9x23

[Quat]

Hello,
I've seen a lot of mention about shooting .355 and .357 bullets in the 38 super since it is supposed to be .356.
I was reading the thread about 'which 10mm' and the 9x25 dillion and 9x23 winchester were mentioned. Looked them up, just on wikipedia, and they appear to be .356 as well.
Has anyone tried using .357 bullets in the 9x23? I'm kind of curious about it as a hiking companion now. I'd be especially interested if anyone had shot 158 grain .357s in it.


Thanks

 

[ReloaderFred]

You'll need to slug the barrel to find out which bullet will work best. I shoot both the 9x25 Dillon and 9x23 Winchester rounds. I use jacketed bullets for both rounds and my barrels are both .356" in diameter, but that can vary from one gun to the next, even in the same brand. It depends on the condition of the tool used to finish the barrel.

Hope this helps.

Fred

 

[Wil Terry]

WELL SHUCKS, I have shot thousands of .357" and .358" diameter bullets through all the 9MM PARABELLUM pistols I have and have ever had with nary a problem; NONE !! This includes all the S&W 9MM pistols which stay quite close to .355" groove diameters. A thousandths on a side means diddly-squat.
The last BR-HP barrel I slugged was .3572" in the grooves and shot beautifully with 38/357 .358" swaged bullets and 38/357 .357" JHP bullets.

 

[ReloaderFred]

Are we talking problems or accuracy? I was answering the accuracy question.

As to problems, the 9x23 Winchester round is very high pressure, way beyond 9x19 pressures, which is why the case is designed to withstand over 50,000 psi. Before stuffing oversized bullets into the 9x23, I'd like to know the diameter of my bore.

The 9x25 Dillon is a whole other animal altogether. It has a very short neck, and pushes 115 gr. bullets right at 1,600 fps from a 5" barrel. I'm getting 1,573 fps avg. from my 4.5" barrel. Again, I need to know the diameter of my bore before I start pushing bullets at those speeds from something I'm holding in my hand.

I've also loaded .357" diameter bullets in 9x19, in weights up to 158 grains, using loading data from Handloader Magazine. It works, but the question wasn't about the 9x19 caliber and the OP didn't specify whether he was talking about cast or jacketed bullets....

Hope this helps.

Fred

 

[Clark]

All I have ever shot in 9x23mm are .357" 158 gr XTPs and .358" 158 gr LSWC bullets.

Most people think that power is limited by pressure.
In semi auto handguns with case support, the limit is almost always recoil.
Without obnoxious slide mass or obnoxious recoil springs, we cannot deal the power that 380 or 9x19mm or 40sw or 45acp would be capable of with hot loads. The slide will hammer the frame and brass will eject a long way.

So what good are 9x23, 357Sig, 10mm, and 45Win Mag?
From Calvin and Hobbs, "Live and don't learn, that's us!"

 

[Quat]

I had a general interest in shooting .357 out of it: if it could be done, accuracy, things to watch out for, velocities, advantages over a 357 mag, disadvantages, etc.

If I wind up with one I'd probably be using a mixture of cast and jacketed.

What kind of velocities have you gotten, safely, with 158s? I'm assuming they are mostly shot out of 5" 1911's.

Thanks for the feedback so far.

 

[Legion489]

Well never having shot a 9x23 or a 9x25, my opinion is just as valid and important as anyone else's! Oh wait, I HAVE no opinion because I know nothing about the question! Which never seems to stop anyone else...

What I CAN talk about is the various bore sizes the 9mm/.38 Super, etc., come in! The 9mm is suppose to be .355", but if you slug many Lugers (I used to have a bunch), P-38s (couple), Hi-Powers (have/had several), you start to notice that the bore size is rarely (as in 'never seen one yet') .355" and easily goes up to .358" or more. Same with the .38 Super. Slug a 1930s through 1970s Colt Super and see for yourself. The current barrels seem to be MUCH better at holding a tight bore, but even the older (I haven't slugged any late M-39/M-59 barrels) S&W 39 bores were, shall we say, a bit large.

Shooting .355"-.357" JACKETED bullets (if the chamber will handle .357" bullets of course) through any of these bores seems to be fine. Accuracy is good and if you shoot .355" jacketed bullets through an over sized bore, accuracy not only seems to be as good or better then with the proper diameter, the velocities are often a good deal faster as well. When shooting lead bullets however, shoot as close to bore diameter as you can, but some chambers won't chamber a case with a bore diameter bullet.

Actually it is not recoil per say, it is slide velocity. The slide slams back with far too much velocity and then slams forward with far too much velocity, and the autos are set up to operate at a set slide speed so everything can get fed and ejected properly. The recoil of the hottest .45 ACP loads are easily manageable in a revolver or single shot (Contender), as would be .40 S&W and others.

 

[918v]

I shoot .359" cast bullets though my 9mmP.

 

[Clark]

I have converted Tokarevs to 9x23mm ...........1.36" 158 gr is the threshold of feeding, and one must back off a margin from there.
I have converted one Star Super B to 9x23mm..... 1.29" 158 gr is the threshold of feeding.
I have a Manson 9x23mmWin reamer, but for 158 gr bullets and long OAL, I prefer to cut a custom chamber with drills, boring bars, and straight fluted .001" increment available reamers.
CAUTION: The following post includes loading data beyond currently published maximums for this cartridge. USE AT YOUR OWN RISK. Neither the writer, The High Road, nor the staff of THR assume any liability for any damage or injury resulting from use of this information.

8.5 gr Power Pistol Alliant max load 357 mag 158 gr 1.59"
8.5 gr Power Pistol my max 380 158 gr 1.09"
11 gr Power Pistol my max 9x19mm 158 gr 1.169"
11.5 gr Power Pistol my max Starline 9x23 brass 158 gr 1.36"
16 gr Power Pistol my most can fit 9x23mmWin brass 158 gr 1.36"

Here is the problem:
My Glock 19 with a 48 pound triple recoil spring assembly, double magazine springs in parallel to stay with slide speed, NY trigger for reset to stay with slide speed, shooting 10 gr Power Pistol 1.169" 124 gr Hornady flat nose, will eject brass a long long ways. Only strong men have the grip to chamber a round or the thumbs to load a magazine.

What could a 5 year old understand?
More powder makes too much kick.
9x23mm needs guns with fat handles that are hard to find.