9MM Makarov Penetration

[Scottmkiv]

Do to the fact that one of my girlfriend's friends is an utter moron, the penetration of my 109gr FMJ Wolf ammo got tested. According to http://www.goldenloki.com/ammo/gel/9x18/gel9x18.htm this load got 21" of penetration.

One of the reasons that I like this ammo is because it supposedly penetrates more than any other Makarov load, and I think the rest are too shallow. However, in this "informal test" the round went though 3 pillows and then failed to penetrate the drywall. It was stopped about 1/2" into the wall, and I dug it out, and it showed no deformation.

Especially after seeing the Box O' Truth, and how easily even .22s went through drywall, I was stunned. I thought it should have gone through the wall like butter.

Is it possible the house has some sort of drywall like material that is much harder? Or was the round seriously undercharged? The Golden Loki test showed a very low st. dv. Any thoughts?

 

[Feanaro]

The round might have tumbled in the uneven and decidely un-drywall like pillows. Only thing I can think of. Perhaps you should email the BoT fellow and ask for pillow penetration tests?

 

[grimjaw]

Was there a stud behind the drywall impact point? Might have mattered a little bit.

Rule #5: Women are more dangerous than guns. Your girlfiend's (no, I didn't spell that wrong) friend is lucky no one was sleeping on those pillows, if you're implying what I think you are.

What was the content of the pillows? Foam, feathers, something else?

I'm a little curious, I have about 700 more rounds of 9x18 FMJ 95 grain Fiocchi to go through before I run out.

jmm

 

[Scottmkiv]

Not exactly sure what you think happened. She had a friend over that we hadn't seen in a year or two. After dinner, I put the makarov on the bedroom desk and took the dog out in the back yard. Girlfriend and friend go into the bedroom, friend picks up the gun, and then asks if it is real. My girlfriend says yes, and friend pulls the trigger which she was fortunately pointing away from anything important. I'm sure the dumb friend didn't plan it that way. Other than having a crappy choice in friends, I can't see anything my girlfriend did wrong.

One pillow was filled with foam, and two were a sort of cotton padding of some sort it looked like. It went through all three pillows, which were piled one on top of the other, at an angle, but near the edge, so the actual depth in each pillow was no more than if the shot had been perpendicular too it. The bullet actually pulled a 4 or 5 inch streamer of cotton with it into the wall. All the holes in the pillow were fairly circular, and the bullet was recovered pointing straignt into the wall, so I don't think it was tumbling. I have no idea if there was a stud behind the drywall, as it didn't penetrate all the way through.

 

[MrTuffPaws]

Go out, by a ham, shoot it, and report back.

 

[RyanM]

You might want to try shooting gallon milk jugs full of water. If it penetrates into the 4th jug or beyond, it should be adequate for anti-human use, with the ideal being inside the 4th jug. I think 3" of penetration in white pine corresponds to 12" of gelatin, so that could be worth a try, too.

 

[grimjaw]

Sorry, poor choice or wording on my part. Didn't mean to imply your girlfriend did anything wrong; applying that term to girlfiends in general.

What you described was what I thought. The person didn't check/clear the weapon first before pulling the trigger. I'd say she's lucky we still don't know the terminal ballistic performance of that round.

Wolf is cheap. Go shoot up a bunch of different things, see how it does. I don't have anyplace where I can do anything but punch paper, or I'd do it for you.

jmm

 

[Tomac]

From my own informal & highly unscientific water jug tests, the Barnaul 95gr FMJ penetrates more than 5 1-gallon water jugs (I say more than 5 because it zipped through 4 w/o stopping and 5 was all I had left for the final test). By comparison my fav carry load (Silver Bear 115gr JHP @ 1,000fps) would consistently penetrate almost exactly 4 water jugs every single time.
Tomac

 

[Snowdog]

Did you notice any debris in the wall, forced in by the slug? The reason I ask is I've noticed in the past that sometimes material such as pillow filling will "stack up" against the nose of the bullet during it's travel, kind of like a unidirectional snowball if you will, exponentially slowing the slug.

Pillows, couch cushions and certain fabrics tend to slow a slug more so than one would think. I recall someone stating that they noticed that while shooting a couch with a lowly .25acp handgun (I don’t remember the specifics), none of the 50gr FMJ slugs would fully penetrate the length of one cushion. Though this may seem hard to swallow, I certainly wouldn't bet money against the possibility.

Simply because something is soft when touching it at 1FPS doesn't mean it's just as yielding and supple at 800FPS. I'm just glad no one was hurt in this particular situation.

 

[M2 Carbine]

The cotton filled pillows were probably pretty good bullet stoppers.

I use a single gallon water jug backed up by a 12 to 16 inch box of rags to catch the bullet.

Very few HP bullets , 45 ACP and smaller make it more than half way through the box, even rounds like JSP M1 Carbine are stopped by the rags (actually old heavy socks).

 

[Dr.Rob]

foam, cotton... etc. while not exactly sandbags will slow down a pistol bullet. Just feel lucky no one got hurt.

 

[Scoupe]

Well, first off good thing no one was hurt.

I disagree that it was the friend's fault entirely. Yes, she should have good enough sense to leave a gun she just verified as real alone.

BUT. You did leave it unattended with one in the pipe when there was a person unfamilar with firearms in the house. And, according to the (admittedly brief) account you've given, your GF didn't say something like "Yes it's real and it's probably loaded. Leave it be."

If it had been a child in the house, you would have secured it. Probably best to do the same with any visitor in the house.

I think three people should share the blame on this ND.

Again, very glad no one was hurt.