that is correct. 85 gr @ 1050 fps = not bad for a 13.5 oz pocket gun. Likely to expand. I'd still prefer a premium .38+P, but that is not bad. And you get six shots.

The only reason for my slight skepticism about the velocity claims: I've shot a couple hundred rounds of the GA 85 grainer .32 Magnum. Excellent, accurate round, but the recoil is very mellow. It feels no worse than the Federal or Black Hills 85 grain .32 Mag JHPs, which definitely aren't clocking 1050 fps. So if GA can really wring those kinds of numbers out of this accurate and mild-shooting load, they should be proud.

2. The .32 Ruger SP101s are neat guns. Mine is a 3" model. Tons of fun. On the practical side, I think they have a limited niche as a house gun for petite and/or recoil-adverse shooters, if you find one with a good DA trigger pull or have it gunsmithed (as I did). I would hesitate to recommend it for CCW (heavy for the caliber), or to a shooter who was not recoil-adverse; such shooters should go with at least a .38+P for defense.

If you want a current production double action .32 to use as a sporting revolver, i.e., one that you can hit with conveniently out past 10 yards, the Ruger is your baby. With its heft and its 3" or 4" barrel, is far easier to shoot well than the light, short-barreled S&Ws and Tauruses. The Ruger also boasts windage-adjustable rear sights.

3. Neither the GA 100 gr .32 Mag round nor the GA 85 gr .32 Mag round is comparable to the recoil of a .38+P. The .32s are milder. They do, however, produce a sharper "crack!" than a .38. Smaller case diameter, higher pressure.
 
If the GA 100gr round is discontinued, that's a shame.

An XTP should expand if it's moving past 1,000fps BUT I'd like to see some independent confirmation of that.

No, I haven't shot the GA 100gr load. I talked to somebody who had several years ago in an S&W steel-frame 32Mag 2" barrel gun and that was his comment, which makes sense given the energy levels involved. We also have confirmation from the Quinn brothers at gunblast.com regarding the true speed of the GA 100gr, not just the GA website.

Would 38Spl be more flexible? Sure. In fact with the GA 100gr load gone, well damn...that's not good at all.

Hmm.

NAA is supposedly working on a 32Mag "oversize Black Widow" to ship this fall. What we should do is ask Sandy to work with an ammo house like Cor-Bon on a specialty load for that gun, with joint marketing. In other words, Cor-Bon promises to make the ammo and NAA agrees to put a "hey, Cor-Bon has a superb load for this thing!" blurb on every print ad for the gun, for free. It would boost Cor-Bon, and it would boost sales of the gun knowing there was a good load available. No-brainer all around. NAA and Cor-Bon have worked together before, this should be doable.

I'm thinking maybe a DPX round in 32Mag?
 
If she waits until after the SHOT show...

She can choose the Charter 2000's Bulldog in .32 H&R Magnum in either a 4' or 2" barrel. The 4" barrel will have the option of adjustable or fixed sights. The 2" version will have fixed sights only. The price will be right and the revolver will be durable.

How much more can one ask?

Scott
 
Interesting

gunfan said:
She can choose the Charter 2000's Bulldog in .32 H&R Magnum in either a 4' or 2" barrel. The 4" barrel will have the option of adjustable or fixed sights. The 2" version will have fixed sights only. The price will be right and the revolver will be durable. Scott
Click to expand...
The more I hear about the .32 Mag the more I like it. Even the guys who weren't recommending it make me like it all the more since they describe it's lower recoil properties. I'm recoil sensitive.

Likewise with the SP101 in 3" barrel .32 Mag. Sounded good to begin with. Sounding better all the time from both the guys who do and don't recommend it.

As for the Charter Bulldog, I'd already heard of that gun and am interested, but I'd earlier heard a 3" barrel would be offered. No 3"? I love 3" barreled revolvers. I don't like 2" or 4". Could it be possible the Bulldog will be available with a 3" barrel?
 
The only reason to go with a .32 Magnum is if she's recoil sensative. You've already said that's not the case. A .38 Special is much more effective, and more versatile, than a .32.

Have her try a .38 Special before she buys a gun. It's ultimately her choice, and she needs to like the gun and have confidence in it, but you can try to educate her a little on the importance of the difference before she buys. Just getting a .32 "because all her friends have one" is NOT a good way to pick a gun and caliber.

Btw, I agree that a 3" barrel is a better choice for CCW than a 4" barrel. You wouldn't think it, but taking off that 1" of barrel makes the gun much easier to carry. J&G Sales has some 3" Model 10's right now. Any 3" K frame would be a good choice.
 
If you go with the SP 101, one other thing to think about is that you get an adjustible for windage rear sight. So if she tends to shoot a little off one way or the other this would be a big plus. I have a sp 101 32 mag with a 4" barrel and a 357 with a 3" barrel. The recoil is lighter with the 32 with Georgia arms ammo then the 357 with 38's but not a lot of difference. The 32 with the 4" is very easy and fun to shoot accuretly. I would compare it to my MK II. Now the only 357's that I have shot are Remington 125 gr UMC and they have a real swift kick to them and will hurt your fingers after a few rounds. I have a pair of shooting gloves that help with this. If you go with a 38 get the 357, she may never shoot 357's but she would have that option and I think it would have a higher resale value. 357/38 ammo is easy to find in alot of different brands and sizes. 32 ammo is verry limited and not cheap.
 
The only reason to go with a .32 Magnum is if she's recoil sensative.
Click to expand...

Well... that's not exactly true. Look what the poster said:

She said her friends have .32s and she wants one as well.
Click to expand...

So we're dealing with perceptions, style, image and other fuzzy stuff. :)

It MAY be true that there's no other OBJECTIVE reason, but handgun purchases, even those of experienced shooters, often have a HUGE subjective element. How manytimes have we read stuff like "I have no use for the .40 S&W. No real reason, I just don't like it." ?

So I'd say that the lady here LIKES the .32 and for reasons that may not be our own, she trusts it. Her friends have it. :)

It's what she expects a handgun to be... a .32... and I assume she'd enjoy owning it and that she'd shoot it.

My firm opinion on this one is get her what she asks for, certainly for that all-important First Gun, and let it grow from there... or not. LOL

StrikeEagle
 
The only reason to go with a .32 Magnum is if she's recoil sensative
Click to expand...

While I don't (yet) own a .32mag, the caliber interests me. Here's why (based on advantages in a J-frame sized revolver):

-Recoil sensitive or not, lower recoil means faster follow-up shots which can make the difference between life or death
-Most (if not all) .32mag loadings have power levels equal to or at least near those of the regular .38spl
-The top .32mag loads are near some .38+P loads
-Even if the power was equivelent to .38spl (non +P) or even a little less, the extra round means a little more overall power and a little more flexibility
-Finally, 6 rounds of relatively potent ammo in a lightweight and small pocketable package that is very managable to shoot. What isn't to like?
 
If it were me, I'd go for a .357 and shoot 38s in it. A 38 doesn't kick badly at all in a 2" barrel, so a 3" or larger, especially with a large rubber grip, would be even less felt recoil. Plus, you'd have the option of loading it with some good defensive 357's if ever needed.
 
Hmm. That finicky, antiquated design wouldn't strike me as a sound choice for a beginner's CCW. She'd do better with a 3" SP101 loaded with quality .38 Special -- harder hitting, more reliable, and very comparable in recoil.

But whatever; this thread is long already.
 
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Revolver vs Semi-auto

In my humble opinion, which doesn't actually count for much,
a first gun choice should be a revolver. :banghead: No safety, No jams,
No slide release, No magazine release, just pure shooting pleasure.
Point,Squeeze, BANG, repeat as necessary
(five or six times, maybe more)

my quote

"I used to keep two lists, friends and enemies, the only problem was
the older I got the more they looked the same. Now I only have
one list, it saves time." D.J. Hogan
 
So far I have not had any such failure in any of my wheel guns,
but I will keep on trying, the more rounds down range the better.
I am not a fan of lightweights and since I am from husker territory,
(we don't have a ccw law, YET!) the weight issue doesn't mean much
to me. I currently have K, L, and N frame S&W's, Colt det spcl, Ruger vaqueros etc. along with various semi's big and small. I have encountered more difficulties with semi's than with wheel guns. I love them all, but for
simplicity of design and ease of use a wheel gun is the best choice
for a first gun. Stove pipe jamb drills stink even if you know what to do
and if you do it wrong :what: it hurts.
 
A trip to my local pusher's lair always includes a longing gaze at the 432PD... and the Ruger BHG Vaquero in .32. It makes no sense whatsoever for me. I like the .38 +P 'FBI' load, the 158gr LHPSWC - simply a tried and well proven performer. I have the 'perfect', albeit haevy, snubby - A 2" 10 - for that round. For a lighter weight/larger CCW, I have a 296. Still, I 'think' I need a 432PD... or a 642. Oddly, when I 'consider' the 432PD, I keep recalling that a 4" SP-101 would be better - and nearly the same price. Then the salesman reminds me of the cheesy windage-only adjustable sight on the SP-101, and my short attention span mind points me at something else. Next trip, same result. Go figure.

Now, back to the original scenario with your girlfriend. A Model 10, even my late model 2", would require a large purse for CC. If that is still viable, a better choice might actually be the new 620 model. It is less than 2 oz heavier, and only 5/8" longer, than your 4" 10. It is a new short lug replacement for the 66 - on the 'L' frame, so it has a seven shot cylinder, a great attribute for female shooters. Loaded with those 158gr +P LHPSWC's, it would be an easy shooter. A trip to Wally World, etc, on a Sunday afternoon would yield some cheap .38 Special plinkers - try that with a .32! Of course, if you have a bg hide in your fridge, you could blast through it with some .357 Magnums - probably even kill the dishwasher and garbage disposal, too. Of course, you might even get some game with it, if permissible in your state. Doug Wesson actually got everything imagineable, even bear, when he demo-ed the first .357 Magnums back in the thirties.

If CC is important, consider a 442/642. I know several folks, all recoil sensitive, who shoot and carry 642's with Speer's 135gr +P GDJHP's. Still, that 432PD will get another look today, if I succumb to another dose of my addiction, a trip to the pusher's lair. I have to remember the Clorox wipes... gotta clean the drool off the display case...

Stainz
 
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