357 Load Dilemma

[dh1633pm]

Powder choice dilemma for my Colt King Cobra. Fairly new to loading for 357. Got a bunch of bullets. This is the problem. I used IMR4227, loaded up to what would be the low end of .357. Magnum primers.

The load shoots well, but doesn’t burn well. Too much gunk. It clogs up the works. To me this means I need a faster powder. This is what I got.

125 grain Remington HP’s
148 grain Full Wadcutters (I weighted them myself)

Powders I have in burn rate order:

Bullseye, Trail Boss, IMR Green, W231

Unique, No 5, No 9, Lil Gun

W231, W296, IMR4227, H4227

AA5744

Primers: SFP, SPP, MSPP

I could resolve this by process of elimination. I also know if I post for a load, I will get as many suggestions as there are member who shoot .357. Not a bad thing. Many years of experience here, (the high road.org). I was looking for suggestions on the powder to keep from clogging up the works. I want to keep them on the lower side so my wife can enjoy it too. I have shot magnum loads out of it. They snap a little more than a 686.

Got a Kimber K6S Target to pick up as soon as the Judge signs off on it, a NY thing. But we’re not loading for it just yet. Except to shoot up the ones I loaded with 4227.

 

[The Bushmaster]

For low end loads use W231 for the high end use W296. I would not use 125 grain bullets. Anything from 140 grain and up in jacketed HPs.

 

[AJC1]

That 125 and 6-7 grains of Unique is just so easy. I never saw a major accuracy shift with Unique like I have with others. You could definitely go higher but that doesn't match your interest.
231/hp38 would be an easy shooting clean load.
4227 is much better with heavy bullets at or near max in longer barrels.

 

[dh1633pm]

Thanks. Unique with the 125’s. W231 for the WC’s.

 

[AJC1]

Thanks. Unique with the 125’s. W231 for the WC’s.

The wc classic load is Bullseye in the high 2 low 3 grain area.

 

[dannyd]

If your just shooting paper W231 and the 148 WC's work well, but they work better if used in a 38 special case. Any of the primers will work. Fun shooting is 3.0 W231 and the 148 with a spp that from Hodgdon web site.

 

[dh1633pm]

I am using .357 cases. All I got at the moment.

 

[mdi]

Most powders will burn "dirty" if not loaded to their optimum level. This is how Unique got a bad rep for "flaming dirt" when loaded light under light bullets. I would try mid to upper charges of Unique under a 125 gr JHP...

 

[Bfh_auto]

If you're just target shooting. Bullseye is hard to beat.
If you want closer to Magnum. But not quite. Try the unique or #5.
If you're wanting Magnum. 296 is it. But don't use light bullets. It will wreck a gun in a hurry if you do.

 

[Rule3]

IMR 4227 is a medium burn speed, magnum pistol propellant. If a pistol says Magnum, IMR 4227 is the choice for true magnum velocities and performance.

So yes, if you don't load to full mag load data, then it will not do well, Kinda like H110 or W296
Big difference between the low and max load data

Not the powder for just punching paper holes.

 

[AJC1]

IMR 4227 is a medium burn speed, magnum pistol propellant. If a pistol says Magnum, IMR 4227 is the choice for true magnum velocities and performance.

So yes, if you don't load to full mag load data, then it will not do well, Kinda like H110 or W296
Big difference between the low and max load data

Not the powder for just punching paper holes.

I refute it being a medium speed magnum powder. I contend its the slowest magnum powder available, and reduced loadings suck...

 

[Rule3]

I refute it being a medium speed magnum powder. I contend its the slowest magnum powder available, and reduced loadings suck...

Take it up with Hodgdon. It is Medium in relation to all the powders on the burn rate chart.
Yes it is a slow pistol powder.

 

[AJC1]

Take it up with Hodgdon. It is Medium in relation to all the powders on the burn rate chart.
Yes it is a slow pistol powder.

History says it was developed as a fast rifle powder and acts more like 1680 and rl7 than 2400. I'm not arguing the statement, but trying to provide the op usable insight.

 

[ballman6711]

In my original 90's vintage King Cobra (slightly less than a 6" barrel) I like a near max load of W231 under a 158gr bullet. Recoil is mild enough that I could shoot it all day, but it still burns clean and cases are mostly soot free.

I also have an H110 load (same as W296) that has a lot more recoil using the same 158gr bullet, but it's not unpleasant to shoot. Just a big fireball and the gun climbs quite a bit. I stopped in the middle of the load range since accuracy was good and I didn't feel I needed more oomph. Might want to avoid this one if your wife is going to shoot it.

I have some IMR4227 that I want to try, but haven't yet so can't comment on that. I haven't used any of your other powders either.

I also load the same 158gr bullet with 3.9gr of W231 in a 38spcl case. It's an absolute powder puff load that is very accurate in my gun. Recoil is similar to a 22LR. Your wife might really like that one, but you will have to make sure to clean the cylinders from time to time to avoid the dreaded carbon ring.

Your 148gr wadcutters will take less powder than my 158gr bullets, but I would recommend trying the W231.

Haven't tried Trailboss yet, but it's in my powder cabinet and on my list.

chris

 

[dannyd]

Trail Boss is a powder that is good for something's and not others. I have loaded 19,349 rounds with Trail Boss all were used for SASS and under 15 yards 125 RF cast bullet. They worked great for me, but out between 25 and 50 yards I would use just about anything else.

Trail Boss also has a hard time metering in a powder measure.

The 1 pound bottle of Trail Boss only has 9 ounces that's 3937 grains instead of 7000 grains. This may help with your round mileage.

 

[Seedy Character]

Bullseye 3.2 gr
Trail Boss 3.6 gr 95 gr LRN 2.2 gr plink load
Unique 6.0 gr
Aa #5 9.2 gr

I like the 125 bullets.


Lil Gun is best for rifle loads, not great in short barrels.

 

[dannyd]

I have never used a bullet under 115 grains in a 38 special but would definitely like to try one. Need to hunt down a mould.

The bullet on the left is a Lyman 115 SWC hardest bullet I have ever tried to cast.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

Powder choice dilemma for my Colt King Cobra. Fairly new to loading for 357. Got a bunch of bullets. This is the problem. I used IMR4227, loaded up to what would be the low end of .357. Magnum primers.

The load shoots well, but doesn’t burn well. Too much gunk. It clogs up the works. To me this means I need a faster powder. This is what I got.

125 grain Remington HP’s
148 grain Full Wadcutters (I weighted them myself)

Powders I have in burn rate order:

Bullseye, Trail Boss, IMR Green, W231

Unique, No 5, No 9, Lil Gun

W231, W296, IMR4227, H4227

AA5744

Primers: SFP, SPP, MSPP

I could resolve this by process of elimination. I also know if I post for a load, I will get as many suggestions as there are member who shoot .357. Not a bad thing. Many years of experience here, (the high road.org). I was looking for suggestions on the powder to keep from clogging up the works. I want to keep them on the lower side so my wife can enjoy it too. I have shot magnum loads out of it. They snap a little more than a 686.

Got a Kimber K6S Target to pick up as soon as the Judge signs off on it, a NY thing. But we’re not loading for it just yet. Except to shoot up the ones I loaded with 4227.

If the 125gr Remingtons are Golden Saber BJHP they will have a driving band you will want to be aware of. Probably are already but I’m at the age I need reminding of things I already know and figure maybe I’m not alone in that. Anyway, light bullets in .357 need a fast powder. Bullseye, W231, or No. 5. I’ve found the Lyman’s 45th and the Western 7th to have the most useful starting loads. If it’s not a GS BJHP and just the plain copper cup-n-core JHP, go with Unique in the 7-8 grain range or No.9 at the v.8 Western manual starting load.

Regardless of the caliber or cartridge, wadcutters love Bullseye and W231. Universal and Unique are good for upper end anti-critter defense loads - again in the 7-8gr range.

IMR 4227 needs pressure, a heavy bullet to push, not much air gap and a lot of barrel to burn in for it to play nicely. Otherwise it gets kinda lazy and dirty. Great for hunting loads; lousy for plinking loads.

I think you’ve got a good selection of powders there. I like Bullseye and Unique best for less than full throttle magnum but that’s just me being stuck in a rut.

 

[Bfh_auto]

History says it was developed as a fast rifle powder and acts more like 1680 and rl7 than 2400. I'm not arguing the statement, but trying to provide the op usable insight.

When it says medium. That means medium when compared to everything from fast shotgun powders to the slowest Magnum rifle powders.
They didn't mean medium in Magnum pistol powders.
Like you I found it to be too slow for most pistol loads.

 

[Bill M.]

If you only have those 2 bullets available: W231 for the 125 jacketed. Bullseye for the wadcutters. The wadcutters with the Bullseye will work up to be the light recoil load. The data available for the 125 jacketed bullets moves them pretty fast. If you want really nice low recoil loads buy some plated bullets in 125 and push them with the Trail Boss, Or the Bullseye. Or the W231. I load all my light .357 loads in the .357 case. I just do not see the point in loading .38 cases for a .357 chamber. Particularly with coated or plated or lead bullets.

 

[dh1633pm]

It’s not that I can’t get other bullets. These are what I have it great supply. So why not use what I have.

I figured a couple thing. One people who post here are pretty experienced. Second, I need to consider that some powders work better in certain scenarios than others. Hence the post. Your responses will save me a lot of trial and error. So thanks. I am going to load a few when I get a chance. I have 50 sitting in a tray in the basement. All primed. Not scared of magnum loads. Shot plenty of my dad’s. Just looking to load on the lower end of magnum. Let me try a few and see how they go. Also load up some stouter ones.

I shot 45 Colt while it was snowing out today. Cold, but a blast. I mention this because I found an H110 load with 250 grain jacketed that are a hoot and accurate as well. Through hard won trial and error. Something that would be good to avoid.

 

[Bill M.]

The Win 231 would be my choice then. But maybe because it is one of the few on your list I have tried. I would not want anything slower for 125 grain jacketed.

 

[N555]

Load unique near the top end it should run clean enough.

 

[Docendo Discimus]

W231/HP38 is great for anything from low power to say 90% of a magnum load. I load alot of 357 and use more W231 than anything else. For full power magnum W296/H110 is hard to beat.
Below is info from the hodgdon site, it is pretty close to the bullet you are describing, it is a good starting point.

 

[BJung]

I've only tried BE, AA5, and AA9 on your list. BE is a classic target load powder. I once did a search online to find what load was the most common. 2.7grBE was the most common for a 38-148WC load with 2.7gr BE was the most common followed by 2.8gr and one at 3.1gr. I haven't tested enough 125gr bullets to tell you how well the three powders I use performed. AA9 makes a good full charge load using 158gr JHP bullets.