9mm Nato vs Plus P

[MikeNice]

I was looking at 9mm ammo today trying to get a sense of prices. I ran across some Winchester 124gr "Nato" ammo that is supposedly loaded hotter than normal 9mm ammo.

Is it loaded to the level of +P? If so it seems like a great pactice ammo. I only costs $71.97 for 250 rounds. That means you could pretty much break in your gun with "hot" ammo for less than $100 with shipping. If it is packed at or near +P levels it could also act as a mini stress test for reliabilty.

Can anyone tell me anything about this ammo. Is it really any hotter than say Fiocchi? How does it compare to +P? Oh, and I would not plan on carrying this as a SD round, so nobody needs to tell me that.

 

[Landric]

IIRC NATO 9mm is loaded to somewhere around 40,000 or 42,000 PSI. Regular 9mm is 35,000 PSI and +P is something along the lines of 38,000 PSI. Generally NATO ammo is hotter. If that doesn't bother you, then it would make fine practice ammunition.

 

[CoRoMo]

9mm Luger 35,000psi (SAAMI spec.)
9mm Luger+P 38,500psi (SAAMI spec.)
9mm Luger+P+ 42,000psi (Suggested spec.)
9mm NATO probably falls somewhere between +P and +P+

I got this quote from one of the following threads...

http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=99178
http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=94852&highlight=SAAMI

Just shy of any consensus amongst those posting there.

 

[Nushif]

That sounds like some fun ammunition ... why would you not use it as SD ammo, though?

 

[rcmodel]

Because a 9mm NATO FMJ will shoot clear through two or three Bad Guys
stacked Prison Lover style.

9mm FMJ ammo is a poor stopper, and very likely to over-penetrate.

rc

 

[MikeNice]

CoRoMo, thanks for that listing. It kind of set things straight, but then again it didn't. It seems like nobody is 100% sure what the Winchester NATO round can do. Nato's specs say it should be one thing, but some measurements say it doesn't do it.

It looks like Fiocchi and Geco should be in the same ball park from the posts at TFL.

I'm as confused as ever. Oh well.

ADD

It seems that Georgia Arms also makes a version of the "Nato" round. It is slightly more expensive, and I believe they load it in house. I wonder if their's conforms to the true NATO specs or if it is just marketing hype?

I would like to try their 147gr +P hollow point though. That sounds like it could be a great load for shorter barell 9mms.

 

[gofastman]

Because a 9mm NATO FMJ will shoot clear through two or three Bad Guys
stacked Prison Lover style.

9mm FMJ ammo is a poor stopper, and very likely to over-penetrate.

LOL ewww!

overpenetration is a misnomer.
9mm FMJ rounds undercavitate, that is, they don't destroy enough tissue to be stopped in a human torso.

 

[redbullitt]

lol yeah 9mm fmj is great for dealing with prison love ins, but other than that I would use it for practice

 

[MonthOfAngle]

is russian Tula ammo considered NATO?

 

[rcmodel]

No.

Russia was never a NATO member, and never used the 9mm Luger cartridge in it's military weapons, until very recently at least.

NATO was formed to defend against the WARSAW pact countrys, of which Russia was the ring-leader.

rc

 

[MonthOfAngle]

thank you !

 

[Runningman]

Straight from the horse's mouth. If you read on the back of the box on Winchester 124 Gr NATO ammo Q4318. You will see that it states "These cartridges are loaded to military velocity and pressure which is higher than 9mm Luger cartridges; average pressure is 10% higher than industry standard pressure for 9mm Luger".

Standard SAAMI pressure for 9mm is 35,000 PSI. Add 10 percent on to that and it is 38,500. The +P SAAMI pressure limit for 9mm +P.

 

[MikeNice]

Running I did read that. I didn't know if Winchester mant the industry standard for normal pressure or the industry standard for +P. I guess your reading makes the most likely assumption.

 

[Bovice]

Personally, I would not worry about the pressure of the NATO spec ammo, so long as you have a modern handgun to use it in. Beretta, Sig, HK, Glock, any of those would be fine.

Now, if you put it in your HiPoint, don't be surprised when it detail strips itself at the firing line.

 

[gofastman]

^its far from excellent.

 

[Yarddog]

I like it Because it shoots to POA like my 124gn Speer G/Ds & cheaper ; )
Y/D

 

[The Lone Haranguer]

If your carry load is to be a +P or +P+ JHP, this NATO ammo could be a good practice load that approximates the recoil. I shot some years ago and did find it to have more recoil than standard pressure, although I had - and have - no way of measuring velocity or pressure. I would reserve heavy use of it to a proven military/police service pistol that was built to handle it.

 

[jonmerritt]

ummm, NATO 9mm works just great in my Hi-Point.. You must not own a Hi-Point.