642 Club Part Deux
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jfh
Member.
Glad you figured who is who, Brassman.
FWIW, I still get 'resistance' starting by 70 rounds, now. As you may recall, earlier that was binding at 50 rounds and up, and getting to 'impossible to pull' by 80-100 rounds. Today's feel suggests that the binding will not be significant until 125-150 rounds. I do clean mine, but probably not as thoroughly as you do.
I've traced a bit of the binding to the combustion characteristics of a given lead load. The 38+P max load of 7.0 gr. AA#5 under that 140LTC bullet is not as clean as the '357-lite' load with AA#5 under the same bullet. I'll shake this out a bit more. I have now put together some 'range notes' forms I can print out, so I will be getting more notes consistently.
This afternoon I was at the indoor range for practice, and I tried out Ramshot's True Blue with the 140LTC bullet. I have a really favorable impression of it: in a 357-lite recipe, it is accurate in my 640--very accurate, and over a nominal .5-grain range, with only a slight shift in POA. It appears to be about as dirty as #5, but with less flash. I've sorted out the 'replica load' to go with the GDSB 38+P 135 gr. factory round, I think and I will confirm the same subjective recoil
IIRC, you were still shooting those girly-type bullseye loads, weren't you, and calling it practice? Are you still shooting those?
Jim H.
FWIW, I still get 'resistance' starting by 70 rounds, now. As you may recall, earlier that was binding at 50 rounds and up, and getting to 'impossible to pull' by 80-100 rounds. Today's feel suggests that the binding will not be significant until 125-150 rounds. I do clean mine, but probably not as thoroughly as you do.
I've traced a bit of the binding to the combustion characteristics of a given lead load. The 38+P max load of 7.0 gr. AA#5 under that 140LTC bullet is not as clean as the '357-lite' load with AA#5 under the same bullet. I'll shake this out a bit more. I have now put together some 'range notes' forms I can print out, so I will be getting more notes consistently.
This afternoon I was at the indoor range for practice, and I tried out Ramshot's True Blue with the 140LTC bullet. I have a really favorable impression of it: in a 357-lite recipe, it is accurate in my 640--very accurate, and over a nominal .5-grain range, with only a slight shift in POA. It appears to be about as dirty as #5, but with less flash. I've sorted out the 'replica load' to go with the GDSB 38+P 135 gr. factory round, I think and I will confirm the same subjective recoil
IIRC, you were still shooting those girly-type bullseye loads, weren't you, and calling it practice? Are you still shooting those?
Jim H.
Wayne11
Member
jfh,
I'm a newbe so take this with a grain of salt. I have had binding problems with my 642 a few times at the range always somewhere over 50 rounds. I was able to determine with my gun that it was a small "something" under the extractor. The difficulty in pulling the trigger was the cylinder not freely turning. I now carry a lens brush that came with my camera and when the problem occurs I push the extractor away from the cylinder and give it a few brush strokes between the cylinder and extractor and the problem I'm having on my gun goes away.
Wayne.
I'm a newbe so take this with a grain of salt. I have had binding problems with my 642 a few times at the range always somewhere over 50 rounds. I was able to determine with my gun that it was a small "something" under the extractor. The difficulty in pulling the trigger was the cylinder not freely turning. I now carry a lens brush that came with my camera and when the problem occurs I push the extractor away from the cylinder and give it a few brush strokes between the cylinder and extractor and the problem I'm having on my gun goes away.
Wayne.
jfh
Member.
Thanks for the tip, Wayne11--you are correct; detrius under the extractor can induce binding. We hardly need to consider advice like this with a grain of salt: the purpose of this thread is to share knowledge of benefit to us all.
However, both Brassman and I are shooting M&P 340s--the scandium-framed 38 / 357, and we both shoot extensively or exclusively with reloads. We post here intermittently to provide updates of reloading data that may prove to be of interest to the 642 / 442 crowd.
The M&P 340 is a different breed of lightweight / 2"-barrel revolver: In comparison to my 442, it is built to noticably tighter tolerances, with arguably a better trigger--so, for example, I have had no trouble with binding on the 442 when I have shot up to 125 rounds with it, and my 640 doesn't bind even at 250-300 rounds.
Both Brassman and I seem to have traced our 340 binding down to the issues of combustion with typical reloading components, and I use recipes that will replicate the performance of the Gold Dot 38+P 135-gr. factory load. Ballistically speaking, that is a 135-140 gr bullet running about 860 to 900 fps from a 2" barrel, and it is (as you may know) a very popular carry round for the lightweights.
The bottom line is, I can do reloading to this performance level for about $.12 a round / $6.00 a box of fifty. That allows me to practice more, needless to say. If you're not a reloader, and not with lots of discretionary income, then becoming one is a way to get in lots of practice at lower cost.
Jim H.
However, both Brassman and I are shooting M&P 340s--the scandium-framed 38 / 357, and we both shoot extensively or exclusively with reloads. We post here intermittently to provide updates of reloading data that may prove to be of interest to the 642 / 442 crowd.
The M&P 340 is a different breed of lightweight / 2"-barrel revolver: In comparison to my 442, it is built to noticably tighter tolerances, with arguably a better trigger--so, for example, I have had no trouble with binding on the 442 when I have shot up to 125 rounds with it, and my 640 doesn't bind even at 250-300 rounds.
Both Brassman and I seem to have traced our 340 binding down to the issues of combustion with typical reloading components, and I use recipes that will replicate the performance of the Gold Dot 38+P 135-gr. factory load. Ballistically speaking, that is a 135-140 gr bullet running about 860 to 900 fps from a 2" barrel, and it is (as you may know) a very popular carry round for the lightweights.
The bottom line is, I can do reloading to this performance level for about $.12 a round / $6.00 a box of fifty. That allows me to practice more, needless to say. If you're not a reloader, and not with lots of discretionary income, then becoming one is a way to get in lots of practice at lower cost.
Jim H.
308win
Member
I'm really developing a severe itch for a case hardened Model 40 Classic.
Brassman
Member
jfh
Yes I still shoot some of the "girly loads", but I am developing new loads for magnum cases - some stouter and some not so stout . I really am hesitant about experimenting too much (getting too far away from published loads) as I do not own a chronograph. I'm sure you do have one. Do you take it with you to the range? How difficult is it to set one up, and would there be a problem setting one up at the indoor range that I have to frequent, as there is no other place available to me?-
Yes I still shoot some of the "girly loads", but I am developing new loads for magnum cases - some stouter and some not so stout . I really am hesitant about experimenting too much (getting too far away from published loads) as I do not own a chronograph. I'm sure you do have one. Do you take it with you to the range? How difficult is it to set one up, and would there be a problem setting one up at the indoor range that I have to frequent, as there is no other place available to me?-
OregonJohnny
Member
New Member to THR and New Owner of 642!
Hi there! I'm brand new to THR and I just bought a shiny new S&W 642 tonight. I opted for the non-Crimson Trace model. I had a Browning Buckmark .22 pistol that I rarely shot so I traded it in toward the 642. I've been carrying my Springfield XD-40 Subcompact with no complaints other than it's thickness and weight. I regret to say this has made me leave it home much more often than I wear it. I researched "pocket guns" for weeks to come up with a more comfortable CCW. After looking at NAA Guardians, Kel-Tec P-3ATs and PF-9s, and Beretta Bobcats, I saw a 642 at my local gunshop. I hadn't really noticed it or considered it before but something made me ask to handle it this time. I really liked the fit and the idea of a pocket revolver so I went home and researched some more and found the 642 Club on here. After reading all the posts, I was sold. Thanks everyone for helping me see the light and not waste my money on a Kel-Tec. (My only experience with a Kel-Tec is my buddy's P-3AT which hardly ever makes it through a whole magazine without a failure of some kind). I'll post a range report once I shoot it, but in playing with it all night, I must say it is the most perfect CCW I can imagine for the price!
Hi there! I'm brand new to THR and I just bought a shiny new S&W 642 tonight. I opted for the non-Crimson Trace model. I had a Browning Buckmark .22 pistol that I rarely shot so I traded it in toward the 642. I've been carrying my Springfield XD-40 Subcompact with no complaints other than it's thickness and weight. I regret to say this has made me leave it home much more often than I wear it. I researched "pocket guns" for weeks to come up with a more comfortable CCW. After looking at NAA Guardians, Kel-Tec P-3ATs and PF-9s, and Beretta Bobcats, I saw a 642 at my local gunshop. I hadn't really noticed it or considered it before but something made me ask to handle it this time. I really liked the fit and the idea of a pocket revolver so I went home and researched some more and found the 642 Club on here. After reading all the posts, I was sold. Thanks everyone for helping me see the light and not waste my money on a Kel-Tec. (My only experience with a Kel-Tec is my buddy's P-3AT which hardly ever makes it through a whole magazine without a failure of some kind). I'll post a range report once I shoot it, but in playing with it all night, I must say it is the most perfect CCW I can imagine for the price!
DelawareDon
Member
Any recommendations for a Range Bag?
Thanks.
Thanks.
glockman19
Member
- Joined
- Mar 16, 2007
- Messages
- 3,700
I have a range bag that carries pistols, ammo, spotting scope, shooting bags, extra magazines, and a small cleaning kit. I then have a separate bag/box for cleaning supplies, Everything you'd ever need. It all fits into the hard case that came with my Baskra Spotting scope. The scope also came with a soft case I use for it inside the range bag. Extra Ammo can also be transported or a carried by backpack or ammo can.
For a quick jaunt to the local indoor range I use an Allen Locking soft cases for all my handguns. Throw them into a backpack with some ammo and couple bore snakes and you're good to go.
For a quick jaunt to the local indoor range I use an Allen Locking soft cases for all my handguns. Throw them into a backpack with some ammo and couple bore snakes and you're good to go.
glockman19
Member
- Joined
- Mar 16, 2007
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- 3,700
And for good measure I'll post my 2,500th post here.
OregonJohnny
Member
Range Report: First Shots With The 642
What a great gun! I bought my 642 last night and drove out to State Forest land today to fire off a few rounds. I put 50 rounds of Mag Tech 158-grain SJLHP through it and finished off with 5 rounds of Speer Gold Dot 135-grain +P hollow points (which I intend as my carry ammo). At about 5-10 yards, I can easily keep all 5 shots within 4 inches when I take my time. And this is without the Crimson Trace grips. I tried some rapid fire and not surprisingly, my string of shots was a little high from center. But for what this little guy is intended, the accuracy at 7 yards is much better than I expected. Especially since this is my first double-action-only handgun and has the heaviest trigger pull of any firearm I've owned (even though my Springfield XD-40 is technically DAO, I swear it feels like SAO). Recoil was hardly noticeable for me (I shoot 300-grain Buffalo Bore .44 magnum +P rounds out of my Ruger Redhawk 4" with a smile on my face). It was raining quite a bit and there was snow on the ground, it was about 30 degrees and it was starting to get a little fouled using the Mag Tech lead rounds, not to mention it got sprinkled with tree bark and dirt when I was changing out paper targets over it as it laid on my car seat. But the 642 worked flawlessly with "dead-center" primer strikes and smooth action. The cylinder release got a little gritty after 50 rounds, but a quick brushing with Hoppes solvent cleaned it right up. Moral of this post: I LOVE MY NEW 642! I highly recommend it to anyone looking for a 100% reliable pocket gun for less than $400. This little guy will be a constant companion from now on.
What a great gun! I bought my 642 last night and drove out to State Forest land today to fire off a few rounds. I put 50 rounds of Mag Tech 158-grain SJLHP through it and finished off with 5 rounds of Speer Gold Dot 135-grain +P hollow points (which I intend as my carry ammo). At about 5-10 yards, I can easily keep all 5 shots within 4 inches when I take my time. And this is without the Crimson Trace grips. I tried some rapid fire and not surprisingly, my string of shots was a little high from center. But for what this little guy is intended, the accuracy at 7 yards is much better than I expected. Especially since this is my first double-action-only handgun and has the heaviest trigger pull of any firearm I've owned (even though my Springfield XD-40 is technically DAO, I swear it feels like SAO). Recoil was hardly noticeable for me (I shoot 300-grain Buffalo Bore .44 magnum +P rounds out of my Ruger Redhawk 4" with a smile on my face). It was raining quite a bit and there was snow on the ground, it was about 30 degrees and it was starting to get a little fouled using the Mag Tech lead rounds, not to mention it got sprinkled with tree bark and dirt when I was changing out paper targets over it as it laid on my car seat. But the 642 worked flawlessly with "dead-center" primer strikes and smooth action. The cylinder release got a little gritty after 50 rounds, but a quick brushing with Hoppes solvent cleaned it right up. Moral of this post: I LOVE MY NEW 642! I highly recommend it to anyone looking for a 100% reliable pocket gun for less than $400. This little guy will be a constant companion from now on.
Just found a very attractive sight option for the J-frame, except that it's obscenely expensive:
http://dlsports.com/dl_jframe_sw_sights.html
Looks like it could be adapted to non-pinned front sights too, but at $225 + $195 for tritium, it's hard to justify.
Harpo
http://dlsports.com/dl_jframe_sw_sights.html
Looks like it could be adapted to non-pinned front sights too, but at $225 + $195 for tritium, it's hard to justify.
Harpo
doc540
Member
And I bet I can out shoot it at 3 yards.
Brassman - For awhile there I thought I was losing mine. Oh well, with 693 members and a total of 6012 posts you are allowed an occasional error, I have made my share +
BTW, we have had some instances of grit/fouling under the extractor star of relatively clean X42's causing problems as well, generally the cylinder will not close after reloading and I have seen it on other wheelguns as well. Usually a quick wipe or just exercising the ejector star will reduce the stoppage. This is one of my immediate action drills during CQC. JR1, SigP232, OregonJohnny, Scott30 - Welcome to you all as new members of the 642 Club². Glad your here.
TBT - I have not used them, but the Maxfire is not recommended, see this link: http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=268498&highlight=maxfire
AStone
Member
Which reminds me: I found a mind in
a dark corner of my studio a few days ago.
It was just sitting there quietly, resting.
If any of you lost one,
PM me with a description and address,
and I'll mail it back to you.
riceboy72
Member
New to the 642
First post on THR, and of course, it had to be in this forum. Very cool forum with so much information! I've been shooting for many years and have always wanted a snubnose .38 for summer carry and 'middle of the night - run to get a coffee' times. Many years ago, I had a Taurus 85 but sold it, only to kick myself because I liked the deep concealability of it. The time has finally come.
Bought a 642 as part of a Christmas gift and finally got out to the range yesterday to shoot it. Loved it! Did most of my shooting from 7 yards (went out as far as 10 and as close as 2 yards) and put 50 rounds through the gun with nary a hitch, including running some Gold Dot through to see how the +P would do and how the recoil felt. First true double action only pistol I've owned (1911 and Glock guy) and I am certainly impressed by what it can do. It will more than likely turn into my everyday carry gun, riding in a DeSantis Nemesis with a speed strip in my front pocket. I have yet to find the perfect holster, but for now, the Nemesis is doing the trick.
The recommendation of snap caps with lots of dry firing is certainly helpful; I have been able to build up strength in my trigger finger and have become accustomed to the trigger pull of the 642, which is undoubtedly different than the 1911's I've carried for years. So far, so good. In fact, I think I just may have to find another 642 sometime this year. Thinking about adding CTC 405's to it, but we'll wait and see how I do with these Uncle Mike's grips.
Thank you to everyone who has shared information on the 642 and, like many of you, helped sway me into purchasing this fine little pocket pistol. I have learned so much and hope to contribute in time. Very comfortable place to be, to learn new information, and to share the good stuff.
Not a bad day, I'd say ...
First post on THR, and of course, it had to be in this forum. Very cool forum with so much information! I've been shooting for many years and have always wanted a snubnose .38 for summer carry and 'middle of the night - run to get a coffee' times. Many years ago, I had a Taurus 85 but sold it, only to kick myself because I liked the deep concealability of it. The time has finally come.
Bought a 642 as part of a Christmas gift and finally got out to the range yesterday to shoot it. Loved it! Did most of my shooting from 7 yards (went out as far as 10 and as close as 2 yards) and put 50 rounds through the gun with nary a hitch, including running some Gold Dot through to see how the +P would do and how the recoil felt. First true double action only pistol I've owned (1911 and Glock guy) and I am certainly impressed by what it can do. It will more than likely turn into my everyday carry gun, riding in a DeSantis Nemesis with a speed strip in my front pocket. I have yet to find the perfect holster, but for now, the Nemesis is doing the trick.
The recommendation of snap caps with lots of dry firing is certainly helpful; I have been able to build up strength in my trigger finger and have become accustomed to the trigger pull of the 642, which is undoubtedly different than the 1911's I've carried for years. So far, so good. In fact, I think I just may have to find another 642 sometime this year. Thinking about adding CTC 405's to it, but we'll wait and see how I do with these Uncle Mike's grips.
Thank you to everyone who has shared information on the 642 and, like many of you, helped sway me into purchasing this fine little pocket pistol. I have learned so much and hope to contribute in time. Very comfortable place to be, to learn new information, and to share the good stuff.
Not a bad day, I'd say ...
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glockman19
Member
- Joined
- Mar 16, 2007
- Messages
- 3,700
Riceboy72,
Welcome.
Welcome.
riceboy72
Member
Thank you, glockman19. Truly appreciate your kindness.
Brassman
Member
riceboy72
That's a really nice target you have there. I don't believe I have ever grouped 10 that close before with a 642. I could handle something like that with my GP100, but it has a 6" barrel. That's some good shootin' for a snub! At what distance were those shots performed?
That's a really nice target you have there. I don't believe I have ever grouped 10 that close before with a 642. I could handle something like that with my GP100, but it has a 6" barrel. That's some good shootin' for a snub! At what distance were those shots performed?
riceboy72
Member
brassman,
Thank you very much. I was shocked myself. That particular string was shot 2 handed, unsupported, from 5 yards out. Shot at an indoor range so I wasn't freezing and shaking everywhere.
Thank you very much. I was shocked myself. That particular string was shot 2 handed, unsupported, from 5 yards out. Shot at an indoor range so I wasn't freezing and shaking everywhere.
akzl
Member
Speedstrip holder
First post and have been lurking for six months. Bought a 642 in November to add to my CCW (we can only list three in CA) as a smaller carry gun after reading the positive feedback on this forum. I have five other wheel guns in larger caliber (S&W and Ruger) but never considered to carry them because of size and weight. Thanks to everyone on this forum for sharing their knowledge and interest. I have about 500 rounds through the 642 and love to shoot her. I bought holsters based on the forum here but struggled with a way to carry the speedstrips. Bought two different pocket holders for the strips but they are slow to get at. I already have to much crap in my pockets so I wanted belt attachments. Was at the carwash and saw these small flip phone belt attached cell phone holders and whipped the speedstrip in it-perfect fit and room for a second one. Bought if for $6.99, is black canvas and has a steel belt clip or slide through. If this idea has already been posted I apologize but this is a perfect way to carry the extra ammo on strips and reload very quickly without fumbling in your pockets. Thanks again for everyone’s insight!
First post and have been lurking for six months. Bought a 642 in November to add to my CCW (we can only list three in CA) as a smaller carry gun after reading the positive feedback on this forum. I have five other wheel guns in larger caliber (S&W and Ruger) but never considered to carry them because of size and weight. Thanks to everyone on this forum for sharing their knowledge and interest. I have about 500 rounds through the 642 and love to shoot her. I bought holsters based on the forum here but struggled with a way to carry the speedstrips. Bought two different pocket holders for the strips but they are slow to get at. I already have to much crap in my pockets so I wanted belt attachments. Was at the carwash and saw these small flip phone belt attached cell phone holders and whipped the speedstrip in it-perfect fit and room for a second one. Bought if for $6.99, is black canvas and has a steel belt clip or slide through. If this idea has already been posted I apologize but this is a perfect way to carry the extra ammo on strips and reload very quickly without fumbling in your pockets. Thanks again for everyone’s insight!
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glockman19
Member
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- Mar 16, 2007
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- 3,700
well my first prediction is we would hit 1,000 by:
So it only took 83 days.
So it only took 83 days.
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