Carbon_15
Member
I'm considereing one as my next fun-gun...
Opinions, pictures?
Opinions, pictures?
.357 Lever action...
- Thread starter Carbon_15
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Brian Williams
Moderator Emeritus
The Search function is your friend, and a Marlin 1894C is my favorite rifle. Go find one and check it out, you will love it.
I like the C version with a 18.5 round barrel but a 24" cowboy would be nice.
If you get one, start reloading and check out 180 gr JSPs with some Lil'gun.
I like the C version with a 18.5 round barrel but a 24" cowboy would be nice.
If you get one, start reloading and check out 180 gr JSPs with some Lil'gun.
NailGun
Member
Yup..YUp...YUP!!! YOU NEED ONE! 
Marlin 1894C or 1894 Cowboy (if you prefer the octagon barrel). Fine rifle. Guaranteed to give you a lifetime of cheep shooting pleasure. When shooting, it will bring a grin to your face in a way that a mere .22 lr. can't.
Marlin 1894C or 1894 Cowboy (if you prefer the octagon barrel). Fine rifle. Guaranteed to give you a lifetime of cheep shooting pleasure. When shooting, it will bring a grin to your face in a way that a mere .22 lr. can't. Nightcrawler
Member
Load up some Buffalo Bore ammo in there and you'll have a carbine that's in the territory of .30-30 and 7.62x39mm in power. .357 Leverguns are FUN. I used one to teach a lady friend of mine how to shoot. Recoil with standard cheap .357 loads is very mild.
lubbockdave
Member
MCgunner
Member
I like my Rossi because it's a Winchester 92 copy. The rear sight sucked, though, replaced it with a ghost ring aperture that has graduated click adjust elevation which is way cool because my light .38 loads shoot way low to my magnums.
All in all, the 1894 Marline, IMHO, is a better rifle, just that the Winchester look is cool and I like it. I avoid nickeled brass in it, though, for magnums. I've had some brass separation issued in it, but only with nickeled brass which is brittle compared to regular brass. I'm not sure how many times I've reloaded the cases, though, and they're pretty hot loads. So, I try to use fairly new brass in it and not nickeled. Wouldn't be an issue with factory, I reckon.
I did have an ejector break in the Rossi. Had to have a smith repair it. The hot loads might have gotten to it. I think the Marlin is a stronger gun. JMHO of course. I mean, I like the gun a lot, just think the Marlin is probably the stronger, better product. The Rossi is accurate. Killed a doe with it at about 80 yards using a hand cast gas checked 158 grain SWC. Doe went about 15 feet with a lung shot behind the shoulder. I also have a light 105 grain SWC .38 handload that approximates .22LR applications like squirrel. It is only about 2 1/2" at 50 yards accurate, though. Most of my squirrel hunting is done with a pistol, anyway. The Rossi, with the irons, shoots about 4moa with .357 loads.
All in all, the 1894 Marline, IMHO, is a better rifle, just that the Winchester look is cool and I like it. I avoid nickeled brass in it, though, for magnums. I've had some brass separation issued in it, but only with nickeled brass which is brittle compared to regular brass. I'm not sure how many times I've reloaded the cases, though, and they're pretty hot loads. So, I try to use fairly new brass in it and not nickeled. Wouldn't be an issue with factory, I reckon.
I did have an ejector break in the Rossi. Had to have a smith repair it. The hot loads might have gotten to it. I think the Marlin is a stronger gun. JMHO of course. I mean, I like the gun a lot, just think the Marlin is probably the stronger, better product. The Rossi is accurate. Killed a doe with it at about 80 yards using a hand cast gas checked 158 grain SWC. Doe went about 15 feet with a lung shot behind the shoulder. I also have a light 105 grain SWC .38 handload that approximates .22LR applications like squirrel. It is only about 2 1/2" at 50 yards accurate, though. Most of my squirrel hunting is done with a pistol, anyway. The Rossi, with the irons, shoots about 4moa with .357 loads.
Rexrider
Member
My opinion would be you need to run, not walk to your nearest gun shop and buy one.
Trust me on this. They are very fun and very practical. What more can you ask for?
The only thing you need to consider is caliber. If you think it will be used for hunting then I would recommend the .44mag. If strictly a fun gun as mentioned then the .357/.38special is the way to go. Even in .357mag, with the right loads and range, it is still a capable dear rifle.
I have a Marlin 1894c in .357mag and would never give it up.
Trust me on this. They are very fun and very practical. What more can you ask for?
The only thing you need to consider is caliber. If you think it will be used for hunting then I would recommend the .44mag. If strictly a fun gun as mentioned then the .357/.38special is the way to go. Even in .357mag, with the right loads and range, it is still a capable dear rifle.
I have a Marlin 1894c in .357mag and would never give it up.
RoyJackson
Member
Got one and they are great!
We often dscuss SHTF guns here... Although .357 Mag may seem kind of puny for a real SHTF situation, the usability of ammo in a long gun and a hand gun seems quite sensible to me.
We often dscuss SHTF guns here... Although .357 Mag may seem kind of puny for a real SHTF situation, the usability of ammo in a long gun and a hand gun seems quite sensible to me.
Yo
Member
I have a Marlin .357, and two Uberti Italian clones, one an 1866 "Yellowboy" (brass receiver and all), and a 24" model 1873. The 1866 and 1873 both employ a toggle action. This is much, much smoother than ANYthing Marlin makes. The '66 and '73 also use a vertical moving shuttle that allows a straight-through movement of the case from the mag tube on to the carrier and then from the carrier into the chamber. In my mind this is a superior design compared to the Marlin. No question it feeds faster and more reliably. All the Cowboy action lever gun speed records have been set with toggle actions.
With a $125 action job on a '66 or '73 you can get the pull weight on the trigger down to 1.5 pounds and lever the gun with your pinkie finger. You can also do action work on the Marlin, but it will never be 'butter-smooth' like the toggle actions.
The Uberti Win '66 and '73 clones have excellent barrels and are the choice of the lion's share of recent cowboy action champs. Even without action work they are much smoother and faster to cycle than a Marlin. The barrels on my two Ubertis are very nicely finished and the guns clean-up very fast.
One benefit of the toggle action is that all the linkages for the lever are sealed off from the combustion area. Hence the linkages stay clean and you can shoot thousands of rounds without doing much more that wiping down the elevator and cleaning the bore and chamber.
The wood stocks are clear-coated and run from good to excellent. If you shop around you can find one with excellent figure--sort of luck of the draw. These guns hold their value very well because the dollar is retreating relative to the Euro. After 3 seasons of fairly hard use, I could sell both my Ubertis for more than they cost.
For looks, it is hard to beat an Uberti 1866 or '73 with case-hardening...
Uberti 1873 (steel receiver):
Uberti 1866 (brass receiver--38 spl only)
With a $125 action job on a '66 or '73 you can get the pull weight on the trigger down to 1.5 pounds and lever the gun with your pinkie finger. You can also do action work on the Marlin, but it will never be 'butter-smooth' like the toggle actions.
The Uberti Win '66 and '73 clones have excellent barrels and are the choice of the lion's share of recent cowboy action champs. Even without action work they are much smoother and faster to cycle than a Marlin. The barrels on my two Ubertis are very nicely finished and the guns clean-up very fast.
One benefit of the toggle action is that all the linkages for the lever are sealed off from the combustion area. Hence the linkages stay clean and you can shoot thousands of rounds without doing much more that wiping down the elevator and cleaning the bore and chamber.
The wood stocks are clear-coated and run from good to excellent. If you shop around you can find one with excellent figure--sort of luck of the draw. These guns hold their value very well because the dollar is retreating relative to the Euro. After 3 seasons of fairly hard use, I could sell both my Ubertis for more than they cost.
For looks, it is hard to beat an Uberti 1866 or '73 with case-hardening...
Uberti 1873 (steel receiver):
Uberti 1866 (brass receiver--38 spl only)
GrandmasterB
Member
Love my Winchester. Some don't like the crossbolt safety, but it works for me. Super fun and handy rifle.
de
member
I bought a rossi from Navy Arms several years ago. 24 inch octogon barrel Model 1892 Winchester clone. I stripped the finishoff the stock and found really nice walnut. 5 coats of hand rubbed true oil and it looked like an original. Didn't like the feeding and called Navy Arms. They offered to fix it but, I instead had them send me a new ejector. Fitted it myself and boy does it eject. The rifle is a tack driver, and I literally don't leave the house without it. I carry it every day. Like the other guy said, inside 75 yards it will do about what a 3030 will do. Of course I have a 94 in 3030 bought new in 1957 or 58.
BryanP
Member
As mentioned above do some searches on Marlin 1894C. You'll find lots of people talking about how much they love theirs. I know mine is possibly my single favorite rifle.
bubbygator
Member
I bought a LSI Puma .357 in SS cuz I fell in love with it's looks. I have poor old eyes, so I (my smithy) put a fiber optic front & a ring rear on it. Made it look even more purty. And it shot just great too. But my eyes just couldn't handle it, so I had to sell it. A nice gun.
I have a Marlin 1894CS with a Williams Foolproof receiver sight. It is an amazingly handy rifle. It clearly has plenty of power for any task concerning short range defense except the great bears. It's accurate, cheap to shoot with 38 special and you can practice on an indoor range. It doesn't shoot the 125 gr very well stay with 158 or more for accuaracy.
AStone
Member
.357 mag v. 30-30?
OK, can we talk about these .357 lever guns a bit more?
I've been making noises for a long while about getting a Marlin 336 (probably A or C) in .30-30 as my main (really, only) centerfire rifle. (Yes, I'm a minimalist, looking for that optimal small toolkit.) It's main use would be deer.
In the last 24 hours, I've started considering a .357 handgun, probably something like a SW 686, SW 620 or a Ruger GP100. I'd prefer a 4" barrel, but am open to a 6". I'd like to use that revolver for both SD (in addition to the CCW 642 in .38) and possibly for short range deer hunting.
I've spent the evening reading threads on the .357, it's sufficiency for deer hunting, whether a 4" barrel would be sufficient (see this thread, which I'm considering reviving, for some surprising comments about the adequacy of a 4" .357 for deer), etc.
I like the idea of having only limited types of ammo to deal with. Depending on the outcome of this research, for me, that could be 12 ga, .22 LR and .357/.38 spl. (I'm considering selling a K9 and replacing it with a .357 mag revolver.)
Realistically, even if I go with the .30-30, that's still not many types of ammo to deal with.
So, to my question: I can't find a reliable source of info anywhere comparing the ballistics of .357 mag out of an 1894C with the .30-30 from a 336.
I've read several comments in this and other threads to the effect of, "With appropriately hot rnds (e.g., Buffalo Bore), a .357 mag out of a carbine will rival a .30-30, at least inside 100 yds."
Could anyone offer up more information about that topic?
Why only to 100 yds? My suspicion is that the .30-30 is still going to be more effective on deer past 100 yds, at least to, say, 150. But I'm no ballistics expert.
Any links to good essays comparing those calibers, especially for deer, at modest ranges?
Opinions welcome.
Nem
OK, can we talk about these .357 lever guns a bit more?
I've been making noises for a long while about getting a Marlin 336 (probably A or C) in .30-30 as my main (really, only) centerfire rifle. (Yes, I'm a minimalist, looking for that optimal small toolkit.) It's main use would be deer.
In the last 24 hours, I've started considering a .357 handgun, probably something like a SW 686, SW 620 or a Ruger GP100. I'd prefer a 4" barrel, but am open to a 6". I'd like to use that revolver for both SD (in addition to the CCW 642 in .38) and possibly for short range deer hunting.
I've spent the evening reading threads on the .357, it's sufficiency for deer hunting, whether a 4" barrel would be sufficient (see this thread, which I'm considering reviving, for some surprising comments about the adequacy of a 4" .357 for deer), etc.
I like the idea of having only limited types of ammo to deal with. Depending on the outcome of this research, for me, that could be 12 ga, .22 LR and .357/.38 spl. (I'm considering selling a K9 and replacing it with a .357 mag revolver.)
Realistically, even if I go with the .30-30, that's still not many types of ammo to deal with.
So, to my question: I can't find a reliable source of info anywhere comparing the ballistics of .357 mag out of an 1894C with the .30-30 from a 336.
I've read several comments in this and other threads to the effect of, "With appropriately hot rnds (e.g., Buffalo Bore), a .357 mag out of a carbine will rival a .30-30, at least inside 100 yds."
Could anyone offer up more information about that topic?
Why only to 100 yds? My suspicion is that the .30-30 is still going to be more effective on deer past 100 yds, at least to, say, 150. But I'm no ballistics expert.
Any links to good essays comparing those calibers, especially for deer, at modest ranges?
Opinions welcome.
Nem
4fingermick
Member
The 30/30 will move a 150 or 170Gn bullet along well over 2000fps. The 357 is a top little lever gun round, but a 158gn 357 will be below 2000fps I reckon, I haven't tried hotrodding my 357, got too many powerful rifles to bother running it pedal to the metal.
If you want hunting strength rounds, I'd be wary of the 1866. I have one in 44/40 and it does not like factory ammo, winchester factory loads stretched the frame, big dollars to fix. Maybe ok with the more modern ones, but I can't imagine it being much stronger. Mine is a Uberti form the 70s and it gets fed cowboy loads only.
I have a 357 Rossi and it is a hoot of a rifle and has ok sights, square notch rear and square front blade, good, clear sharp sight picture. I think th enew ones are not so good. My 44Mag, which is near new is useless in the sight area. Gold painted from round bead, buckhorn, rear, very hard to use, foresight disappears.
If I had to or wanted to get by on one, I'd choose the 30/30 and buy one of the new SSteel Marlins with the long barrel. They are a great bit of kit, I reckon the stocks look like sin, but I'd be prepared to put up with them.
A standard Marlin would be fine. If you are happy with open sights, a second hand Winchester would be the go as well. Bullet proof, but not so good to mount a telescopic sight on.
I have a 30A Glenfield paid for, awaiting the permit to take it home. I'm tempted to throw more money at it and get the new one (XS, XT or whatever it is).
Mick
If you want hunting strength rounds, I'd be wary of the 1866. I have one in 44/40 and it does not like factory ammo, winchester factory loads stretched the frame, big dollars to fix. Maybe ok with the more modern ones, but I can't imagine it being much stronger. Mine is a Uberti form the 70s and it gets fed cowboy loads only.
I have a 357 Rossi and it is a hoot of a rifle and has ok sights, square notch rear and square front blade, good, clear sharp sight picture. I think th enew ones are not so good. My 44Mag, which is near new is useless in the sight area. Gold painted from round bead, buckhorn, rear, very hard to use, foresight disappears.
If I had to or wanted to get by on one, I'd choose the 30/30 and buy one of the new SSteel Marlins with the long barrel. They are a great bit of kit, I reckon the stocks look like sin, but I'd be prepared to put up with them.
A standard Marlin would be fine. If you are happy with open sights, a second hand Winchester would be the go as well. Bullet proof, but not so good to mount a telescopic sight on.
I have a 30A Glenfield paid for, awaiting the permit to take it home. I'm tempted to throw more money at it and get the new one (XS, XT or whatever it is).
Mick
Hobie
Member
Lubbock Dave sold me a fine 1894C (he should NOT have sold) and I love it.
I have a Marlin 1894 in 357 Magnum. Instead of running it hot, I load sub-sonic for it.
Loading at 38 Special level, it is pretty quiet. I think it is as lound as an airgun.
My friends still making fun of mine. They all call it a Red Ryder. However, IMHO, it is one of the rifle that after I got it, I wonder why I didn't get it sooner.
-Pat
Loading at 38 Special level, it is pretty quiet. I think it is as lound as an airgun.
My friends still making fun of mine. They all call it a Red Ryder.
However, IMHO, it is one of the rifle that after I got it, I wonder why I didn't get it sooner.-Pat
atomchaser
Member
- Joined
- Jul 28, 2005
- Messages
- 407
You can find some stats on the a hot 357 out of a 1894c here: http://www.buffalobore.com/ammunition/default.htm#357
Not quite up to 30-30, but certainly adequate for deer within 100 yds.
I have an 1894c and really like it. An upgrade to peep sights and a replacement trigger is well worth it.
Not quite up to 30-30, but certainly adequate for deer within 100 yds.
I have an 1894c and really like it. An upgrade to peep sights and a replacement trigger is well worth it.
MCgunner
Member
The idea of the .357 rifle being anywhere close to .30-30 in exterior ballistics is just total BS. I'm sorry, but I have a .357 carbine and a chronograph and I can prove it's not. I'm very sceptical of Buffalo Bore's claims and even if they have some sort of magical loadiing recipe like Hornady does with light magnums, I wouldn't buy the stuff. My .308, my .257 Roberts, and my 7mm Remington Magnum are FAR better hunting rifles, no contest. Even my 12" TC Contender in .30-30 has better ballistics, effective on deer to 200 yards. It makes as much energy at 100 yards with a 150 grain Nosler ballistic tip as my .357 carbine does at the muzzle shooting 14.5 grains of 2400 and a 158 grain Lee hard cast annealed gas checked bullet. I've killed a doe at 80 yards with the little .357, lung shot, deer went about 25 yards and fell. So, yeah, it'll work on deer to 100 yards, but it's not a .30-30 and never will be. However, IT IS GREAT FUN AT THE RANGE!!!!!!!!!!!!! I love plinkin' with that thing, it's a total hoot! Mine is a Rossi M92 20" upon which I've added a ghost ring apperture sight.
I love plinkin' with that thing, it's a total hoot! Mine is a Rossi M92 20" upon which I've added a ghost ring apperture sight.arthurcw
Member
Until November, a .357 level gun was at the top of the "next gun" list. I can't wait until it's back at the top. I want one so bad. The one I really like above all is the Puma. But I'm a sucker for 16" barrels.
mainmech48
Member
I've expressed the opinion that having a pistol/revolver and a handy carbine chambered for the same cartridge is just as practical and 'tactical' today as it was back in 1875 here on several occasions. I still think so, and only wish that there were some options out there as affordable as the Marlin and Rossi for things like the 9x19, .40 S&W, and .45 ACP.
Two of my very favorite all-around fun guns are .357 carbines: a Rossi 92 'Trapper' and IMI Timberwolf pump. For my most common pursuits they get very nearly as much use as my beloved .22 RFs, and I'd even venture to say that they have several distinct advantages in versatility and effectiveness for many of those uses.
They're light, handy, slick working and extremely accurate with lead or jacketed bullets. Any .38 Spl. load except WCs will feed and function perfectly, and recoil/report are mild enough that an eight-year-old child can be introduced to CFs with ease. Though I wouldn't exactly consider any .357 to be an adequate substitute for a .30-30 to hunt deer or the like ordinarily, I'd feel more comfortable with it as my only option in a real pinch than I would a whole bunch of others.
For small game it's a real winner, especially where suburban sprawl has butted up against your favorite squirrel woods. The mild report isn't as likely to upset the soccer Moms or the other squirrels as much, and a 158 gr. LSWC with the right load is just as accurate and even more effective than a .22 HP out to 50 yds on edible critters.
For most 'realistic' SD/HD scenarios in an urban or suburban environment where a carbine might be called for the .357 has some distinct practical advantages compared to most 'real' rifles, IMO. Personally, unless the civil order has completely evaporated due to some cataclysmic event, I don't really anticipate having to repel hordes of looters or engage them at more than about fifty feet (our home is rather small;YMMV). In a more 'typical' home invasion/burglary or the like, 10 rds. of 125 gr. .357 that aren't as likely to exit the perp or my walls, blind or deafen me, coming from an 'antique-looking' little LA would seem to be just as effective and a whole lot less likely to get the local 'plaintiff's bar' revved-up to try and crucify me as a slavering Rambo than about anything else I can think of, off-hand.
Two of my very favorite all-around fun guns are .357 carbines: a Rossi 92 'Trapper' and IMI Timberwolf pump. For my most common pursuits they get very nearly as much use as my beloved .22 RFs, and I'd even venture to say that they have several distinct advantages in versatility and effectiveness for many of those uses.
They're light, handy, slick working and extremely accurate with lead or jacketed bullets. Any .38 Spl. load except WCs will feed and function perfectly, and recoil/report are mild enough that an eight-year-old child can be introduced to CFs with ease. Though I wouldn't exactly consider any .357 to be an adequate substitute for a .30-30 to hunt deer or the like ordinarily, I'd feel more comfortable with it as my only option in a real pinch than I would a whole bunch of others.
For small game it's a real winner, especially where suburban sprawl has butted up against your favorite squirrel woods. The mild report isn't as likely to upset the soccer Moms or the other squirrels as much, and a 158 gr. LSWC with the right load is just as accurate and even more effective than a .22 HP out to 50 yds on edible critters.
For most 'realistic' SD/HD scenarios in an urban or suburban environment where a carbine might be called for the .357 has some distinct practical advantages compared to most 'real' rifles, IMO. Personally, unless the civil order has completely evaporated due to some cataclysmic event, I don't really anticipate having to repel hordes of looters or engage them at more than about fifty feet (our home is rather small;YMMV). In a more 'typical' home invasion/burglary or the like, 10 rds. of 125 gr. .357 that aren't as likely to exit the perp or my walls, blind or deafen me, coming from an 'antique-looking' little LA would seem to be just as effective and a whole lot less likely to get the local 'plaintiff's bar' revved-up to try and crucify me as a slavering Rambo than about anything else I can think of, off-hand.
Danny Creasy
Member
I purchased my 1894C new just after they came out (Maybe 1979 or 80) at Woolco. "Woolco", can you believe that. I'm gettin old.
It has the MicroGroove barrel of course. So, bulk production caste reloads have never been its accuracy load. But, it would shoot .38 Special caste bullet reloads well enough to ring cowboy match steel plates (played that game until it became a beauty contest).
It groups really well with jacketed bullets and the heavier the better up to 180 grains. For deerhunting, I carried a 180 grain reload in it that would put five shots in an inch and a half at 50 yards. Problem is, I never got a shot at a deer on the few occasions I carried this little carbine hunting. I just about always preferred one of my scoped high-powered rifles for deer hunting. I have an 94 Winchester .30-30 set up with a William receiver sight. I must say that I would much prefer the .30-30 past 50 or 60 yards..
I shot it with the open sights for a couple of years and then picked up this nice little Lyman receiver sight at a B'ham gunshow (new in the box for $10 - what was that guy thinging) and put them on it. When I shot it in cowboy matches later, I reinstalled the semi buckhorn rear sight and would slide the Lyman sight out of its mount and be ready to go.
Now, I have the receiver sight back in and have driven out the open sight and put a dovetail slot filler in again. This is how she is gonna stay. Sighted in dead on at 50 with the 180 grain jacket HP reloads.
Every once in a while the gun banners start talking about a semi-auto ban. Well, if that gloomy day does come, I think this would make a pretty good little defensive carbine. Heck, it can even be fired one handed pretty well. We got a kick out of knocking a coffee can around once at 25 yards by just shooting it like a pistol with magnum loads.
It has the MicroGroove barrel of course. So, bulk production caste reloads have never been its accuracy load.
But, it would shoot .38 Special caste bullet reloads well enough to ring cowboy match steel plates (played that game until it became a beauty contest).It groups really well with jacketed bullets and the heavier the better up to 180 grains. For deerhunting, I carried a 180 grain reload in it that would put five shots in an inch and a half at 50 yards. Problem is, I never got a shot at a deer on the few occasions I carried this little carbine hunting. I just about always preferred one of my scoped high-powered rifles for deer hunting. I have an 94 Winchester .30-30 set up with a William receiver sight. I must say that I would much prefer the .30-30 past 50 or 60 yards..
I shot it with the open sights for a couple of years and then picked up this nice little Lyman receiver sight at a B'ham gunshow (new in the box for $10 - what was that guy thinging) and put them on it. When I shot it in cowboy matches later, I reinstalled the semi buckhorn rear sight and would slide the Lyman sight out of its mount and be ready to go.
Now, I have the receiver sight back in and have driven out the open sight and put a dovetail slot filler in again. This is how she is gonna stay. Sighted in dead on at 50 with the 180 grain jacket HP reloads.
Every once in a while the gun banners start talking about a semi-auto ban. Well, if that gloomy day does come, I think this would make a pretty good little defensive carbine. Heck, it can even be fired one handed pretty well. We got a kick out of knocking a coffee can around once at 25 yards by just shooting it like a pistol with magnum loads.
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