.45 cal. Flintlock loads

[Smithiac]

Hello,

I have got a question about Flintlocks this one is a .45cal using round ball and patch, Goex Black powder I believe 60grn. the POI is way low and the sight screw is about to run out of threads and I am wondering if that is not enough powder or if there is somthing else that I might be doing wrong.

Thanks in advance

 

[desidog]

Sight-screw on a rocklock? what make and model gun?

generally speaking, you can file down the front sight to bring up the POI.

 

[Smithiac]

It is a Thompson Center There is no model on it anywhere

 

[desidog]

Sorry, i misread that to mean that the screw was on the front sight, not the rear.....

before filing, i'd try different types of ammo. maybe some maxi's

 

[arcticap]

That sounds unusual for it to be shooting low.
There should be more information than being provided.
What size balls, patches and loads are being loaded?
What's the distance to the target and how low is it shooting?
Where in the rear sight notch are you holding the bead when you've aquired the sight picture? Can you raise the bead enough within the rear notch (or just above it) to raise the impact of the ball at 50 yards?
I wonder if the front sight is original, which model it is (a Hawken maybe?) and if it's a kit gun with a K serial number prefix or not.
If it's a factory gun then TC will generally fix the problem for free. Maybe there's something wrong with your rear sight elevating properly. If there's supposed to be a spring maybe it's missing, or the screw was lost and the replacement isn't long enough, or the wrong front sight was installed.
Do you have the flat, squared front partridge sight or a bead post front sight?
Pictures might even help to determine the model and to see if you have a set of factory sights.
There's always the possibility that you're not putting your face down low enough on the stock due to the rifle not fitting you properly. Maybe you require a longer length of pull and can add a slip on butt pad to test that theory out.
I guess that the bore could be drilled off center, but that may need to be left to TC to check out.
I can only fathom what else could be wrong. If you're shooting at 50 yards and your sights and barrel are original TC, then there shouldn't be such a problem.
Are you closing one eye when you aim and using your dominant eye?
Maybe you're relaxing when you pull the trigger and letting the muzzle drop?
Are you shooting offhand, off the bench or both?
I wouldn't change anything until you are more sure of what's causing the problem.
Does it at least shoot good groups at 50 yards?

 

[Loyalist Dave]

On the other hand...,
If you wuz impatent like me, you'd swap out that front sight for a thin, silver blade, from Track of The Wolf, then carefully file it down from the top, to raise your point of aim some, and then start over with adjusting your sight.

LD

 

[Smithiac]

I have been shooting at about 25yds I can't get it to even hit the paper at 50. unless I really raise it up. My sight picture is just how I think it should be -_- with the front sight right in between the two upper lines I am shooting at least 8in. low consistantly with a dead on hold off of a bench. I am not interested in getting away from the ball and patch. I am using a factory ball and a patch cut from bed ticking. I don't know the thicknesses off the top of my head I will try to measure them and get back to you on that.

Here are some pics of the sights and lock:

http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii194/bdbatta/photo-45.jpg

http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii194/bdbatta/photo-44.jpg

http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii194/bdbatta/photo-43.jpg

Do you think 60grns of goex is enough.

Thanks
Smithiac

 

[GENTLEMAN OF THE CHARCOAL]

XXXX

 

[arcticap]

Your rear sight base looks to be too high to me. At least it looks higher than most TC rear sights, particularly those that I see on the Renegades. However, you brass wedge leads me to believe that you have a Hawken. While I'm not real familiar with Hawken sights, I still think that your rear sight base looks higher than some other Hawkens.
I went to eBay and did a search for "Thompson Center" and looked at a lot of rear sights. Most all of them look like they have lower bases.
For instance, below are pictures of a Hawken barrel for sale.
Notice that the rear sight base seems to be lower than yours. I wonder if you have an early model with a different sight, or if your sight set was just not properly matched.

There's still more to consider though.
Are your patches and balls loading tight enough?

The other question is, are you putting your face all of the way down on the stock? I've seen how some folks have actually sanded down the comb of their TC stock so that they could get their face down low enough. Maybe on some of the early TC's, in order to avoid that problem, they made a higher rear sight that was just too high?

Or are you a tall person shooting with a stock that's too short?

That's why I mentioned to use a buttpad to lengthen the stock. That would move your head back to the part of stock where the comb is lower.

If the fit of the stock isn't bad, then it's probably your sights.

So your choices seem to be to send it in to TC or to fix it yourself by cutting down your front sight.
Hopefully the rear sight will still have some room for adjustment, but you may not have any bead left on the front sight.

One last question, have you ever let someone else shoot your rifle to see where it shoots for another person?

 

[4v50 Gary]

Ditto what Loyalist Dave, that Tory , did.

My uncle hated that thick blade that comes with the TC. He replaced it with a thinner silver one. He might add two pieces of steel on each side. When the steel rusts, it'll provide two dark spots so the silver blade will stand out more. It'll help cut out the glare from the shiny silver blade too.

 

[RockRifle]

Most new traditional smokepoles shoot low!

Common practice is to get them on paper at twenty five yards, adjust the windage (right and left) and then move out to fifty yards. All of mine have taken filing on the front blade to get enough adjustment out of the rear sight.(better too much than too little!!) Have someone hold your rifle so that you file flat across the top of the blade, and work a little at a time. (when removing metal, better too little than too much!)
Rule of thumb for powder charge is start with the # of grains equal to the caliber. My .54 shoots nice with about 62, but I started at about 55 and worked up to a number that shot clean for a string of 20 shots in my corner of the world. Temperature, Humidity, and brand of powder all contribute, so experiment with what your rifle likes.

 

[banek]

I have a 54 Hawken with a Green Mountain barrel on it. One thing I always do is run a wet then a dry patch after every shot. It only takes a minute and I figure my first shot is coming out of a clean barrel. The G M barrel rifling is about .012 deep and I believe TC's are about half that so foaling (Is that spelled right?) is much more common. Also try to find your patches after you shoot. They should not be cut. Frayed yes but not cut. If cut then try a smaller load. If this is a new rifle you might want to swab the barrel out with extra fine steel wool or Scotch Bright soaked in oil for as long as it takes to sing your favorite song from the 50's. Got that from an old (my age) gun builder. If you sing Disco you might blow your head off!

 

[banek]

I really hate computers!!!

 

[hockea]

Sounds more like 60grns would be pretty much under powered; it takes 90grns for my .45 Hatfield to group at 50 yds.

Here's a link to the published loading data for TC

http://hunting.about.com/od/blackpowder/a/tcrifleloads.htm

 

[brotherlloyd]

what do your 25 yard groups look like

 

[brotherlloyd]

as a rule at 25 yards start with 1 gr pr cal. 45 for the 45. shoot 3-5 shot groups adding 4-5 grains of powder at a time till u find the sweet spot with the tight group. mark that target when you find the load the rifle likes. then keep going till the group opens up to much. back off a few grns. and that should be you hunting load. I would want to put 100 rounds through the rifle before i file anything. also read your patches and i like a wasp nest filler.

 

[BlackNet]

Many ppl at the local range use 30 grains in their 45 cal barrels. also that rear sight looks quite high. What is the distance off the barrel? The long rifle I am building the rear sight is .2245 high.

 

[Macgille]

It is difficult tell but in your post you show the rear sight as higher than the front sight. Both the front sight and the rear sight should be on the same level. This is called sight alignment, the front sight centered in the notch of the rear and the tops of both sights level with each other. If the front sight is lower in the notch you will shoot low. As I say typing on the computer is not the same as drawing a picture so I may be wrong, but if you sight the way the illustration shows yu would be shooting very low.

 

[Fingers McGee]

If the POI is lower than your POA, the rear sight has to be moved the same way you want the POI to move; the rear sight needs to go up to bring the POI up. The adjustment is the opposite for the front sight. In order to move the POI up, the front sight needs to be lower.

I've had good luck in the past (back in my rondy days) with replacing TC and/or CVA sights with an adjustable buckhorn rear and a silver blade front sight from Track of the Wolf.