480 or 454

[mavracer]

If costs are a factor, the 454 is a lot more economical than a 480 to shoot, whether you handload or shoot factory ammo.

With similar cast bullet loads I wouldn't say "a lot more" The 480 is a little more efficient with powder offsetting the cost of lead, besides that like arguing that your Lamborgini gets better milage than my Ferrari.

 

[Takem406]

So the 7.5" SRH weighs 53oz. Only 4 Oz more than the RH 44 I carried last year... Hhhhhmmmm

 

[TimSr]

The OP mentioned grizzlies, and a desire to hunt bear with a handgun.

Either gun is more than adequate for bear hunting, which probably means black bear, and I pretty much just ignored the grizzly bear defense part as that subject has been beat to death, but if someone were ever in that situation, all circumstances being the same, I doubt the difference between the two would be enough to change the outcome.

 

[Takem406]

The worst part about the griz gun debate is there's such a lack of real world evidence either way as to what's the best bear handgun lol. Most of the guys in the debate are in their mom's basements back east some where. I think mace would be fine but the wind where I'd be likey to find a griz blows really bad.

 

[eldon519]

Do you handload? If so, Magnum Research makes a .500JRH BFR. It is a normal-length .50 based on the S&W that only gives up around 100-200fps over its big brother while fitting in a normally sized package. I have had my eye on one for a long time. What has always held me back about the .475 caliber is I can never find particularly cheap cast bullets for it. They are pretty common in .45 and .500 however. I've seen 400gr .50s as cheap as $.12/bullet. I don't know if you can ever really call a 400gr bullet "plinking" but pair it with some Trailboss and you'd have all the fun your wrist could take without breaking the bank.

 

[22-rimfire]

480 is what I would choose and I would suggest the BFR in 475 Linebaugh/480 Ruger as the practical gun of choice although the new Blackhawk has lot of appeal especially if you are carrying it in addition to a bow or rifle. I like the increased bullet diameter over 45 cal. I started with the SRH and later got a BFR which is more pleasant to shoot. Normal factory loads of 480 (Horandy 325 gr XTP) is a fairly big jump in power from normal 44 mag loads. They say about 30% more power. You definitely notice a difference if you shoot them. The XTP is a very good hunting bullet for everything other than large bears.

As far as the 41 mag goes (4" M57), it is my defensive gun in the woods if I choose to carry a gun for that purpose other than a 22. The 41 mag did not loose police interest (1964) due to semi-auto handguns. The first ammo that was available were magnum loaded 41's versus the lighter police loads. Police departments decided that the recoil was too much for their regular officers with the magnum loads. The semi-auto (wonder nine) thing started around 1980.

The 480 is not going to die a "not so slow death". It certainly is a niche caliber. If all you hunt is deer, you really don't need one.

 

[cmb3366]

Just my take, but once you play with some hot loads in a model 69, you might not want much more gun. Heavy loads from a 38oz handgun should scratch the big boomer itch, I know it did for me. Beyond that, I don't see a lot of point in a SRH or SBH size revolver, rather carry a rifle if I want to scope or sling it.

 

[Takem406]

I was looking at bullet selection tonight for the 475. Not much out there for hunting bullets, or expending bullets. The Hornady, Barnes and then of course cast. But brass doesn't seem that expensive.

 

[Coal Dragger]

I chose the .454 as my first foray into the big bore revolver.

As others have mentioned, dead is dead, but the .454 held the following advantages for me as chambered in a single action revolver.

1.) More commonly available ammo, even if it's only .45 Colt at least it goes bang in a pinch.

2.) More commonly available reloading components.

3.) More velocity for a flatter trajectory, and more reliable performance with expanding bullets. I know everyone seems stuck on solids in these boomers, but after pounding some big rocks into small rocks with 300gr Speer Deep Curl bonded core bullets driven at max velocity I'm pretty confident in tough expanding bullets.

4.) The ability to use an auxiliary cylinder in .45ACP. I have a Dillon XL650 and a bucket full of .45ACP brass at any given time. Practice makes perfect, and I get a hell of a lot more practice shooting my spare cylinder and dirt cheap .45ACP reloads than I get shooting even the cheapest .454 reloads. Plus it saves wear on more expensive. 454 brass. Not to mention my hands, wrists, and elbows.

 

[Takem406]

Yeah after looking at bullet availability not sure on that 480. And Colts would shoot like a 38 out of a heavy gun...

 

[Zaydok Allen]

Yeah after looking at bullet availability not sure on that 480. And Colts would shoot like a 38 out of a heavy gun...

Yes they will. However accuracy can suffer a bit due to the long jump the bullet will have to make in the longer 454 cylinder. But since you hand load, I'm sure you can work up a 45 Colt load that will shoot as desired out of your gun.

 

[Takem406]

What I "should" do is buy a 44 for a backpacking carrying gun then buy the Smith 460 I've wanted ever since Wayne Van Zwoll let me shoot the one he was reviewing back in 2006... Only got to shoot it once but that was enough to get me hooked!

 

[CraigC]

I doubt the difference between the two would be enough to change the outcome.

Yeah, the .475 is only ~100gr or 30% heavier.

Not much out there for hunting bullets, or expending bullets.

Then I don't think you're looking in the right place. You don't need expanding bullets anyway. There are three jacketed bullets from Speer, two from Hornady and a plethora of cast bullets available. I've been shooting the .480 for ten years and have never found bullet selection wanting.

I don't see a lot of point in a SRH or SBH size revolver, rather carry a rifle if I want to scope or sling it.

I reckon you don't plan on doing any handgun hunting then.

 

[homers]

plenty of videos on youtube showing both recoil and effects of the 44 mag, 45 Colt, 454, 460 and 480. There are some that do comparisons.

 

[cmb3366]

I reckon you don't plan on doing any handgun hunting then.

If by that you mean carrying only a handgun during general firearms season, no. My view on a handgun in the woods is that it is a complement to a rifle for use when a shorter range opportunity arises. I get my up close and personal itch scratched with my compound bow early in the season. YMMV.

 

[22-rimfire]

Carrying a handgun as the primary is the ONLY way to handgun hunt big game. Any other approach, either the gun is too heavy, it is not accessible when you might want it, the handgun limits your access to your rifle, or you choose the rifle for the more sure kill. So, handgun hunting is not for you.

 

[Cowhide Cliff]

I was looking at bullet selection tonight for the 475. Not much out there for hunting bullets, or expending bullets. The Hornady, Barnes and then of course cast. But brass doesn't seem that expensive.

You must have not looked in the right place. Spear Gold Dot 325's are great and if you want to see a real expanding bullet you should see the hole a .475 275 grain speer gold dot makes and the lighter bullet in a 480 screams with speeds comparable to many of the 454 loads.

There certainly is no lack of selection of good hunting bullets available for a 480. I've been hunting with that round for over 10 years and have never felt bullet selection was lacking.

 

[jski]

Get the .454 and shoot .45 Colts with it. Make them stiff .45 Colts, as stiff as you want.

 

[Tactical Lever]

Either gun is more than adequate for bear hunting, which probably means black bear, and I pretty much just ignored the grizzly bear defense part as that subject has been beat to death, but if someone were ever in that situation, all circumstances being the same, I doubt the difference between the two would be enough to change the outcome.

Both rounds are approaching impact velocities and bullet weight and momentum of old 45-70 loads at typical hunting ranges. Everything that walks has been taken already with less gun. I'd give the 480 the edge with heavier 400+ gr. bullets it has better SD and is around the ideal penetration speed and a slight edge in momentum.

I'd almost feel bad, overkilling a little black bear with one.

 

[AKMtnRunner]

There is prevailing empirical wisdom from experienced handgun hunters that momentum or tko figures represent handgun cartridge potential much better than muzzle energy, so it's not too much to conclude the average 480 is more effective over the average 454 unless(!) high speed for those rifle-like distances are the purpose.

But just for fun, forget the head stamp for a minute. Try this approach.

From one end, determine the effects you want to apply to your targets.

First shop for the bullets you'll want to use between .41" and .51". Pick a caliber (not a cartridge) that include good cheap bullets and bullet weights and construction you'll stake your life on, and be able to find both. .41's go up to mid 200's, .429's go up around 300 grains, .451's go up to mid 300's, .475's up to around low 400's, and useful .50-.51's go all the way up into the 500's. Go just big enough to suit your purpose comfortably or your revolver will end up being unnecessarily heavy and with limited options.

Then determine how fast you want to send them. Unless you're going to be shooting at rifle-like distances (~200 yards), just about all of the cartridges can send their relative heavy bullets fast enough for good effects, even the 45 Colt in a strong revolver.

With those loads you want, filter out the cartridges with anything less than very straightforward and safe hand load recipes. And take into account which powders your local stores sell. Search online reloading forums for real world experience with those loads.

Now, transition to the other end, the effects that will apply to your body. Remember that the cartridge name does not determine recoil, especially since you hand load. It's a function of bullet vs gun weight, caliber * pressure product, and barrel length and muzzle dynamics. A 500 Linebaugh can be easier to shoot than a 44 mag or even a 45 colt.

Pick the shooting style (double or single action) you prefer.

Determine the grips that agree best with your hands. A lot of grips are interchangeable.

With all else settled, pick the size of the gun that is the best compromise between shooting comfort and carrying comfort.

Lastly, make sure it gives you an adequate sighting system. Have enough sight radius and/or a good scope mounting option.

 

[Tactical Lever]

There is prevailing empirical wisdom from experienced handgun hunters that momentum or tko figures represent handgun cartridge potential much better than muzzle energy, so it's not too much to conclude the average 480 is more effective over the average 454 unless(!) high speed for those rifle-like distances are the purpose.

But just for fun, forget the head stamp for a minute. Try this approach.

From one end, determine the effects you want to apply to your targets.

First shop for the bullets you'll want to use between .41" and .51". Pick a caliber (not a cartridge) that include good cheap bullets and bullet weights and construction you'll stake your life on, and be able to find both. .41's go up to mid 200's, .429's go up around 300 grains, .451's go up to mid 300's, .475's up to around low 400's, and useful .50-.51's go all the way up into the 500's. Go just big enough to suit your purpose comfortably or your revolver will end up being unnecessarily heavy and with limited options.

Then determine how fast you want to send them. Unless you're going to be shooting at rifle-like distances (~200 yards), just about all of the cartridges can send their relative heavy bullets fast enough for good effects, even the 45 Colt in a strong revolver.

With those loads you want, filter out the cartridges with anything less than very straightforward and safe hand load recipes. And take into account which powders your local stores sell. Search online reloading forums for real world experience with those loads.

Now, transition to the other end, the effects that will apply to your body. Remember that the cartridge name does not determine recoil, especially since you hand load. It's a function of bullet vs gun weight, caliber * pressure product, and barrel length and muzzle dynamics. A 500 Linebaugh can be easier to shoot than a 44 mag or even a 45 colt.

Pick the shooting style (double or single action) you prefer.

Determine the grips that agree best with your hands. A lot of grips are interchangeable.

With all else settled, pick the size of the gun that is the best compromise between shooting comfort and carrying comfort.

Lastly, make sure it gives you an adequate sighting system. Have enough sight radius and/or a good scope mounting option.

Good post. Some of the big pistols are easier to shoot just because of the sheer mass of some of them. Pressure does not make a gun recoil harder but it does assault the ears less. And the speed of the bullet directly influences the speed of the recoil force. A longer recoil impulse with a lower speed feels easier than pushing a light bullet fast.

Some of the bigger calibers I would not even consider looking for jacketed bullets, or I would hardly shoot it. A few of the big ones I would really want to cast for.

 

[TimSr]

However accuracy can suffer a bit due to the long jump the bullet will have to make in the longer 454 cylinder.

I hear that a lot but have never experienced it.

I'd give the 480 the edge with heavier 400+ gr. bullets it has better SD and is around the ideal penetration speed and a slight edge in momentum.

The only real edge is a slightly bigger hole. I put a 300gr slug all the way through both shoulders of a 300lb black bear. Maybe an edge if you got into some of mutated monster blackies that you hear about now and then.

 

[MaxP]

The .480 is definitely a bigger hammer -- which shows up when the animals get progressively bigger. It won't really do much more on lighter game.

 

[Tactical Lever]

I hear that a lot but have never experienced it.



The only real edge is a slightly bigger hole. I put a 300gr slug all the way through both shoulders of a 300lb black bear. Maybe an edge if you got into some of mutated monster blackies that you hear about now and then.

We get some big ones, and grizzlies, and moose. Probably don't need more than a warmed up .45 Colt. However I hold out hope for a large cape buffalo wandering through the back yard.

 

[AKMtnRunner]

Pressure does not make a gun recoil harder but it does assault the ears less. And the speed of the bullet directly influences the speed of the recoil force. A longer recoil impulse with a lower speed feels easier than pushing a light bullet fast.

Pressure is what moves the bullet down the barrel. The same pressure exerts rearward to the interior case area to produce force. That force acts on a heavier gun to create a slower acceleration in the hand, or a lighter gun has faster acceleration. Likewise, the pressure*bullet area force product acts on the mass of the bullet to determines the acceleration of it, time in the barrel, which largely determines the amount of time that the gun recoils until the pressure dissipates when the barrel is vented to the atmosphere. The gun doesn't know the speed of the bullet, only the pressure curve in the chamber. We try to match the burning rate of the powder to the rate at which the bullet's movement expands the pressure chamber to create a safe and smooth pressure curve. Boiling it down to it's simple variables, the relative mass between the gun and the bullet, and pressure curve, is everything when it comes to recoil. This is one of the reasons why if a live round is ignited inside a fire or microwave without the gun, the lighter case accelerates away from bullet faster than the heavier bullet. Alternatively, it's fun (but scary) to think if we could have a very dense bullet and same weight of the gun, that each (assuming a straight wall cartridge) would accelerate away from that point at the same rate. If the chamber would hold, that would be some serious recoil.