7.62x39 vs. .223

[Jguy101]

I'm currently looking at the CZ 527 carbine, but I can't decide which caliber to go for. I know x39 is supposed to have a rainbow-like trajectory, and .223 is pretty flat-shooting, but I'm really not sure that .223's trajectory is worth it when the barrel is only 18.5 inches anyway. Any thougts?

 

[dscottw88]

7.62x39 isn't a bad round, but I personally prefer .223 simply because you can find it somewhat more easily and it tends to be cheaper. Another plus is that .223 can reach out 500 yards where as the 7.62 is limited in range.

 

[Jguy101]

Another plus is that .223 can reach out 500 yards where as the 7.62 is limited in range.

Which is why I brought up barrel length. Is a .223 coming out of an 18.5-inch barrel going to have enough velocity that its effective range will be considerably better than that of a 7.62x39?

 

[J_Dillinger]

For mid-range, I'd tend to pick the 7.62 +plus it leaves a bigger hole with greater knock-down power........but that's just me.

I had to make the same choice, either one will be suitable. If you're concerned about ammo prices, the 7.62's are cheaper for practice rounds through www.ammoman.com or Cheaper-than-Dirt or even Sportsmans Guide. It's all relative.

 

[yesit'sloaded]

I like to think of a 7.62x39 as a 30-30 with a better bullet design. It has better expansion for deer sized game and is a better hunting cartridge out to about 250 yards. 223 is great for smaller game but isn't really the ideal cartridge for anything bigger than a man. I use 154 grain soft points out of my gun and have never failed to kill anything with it. I do try to keep my shots within 150 meters but would feel comfortable taking a shot at 200.

 

[R.W.Dale]

I've owned a CZ527 in both cartridges. I still own the 7.62 while the .223 is long gone. In my opinion for just about any outdoors activity I can think of the x39 is simply a better mousetrap than 223

Don't poo poo the 7.62's trajectory my handload whit a 125grn nosler ballistic tip motorvating at 2450fps only drops 11 inches at 300yds from a 200yd zero and retains just under 1000 ft lbs of energy at 300

thats only 3 more inches of drop than a 55grn 223 bullet. But the real kicker is at that range the x39 has almost 2x the energy of the .223

7.62x39 every day of the week and twice on sunday people tend to get too hung up on trajectory. My theory is if you buy a rangefinder and know the ballistics of what your shootin, trajectory just becomes a few extra clicks. How hard is it to click a target knob?

 

[Luis Leon]

CZ527 in 7.62x39mm

I had the same dilema, I bought an AR15 in .223 for 3-gun competition. And a CZ 527 in 7.62x39mm, it is a dandy rig, and I can't wait to take my first deer with it. Everytime I take that little carbine into the woods I have to smile, a nice potent little package for deer within 200 yards.

regards,

Luis Leon

 

[woof]

They both have their applications. I was in the same situation as you having fallen in love with the cz carbine. I solved it the easy way, I have one of each!

 

[chris in va]

Just depends on what you want to do with it. Hunt deer/plink? x39. Small game/plink? x223.

My choice was easy. Already had a case of x39 for my (then) SKS and I didn't want to buy another caliber.

If I did want a .223 I'd probably get a HandiRifle single shot.

 

[Deaf Smith]

Jguy,

What is the round for? Deer? Gophers? Bear?

The 5.56 is an excellent varment round. It's a marginal deer round (I've taken one with a Mini-14, one shot, but it barely made it completly through the rib cage.) It ain't no bear round.

The 7.62x39 is basicly a 30/30. 122gr at 2400 is pretty much the same as 150gr at 2250 (what a 30/30 really gets from a 20 inch carbine.) And the sharp pointed bullets of the 7.62 don't slow down as fast as the FP 30/30s.

Anyway, that makes the 7.62x39 a good deer gun and a fair bear gun (black bear that is.) But it's trajectory makes it a poor varmet gun.

It all depends on what you want to hunt. Reloading makes either one fairly inexpensive to shoot. So I'd go with what ever you intent to hunt.

 

[GunTech]

In the carbine, 7.62x39. It makes a great brush gun.

If you want 223, there are better options than the carbine, which has a 1:12 twist, meaning you are pretty much limited to light bullets. Forget about using it for medium game. You're much better off with the 527 Kevlar varmint, with it's longer bbl and 1:9 twist.

I just wish I could convince CZ to make the carbine in 6.8 SPC or 6.5 Grendel.

 

[Jguy101]

If you want 223, there are better options than the carbine, which has a 1:12 twist, meaning you are pretty much limited to light bullets.

That was another consideration. I'm planning on having it fill the role of a lightweight, very politically correct SHTF rifle. I'd probably be able to find ammo in either caliber if all hell broke loose, but with the twist rate of the .223, a lot of the stuff I would find might not work too well.

 

[rangerruck]

I have two of the origionals , made totally in czech, with all the czech markings, and weird cyrillic measurements, and the bbls are something like 16.7 inches long. The thing is, unless they have changed them, the 223 is a 1/12 twist, which limits your bullets to 60 or 62 grains. watch how these groups at 100 yards start to spread out, like so;

 

[brian923]

the 7.62x39 i a very good round, and when handloaded, as stated above, can be very detrimental to critters of any shape and size. the whole conflict between the .223 and the X39 always seems to go back to the AK vs. the AR, and people seem to forget that we are talking about cartridges, not delivery systems. the only down side to reloading the X39 is that they use an odd caliber, (i believe .311") i have herd of people using .308 bullets to reload for, but i DO NOT, DO NOT advise this. it may be safe, but theres a reason for the difference. anyways. i have been looking for a nice sks that i can try to "accurize" seems that many people are making more and more parts for this rifle.

 

[Pilot]

What are you going to use the rifle for? A better comparison would be the 223/5.56 and the Russian 5.45x39.

 

[R.W.Dale]

i have herd of people using .308 bullets to reload for, but i DO NOT, DO NOT advise this

There is no issues whatsoever loading 308 bullets in a CZ527, There is no difference in accuracy and only a slight difference in velocity. There's a reason a lot of 7.62x39 die sets come with expander balls for both bullet diameters.

http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?p=2274479#post2274479

There are a few firearms that are intended to have undersized bullets fired through them. the 9mm/357 convertible ruger blackhawks come to mind

 

[yesit'sloaded]

.311 is not an odd caliber if you are also reloading for 3 mosins

 

[GunTech]

The bore on the CZ-527 is nominally 0.3105. I've used mine to shoot 308, 310 and 311 bullets. The only difference noted was that 308 bullets had about 100 fps less velocity - and no other effects that I could discern. Best accuracy I obtained was with 123gn Speer 310 sp.

If your rifle will shoot 308 bullets well, you are way ahead of the game, since it is far easier to find them. Most of the 311 bullets I found (when I could find any) were heavy bullets meant for the 303 British and 7.7 Jap and too heavy for the 7.62x39.

The 7.62x39 is a great cartridge, and the basis for some outstanding bench rest cartridges like the 6 PPC, 6.5 grendel and others. Handloaded, the 7.62x39 has little in common with combloc surplus other than name.

It has slightly less energy at the muzzle than a 30-30, but more at 100 yards thanks to better bullet design. The 7.62x39 is appropriate for any situation where 30-30 with light bullets is.

As a SHTF cartridge, it's a great choice as one can still buy ammo for somewhat reasonable prices.

 

[eliphalet]

Hopefully this will give you the answer you ask for.

http://www.accuratereloading.com/223sb.html

Unlike others I see no advantage to the 7.62 over a 30-30 and/or would pick a .308 if the heaver bullet was needed. A 125 grain bullet from the 7.62X39 to me is inferior to other 30's and is about 800 fps slower than a 55 grain .223 using a 18 inch barrel according to the spects in the link provided.
Why would one want to buy a .311 barrel and shoot .308's in it when good .308 barrels/calibers are availabel in a bolt action.
Now if a guy is wanting a third world auto to play with I understand, but not in a bolt.

 

[R.W.Dale]

Why would one want to buy a .311 barrel and shoot .308's in it when good .308 barrels/calibers are availabel in a bolt action.

Cause there isn't a mini Mauser made in .308

You shoot both cause you can buy $4 a box plinking ammo yet handload a quality bullet and shoot sub MOA groups and kill deer dead out to 250yds

Unlike others I see no advantage to the 7.62 over a 30-30 and/or would pick a .308 if the heaver bullet was needed.

why would you buy a .221 Fireball? When .223 or 22-250 is better in every way

a 300 win mag is better than a 308 so why buy a 308?

 

[brian923]

i wouldnt have thought that shooting .308 bullets out of a .311 barrel would be dangerous, but merly on the fact that you would loose potential. but... it would be really bad to load .311 bullets and shoot down a .308. maybe not devistating, but i wouldnt want to do it.

 

[W.E.G.]

.223 for a bolt gun.

Better choice of bullets.

 

[TOU]

The answer really is much more simple than you all are making it...one of each.

I really am only half joking as that is what I'm doing. Actually, I was lucky enough to buy GunTech's 527 x39 Carbine...am on the prowl for the 527 .223 carbine...have a 527 Varmint in .204...a very rare Brno ZKK-601 .223...and finally, I want a 527 Kevlar Varmint in .223 and a 527 FS in 22 Hornet and then maybe I will be getting close to covering it. BTW...be very careful of these CZ's and Brno's as they are addictive; with more than a few dozen I am slightly smitten by them.

 

[RockyMtnTactical]

What will the rifle be used for??

 

[trstafford]

I believe that original Ruger Mini-30 had .308 barrels and would shoot .311 bullets with no problems. I purchased a CZ carbine in 7.62x39 for deer hunting and love it in the woods. I have several standard rifles that I can choose from but love the compactness of the carbine.

On the side of the 223 the original M-16 had slow twist barrels so that bullets were not stable in flight. The tumblling actions caused massive devastation when the bullet tumbled on impact, until some genius general determined that it did not meet the 3moa requirement in sub-0 weather, so they increased the twist rate. improved accuracy but eliminated tumbling effect. a heavy weight bullet through the carbine would provide good stopping power if you can live with loss of accuracy.

The 7.62 provides both