45-70 splits

[S.billy]

I'm shooting 45-70 with 14.5 grains of trailboss with a 300 grain lead bullet. I'm getting some case failures. Would annealing help this.

 

[gamestalker]

Where are they splitting? Are these case head separations, neck splits, or down the body?

If they are splitting down the body or case head failures, then annealing will accomplish nothing, but instead weaken the case the problem area even more.

GS

 

[tightgroup tiger]

That depends on where the case is splitting at, if it splitting through the side then no it won't help.

If it's at the neck, it may.

What are you shooting these in and what case brand are you using?

 

[S.billy]

sorry I thought I attached a photo most are what I would call the neck. Thanks

 

[S.billy]

Case brand is Remington and Winchester. They are shop in a h&r and a h&r trapdoor

 

[Sunray]

Annealing is done that far down the case.
No neck on a straight walled case. They been reloaded often?

 

[S.billy]

Dont track the exact count but I'm guessing 3-4 times all light loads for paper

 

[gamestalker]

Are there any pressures signs, how is primer flow, do they extract easily.

Those type splits that far down on a straight walled can sometimes be attributed to high pressures, and also could be brass is beyond it's life span.

I've never annealed brass, but I'm almost certain you don't anneal a straight walled case. I would think that would defeat the integrity of the case mouth, thus inducing splits extending from the mouth down.

Have you pulled any of the loaded cartridges and checked the charges to make sure it's consistent with your intended charge? That said, are you using a scale to verify the charge is what you think it is?

GS

 

[MEHavey]

Anneal that first inch and don't size any more than is necessary to get moderate retention. Crimp for final retention.
I strongly advise using 750 Tempilaq inside the neck to do this.

 

[S.billy]

I don't see any pressure signs and they extracted easy.

 

[rcmodel]

What have you cleaned the brass with in the past??

The ragged tears are not typical of split brass.

More like brass weakened by ammonia cleaner or something.

rc

 

[gamestalker]

Ah, good question RC. Thinking zinc leaching maybe? I hadn't considered that possible aspect.

And what about charge verification, once again, how did you check the charges you used?

And have you pulled any remaining loads to check the charge weight?

Still a couple unanswered questions we need in order to further help diagnose this anomaly.

GS

 

[S.billy]

I clean with lyman red media. I have a rcbs beam scale that I use. Some of the brass has been loaded one time with black powder from my father in law. Would that cause the brass failure I was cleaned with normal dish detergent that time. Thanks for all the help

 

[MEHavey]

Black powder cases simply scrubbed out w/ ordinary dish-soapy water (like you
described) should outlast just about anything.**

Per before, I'd suggest minimal resizing. Run the depriming plug way out of the
case and lock the plug/die body ring at that point to make it easy/repeatable.






**
(I use a soapy 410 shotgun swab to clean the inside of my BPCR cases. As good as
they ever were for years now.... Some 45x3¼ Sharps cases from 1981 in fact)

 

[GooseGestapo]

Something has damaged that brass.
What bullet lube are you using?

I saw something similar with some .35Rem I loaded with an early lot# of H322 (surplus I bought in bulk).
It deteriorated and ate up the brass causing some case failures similar to yours. Attempting to load the brass pulled the neck off the cases.

I've also seen similar splitting from .45/70 and SPG left loaded for several years. I believe it's something in the lube "eating" the brass.