357 load development and casual observations

At the range today.. loaded 158 grain FMJ from precision delta over 6.2-7.2 grains of BE-86 (max is 7.8 according to Alliant). OAL was 1.590. Settled on 7 grains for a good middle of the road 357 plinking round. If you look at the data 6.2 is close to 38 special +P when you consider the longer case.
Overall I’m really happy with precision deltas bullet at about $.12 per bullet. Almost forgot - used cci small pistol magnum primer.
 
AJC1 said:
Blue dot is one I really wanted to try. It seems the most efficient by the numbers. I'm to infer it gets cranky up top?
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More like it gets cranky in cold weather. There was also some retarded hot loads for 125 grain bullets in manuals. Easiest fix was remove it from the list.
It's accurate with 180s. It rivals H110 for a fire ball.
 
Bfh_auto said:
More like it gets cranky in cold weather. There was also some retarded hot loads for 125 grain bullets in manuals. Easiest fix was remove it from the list.
It's accurate with 180s. It rivals H110 for a fire ball.
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Well if I ever find a pound local I'll snatch it up. I know a lot of people now are going lite and fast, I dont intend to go below a 140. I have a bag of 140xtps and I plan to try them out. Baring them setting my world on fire I will shoot 148 wc and heavier.
 
AJC1 said:
Well if I ever find a pound local I'll snatch it up. I know a lot of people now are going lite and fast, I dont intend to go below a 140. I have a bag of 140xtps and I plan to try them out. Baring them setting my world on fire I will shoot 148 wc and heavier.
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Well, not to go off topic but Blue Dot is a dandy with 300gr JSP in .44Mag. It’s just a little temperamental at low pressures is all. If you ever load up 170gr (Lyman’s #358429) w/ Linotype in .38Spl go on the high side of Lyman’s 48th data and you’ll be surprised how smooth and clean it runs. I wouldn’t go closer to max than a full grain without careful work up.
 
AJC1 said:
Well if I ever find a pound local I'll snatch it up. I know a lot of people now are going lite and fast, I dont intend to go below a 140. I have a bag of 140xtps and I plan to try them out. Baring them setting my world on fire I will shoot 148 wc and heavier.
Click to expand...
It's definitely worth grabbing. Auto comp makes a great light 357 bullet powder also.
 
Some IMR 4227 data.

Henry H012GM (20" barrel)
Star Brass- 1.28" trim
SNS 158gr LCRN COATED
1.59" OAL
FED SPM
10 shot groups

12.0gr- 1126 FPS- SD: 41.37- ES: 134
12.6gr- 1228 FPS- SD: 46.24- ES: 166
13.2gr- 1269 FPS- SD: 33.96- ES: 103
13.8gr- 1352 FPS- SD: 37.33- ES: 106
14.4gr- 1432 FPS- SD: 44.86- ES: 177

Needs more testing. I started on the lowest end of data that I found so as to not push the coated lead bullet too fast, I wasn't sure what velocities I'd actually get.

Gonna try another ladder with data from 14.4-16.0gr and see what happens. SNS says to keep their coated pistol bullets 1500 FPS and below so if I get leading at any of the higher end charges I'll have to back down but only testing will tell.
 
Well I ran the initial tests on 4227 in 38 cases up to 20kpsi with the ribs 180 sil bullet. At 9.5 grains things did not clean up. I saved the last 20 rounds with all the different primers, until I go to the big range and have the chronograph. Even my lowest charge was accurate and was easy shooting out of the little trapper marlin carbine. My son who likes 38s better normally was not against shooting them up. So far I give the win to 2400 in the 20k psi range, but the testing will continue. I will try unique soon but my universal is unopened at this point and currently I prefer not to have every powder I own opened. I might like to see how cfep stacks up.
 
Whelp, some notes from the range...

This morning I took my LCR .357 to the indoor range near me. Up first was a load consisting of a 135 gr Speer GD and 15 gr 2400. In a full size revolver these would be quite manageable, but in the little 17oz LCR they were brutal. I shot some of these several years ago to chronograph them, but was shooting off a bench outdoors. They made 1110 fps out of the 1-7/8" LCR barrel, very respectable.

But this a.m. I was shooting off-hand and had a totally different experience. I literally stopped after 10 shots. Recoil was very violent, as was expected, but even with the Hogue Tamer grip, the shock to the shooting hand was painful. It eventually gave me a mild sprain which I can still feel at the area of the base of the thumb. The muzzle blast blew flecks of paint off the side wall of the shooting stall that floated through the air like little snowflakes. I doubled my hearing protection with foam plugs and muffs but I can confidently state if you shot one of these from that stubby barrel in a closely confined area, you would be instantly, potentially permanently, deafened.

I resorted to some .38 Spl 125 gr Remington JHP I had loaded years ago to +P in nickel R-P cases. Ahhhhh...now that's more like it. I could control the weapon instead of having to pull the muzzle down from the air. Recoil was respectable but not insane. My hand didn't feel like it was getting punched by a heavy weight boxer.

Maybe just getting old :)

buQJccvOe3k-I09Ib4nDi4Xl6uqwH-i2YsV_Z6IGY7dSGZh_Ic4rCYbMSaJCQ8bjuVIeV-A=w1200-h842-no?authuser=0.jpg
 
LaneP said:
Whelp, some notes from the range...

This morning I took my LCR .357 to the indoor range near me. Up first was a load consisting of a 135 gr Speer GD and 15 gr 2400. In a full size revolver these would be quite manageable, but in the little 17oz LCR they were brutal. I shot some of these several years ago to chronograph them, but was shooting off a bench outdoors. They made 1110 fps out of the 1-7/8" LCR barrel, very respectable.

But this a.m. I was shooting off-hand and had a totally different experience. I literally stopped after 10 shots. Recoil was very violent, as was expected, but even with the Hogue Tamer grip, the shock to the shooting hand was painful. It eventually gave me a mild sprain which I can still feel at the area of the base of the thumb. The muzzle blast blew flecks of paint off the side wall of the shooting stall that floated through the air like little snowflakes. I doubled my hearing protection with foam plugs and muffs but I can confidently state if you shot one of these from that stubby barrel in a closely confined area, you would be instantly, potentially permanently, deafened.

I resorted to some .38 Spl 125 gr Remington JHP I had loaded years ago to +P in nickel R-P cases. Ahhhhh...now that's more like it. I could control the weapon instead of having to pull the muzzle down from the air. Recoil was respectable but not insane. My hand didn't feel like it was getting punched by a heavy weight boxer.

Maybe just getting old :)

View attachment 1065412
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F=ma. Always and everywhere.
 
Yes, I too had a couple LCR .357's and eventually realized I was going to hurt myself with the magnums.

It's not just discomfort, or the slower follow-up shots, but feeling that the next shot might tear or break something in you hand.

So, a mild .357 or hot .38 became the thing to carry and train with, but with that I realized I could have the lower recoil and a 6th shot with .327 Federal / .32 Magnum. I sold / traded my .357's to a buddy and got .327 LCR's for my wife and I.

But then the new Colt King Cobras came out. I felt the trigger on one and was back into .357. .38 / .357 is much easier in a 32 oz gun than a 17 oz gun that's for sure.

I can tolerate a few cylinders of 1050 fps 158 loads from the Colt and another 100 .38 / .38 +p every other week and not regret it at all.

Its also important to consider the long-term health of our hands and joints.
 
Shivahasagun said:
Yes, I too had a couple LCR .357's and eventually realized I was going to hurt myself with the magnums.

It's not just discomfort, or the slower follow-up shots, but feeling that the next shot might tear or break something in you hand.

So, a mild .357 or hot .38 became the thing to carry and train with, but with that I realized I could have the lower recoil and a 6th shot with .327 Federal / .32 Magnum. I sold / traded my .357's to a buddy and got .327 LCR's for my wife and I.

But then the new Colt King Cobras came out. I felt the trigger on one and was back into .357. .38 / .357 is much easier in a 32 oz gun than a 17 oz gun that's for sure.

I can tolerate a few cylinders of 1050 fps 158 loads from the Colt and another 100 .38 / .38 +p every other week and not regret it at all.

Its also important to consider the long-term health of our hands and joints.
Click to expand...
I spend very little time shooting full power loads with slow powders. The 8.4 grains of Silhouette and 8.8 grains of true blue is the bulk of my shooting. I'm playing with cfep right now building some test loads. I test the full range from minimum 38 loads to full house 357 with most stuff. I went off grid with true blue and tested 180 grain loads vise 38spl. I'll get there eventually.
 
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On a recent order of more 45-70 projectiles I got some different profiles of 158gr 38/357 projectiles to try out. Sample packs of 100rds of each, SNS RNFP and SWC. Loaded some ladders up with I4227. My testing with the round nose has shown some good SD & ES over the chrono but not the accuracy I'd like out of my Henry so I though a change of bullet style might be in order.

With the RNFP the length of base to crimp groove is close enough I could stay within my current testing charge span of 14.4gr to 16.0gr with .4gr intervals but with the SWC I had to reduce the max due to lack of space for I4227 to 14.0 to 15.2 with .3gr intervals. 10rds each interval for 50rds total with each projectile type.

If I have any good news to report after my range trip this weekend I'll post a follow up.
 
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