A little advice before I take the plunge?

[Jorg Nysgerrig]

It's time for me to get into reloading. I feel kind of stupid posting this question since there is so much information on all this out there, but I have to admit it is a little overwhelming. I think I've figured out what I want, but I thought I'd ask the voices of exprience before I spend the money.

I'm one of those "variety is the spice of life" kind of guys, so instead of shooting a couple of calibers a lot, I shoot moderate amounts of several calibers. To start out, I'm mainly interested in reloading .223, .40S&W, and .45 Colt. Later, I'd like to add a few other calibers.

It seems like a good bang for the buck for what I'm looking to do is the Lee Classic Turret Press. Both Cabela's and Kempf's seem to have pretty decent kits.
http://www.cabelas.com/prod-1/0044122216337a.shtml
http://www.kempfgunshop.com/products/reloading/leeprecision/kits/KempfKit.html

Am I barking up the wrong tree or does this sound like a good option for my needs? It seems like it's a reasonable way priced to get some gear that will be good enough and fast enough for what I'm looking for as well as giving me a fairly inexpensive way to add calibers.

Assuming this is the way to go, would someone be so kind to advise me on the contents of these two kits?

They both have the Classic Turret Press and the auto disc riser.
The Kempf set comes with the dies, the auto disk powder measure, the safety prime systems, and either ammo boxes or the rifle charging die depending on the kits.

The Cabela's has the Pro Auto-Disk powder measure, the rifle charging die and the Lee safety scale. No dies, however.

It seems you order the options from Kempf's to make it the same as Cabela's or add the dies to the Cabela's set, you they are priced roughly the same. Unless I missed something, which is entirely possible.

That raises the question, are the upgrades in the Cabela's kit recommended? It seems like if they would be worth having, it would be worth getting now either from Cabela's or paying the price to upgrade from Kempf's with the initial order.

Aside from components and a reloading manual, what is missing from these kits? Calipers? Tumbler?

And the final question, my C&R is on the way. Both of these kits seem to be a pretty good deal when you compare them to retail prices, but will my C&R discounts at some of the other places bring the prices even lower?

Thanks!

 

[jhansman]

You might want to consider starting with a single stage setup for your first time out. Lee's Anniversary kit is an inexpensive, easy way to find out is reloading is for you, and if you decide later to move up, nearly ever item in the kit will still be of use to you. I've been using mine for about a year now, and am ready to upgrade, but since I only reload a few hundred rounds per month, I've held off getting the turret press kit. I have, however, learned a lot using my single stage kit.

 

[Vitamin G]

I went the anniversary kit to start with, and i wish the classic turret kit would have been available when i started. Remove the little rod, and in 5 seconds, its a single stage. I love my classic turret. I'd get the one with the pro-auto disk. I hear its much better (though i've never used the standard one), and you can remove it without spilling powder everywhere.

 

[hotwheelz]

Let me start by saying I do not load much rifle ammo but bang for the buck a dillon 550 is one of the most versitle loaders out there. With a little time behind the loading machine you can easly turn out 200-300 rnds an hour at a modest pace kepping an eye on things. They are very easy to set up and change calibers, there customer support is second to none. I have only been reloading for about 4yrs now many guys have alot more expierence then me and do not like the progressive type machines and they have some good reasons for kepping on a single stage press but I want to spend time shooting and the progessive will make your loading time much faster. Just my 2 cents one way or another its alot of fun and will save you alot of money.

 

[FieroCDSP]

A progressive of any brand can be daunting to look at, let alone work. I wouldn't recommend one for a beginner.


The Turret press is near perfect for beginners. The kempfs set is the better deal, but you'll still need a scale ($20 for Lee, $40+ for everyone else, at Midway), a load manual, some gear for prepping cases, a tumbler, etc...but definitely the scale. The Lee cavities are not perfectly consistant with flake powder charges, so you need to have a good idea what charges you're throwing.

If you go with the Cabellas set, you get the scale, but no dies, which is an almost even trade off, you don't get the 6 ammo boxes ($2-4 each), and it's still five bucks more before shipping.

Go with the Kempfs, get the rest of your dies from Midway. The 3 Die sets work just fine, so you can save nine bucks per set there over the deluxe sets.

Some will tell you to go with the Blue Kool-aid, but in all honesty, I just loaded a bunch of rounds on my single-stage Lee despite having a Loadmaster progressive right next to it. It's a hobby. You slow down and enjoy it sometimes. You will always have a use for that simple, reliable single-stage, and that's not a bad purchase, is it?

If Midway honors your C&R for a discount, get it from there if there's substantial savings.

 

[Noxx]

A progressive of any brand can be daunting to look at, let alone work. I wouldn't recommend one for a beginner

I don't want to be the wet blanket here, but everyone told me that when I started, and I bought a nice single stage (rockchucker) that I quickly replaced.

I think it depends on your needs. If you're going to reload a little of this, and a little of that, a good single stage is a great way to start out. If you're going to burn through a lot of ammo with frequent training, a progressive is pretty much a must.

I agree that a single stage is easier to learn the basics on, but if your consumption is high, the act of production becomes onerous, rather than engaging, and that just leads to buying WWB, and as we've discussed, everyone knows that leads to excessive body hair, and communism.

In my experience, if you're going shooting more than twice a month, go ahead and get a nice dillon or something in your most common caliber, you'll never be sorry you did.

 

[pinkymingeo]

Don't get the Lee scale. Spend a few extra bucks and get an RCBS or Dillon. The Lee is accurate, but hard to use and has crummy damping. The 4-die sets are worth it. For a few extra bucks you get the FCD, which is really handy. Spring $9 for an extra turret with each die set, and caliber changes take only seconds.

 

[hotwheelz]

quote
" A progressive of any brand can be daunting to look at, let alone work. I wouldn't recommend one for a beginner."


I had never loaded one round of ammo or new anyone well enough to get help from when I got my dillon. It took me a total of 6-8 hrs for set up trial and error and I was out at the range with my first batch of .45. Do not sell yourself short thinking your unable to understand this "daunting" set up. If you read the instructions from dillon on set up and pay attention to what your doing you will be out at the range shortly haveing some fun and you will find out you now have another hobby that is very enjoyable. " you can do it"

 

[Phil A]

It seems like a good bang for the buck for what I'm looking to do is the Lee Classic Turret Press..... It seems like it's a reasonable way priced to get some gear that will be good enough and fast enough for what I'm looking for as well as giving me a fairly inexpensive way to add calibers.

Your reasoning is sound. A strong, cost effective press for multiple calibers (rifle, pistol, small/large primers) with very fast and inexpensive caliber/primer changeovers. I don't miss changing dies in and out of a single stage. More info-- http://www.realguns.com/archives/122.htm

Make sure you get the safety primer that handles large and small primers and the Pro auto disk with the double disk option.

- Phil

 

[BigJakeJ1s]

Please note that the phrase "Deactivate the Auto-Index and cases as long as the monster 50 BMG can be loaded." does not mean that 50 BMG itself can be loaded on the classic turret (dies are too big for turret plate). And apparently Lee, when questioned about it, did not even think the above statement from their website was misleading either. I like a lot of their tools and equipment, but I am dismayed by their unethical approach to product description and advertising.

Andy

 

[pinkymingeo]

Lee is literature-challenged. Their product instructions are horrible. I don't think they're unethical, just too cheap to hire somebody who can write. The Classic Turret is an excellent press, though. Meets my needs much better than a blue machine, and a whole lot cheaper to boot.

 

[Jorg Nysgerrig]

Thanks for all the advice, everyone. I appreciate all the tips and suggestions. I still need to digest it all. I'm sure I'll be posting again once I look at some of the other options people have mentioned.

It seems like the Kempf's deal is a better than Cabela's since it sounds like I should upgrade to a nicer scale. Does anyone know the C&R pricing for this stuff at Midway? If it's a substantially better I might wait until my C&R shows up, if not, I may just get it from Kempf's.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

The Cabela's set up is better because you get a scale and the Pro Auto-Disk Powder Measure. The Pro version is MUCH better IMO and I have owned both. A set of Lee Deluxe Carbide Dies will cost you another $31 and are on Cabela's site.

I own and use the Classic Turret press and it's a very good press for the money. Make sure you buy the Classic Turret Press because it has a Cast Iron base. The "regular" turret press doesn't and it's ram isn't as heavy as the one on the Classic Press.

If you are worried about getting things right in the beginning all you need to do is remove the auto-index rod and use it as a single stage press until you feel comfortable with the process. When you feel your way around reloading for a while you can use the auto-index feature and push out your pistol ammo a little faster without worrying about losing the quality of the ammo.

 

[qbpc]

If you shoot alot get a Dillon, best thing I ever did for my shooting. Easy to change calibers and 1/4 the time spent sitting in front of it. If you like pulling a handle 400 times to load 100 rounds plus power measure and priming get a single stage. I do have a single stage that I use for develoment loads and to take to the range.
My .02
BB

 

[pinkymingeo]

First time I've heard anybody say it's easy to change calibers on a Dillon. I guess if you buy two presses, one for small primers and one for large, then invest $200 per caliber for plates and measures, changes aren't too bad. One reason guys say they buy RCBS and Hornady is that caliber changes are much easier than Dillon, and they're not easy on those two.

 

[qbpc]

pinkymingeo Do yo own a Dillon? Have you used a Dillon?

 

[Sunray]

"...you get the scale, but no dies..." All Kits are like that.
The RCBS Beginner's Kit has a better warrantee than Lee's stuff. Nothing wrong with Lee, but their warrantee isn't as good as RCBS'. You'll want to buy another manual, no matter which kit you buy too.

 

[hotwheelz]

quote

"First time I've heard anybody say it's easy to change calibers on a Dillon."

It doesnt take but 5 min. tops and thats if your new at it may take me 2 min to change from large to small primers. As far as the cost you dont need a powder measure with each set up or do you have a diff. powder measure for each caliber you use? Some of the shell plates and buttons carry over the shell plate for 9mm and 40 are the same for example. A tool head is $15 put your dies in it leave them set up 2 pins and it out . Look Im not knocking single stage reloading it has its place and people who will only load that way but to make the dillon sound like some high tech overwhelming hard to set up and deal with is just a lie. Everything takes time when its new and with some time it becomes easy, dont make things out to be so hard its not just be careful follow the direstions and you will enjoy yourself. But thats just the opinion of a simple farm boy

 

[qbpc]

hotwheelz
Thanks it only takes me a few mins also. I don't know why people think Dillon's are a complicated hard to use press. They are a well made and easy to use press. I remember when I started shooting IPSC and staying up in the wee hours of night to get my match not counting practice ammo ready with a single stage press. When I bought the Dillon in a couple hours I had a months worth of ammo.

 

[strat81]

This should be everything you need to get started:
Lee Cast Iron Turret Press (4-hole)
Scale
Calipers
Check weights
Lee Pro Auto Disk powder measure
Dies
Lee Safety Prime (Large & Small)
Safety Glasses
Bullet puller
Lee Auto Disk Powder Measure Riser
Lee Adjustable Charge Bar Auto Disk
Lee Double Disk Kit (For rifle)
Reloading Manual
Ammo boxes
Extra turrets for additional die sets

For pistol, their 4-die sets include all the dies you need. For rifle, I bought the rifle charging die plus a universal decapper. Do not underestimate the need for a scale, calipers, or eye protection. You can buy quality versions of all three for well under the cost of a decent new handgun. Be smart: measure your OAL, measure your charge weights, and protect your eyes. Don't blow yourself or your gun up.

I got my gear from www.fmreloading.com. HTH

 

[MattB000]

A progressive of any brand can be daunting to look at, let alone work. I wouldn't recommend one for a beginner

Depends on the individual. It is like saying "Everyone should start out with a .22 revolver."

I started out on a Hornady LNL AP. But, I also made sure I knew what everything on that machine was doing before I started loading ammunition. I also started with one at a time, but quickly started using it as a progressive. I'm glad I didn't waste money on a single stage that I would've wanted to replace in less than a week.

 

[Jorg Nysgerrig]

I've got a couple addtional questions.

Is the adjustable charge bar used in concert with the existing powder disks or does it replace them? It appears to replace them, but I'm a little confused by how it works.

Talk to me about the rifle die sets. The 4 die sets for pistols seem to have all the goodies, but I'm slightly confused by the rifle dies.

Lee's Deluxe Rifle Dies sound good, with the "no case lubing, increased case life, less trimming, etc", but what's the catch? Lee claims these same benefits with the Collet Neck Size Die , but then cautions against using them in autoloaders, which would be my primary usage. Are the benefits of the deluxe set only derived from using the neck sizing die instead of the full length sizing die? If that's the case, it sounds like the PaceSetter Dies would be more appropriate for my needs.

Bear in mind I'm particularly interested in .223 for an AR at this point. Thanks!

 

[strat81]

The adjustable charge bar replaces the disk. The disk is just a round piece of plastic with holes punched around it. The bigger the hole, the more powder is allowed into the case. Since these holes are a pre-defined size, you cannot fine tune the charge. For most folks, this is fine as they don't generally care about a .1 gr difference in charge weights. If .1gr or .2gr makes a difference, you're either running way too hot or your shooting skill is so high you'll need something better than an Auto Disk.

For .223, I have the Lee 3 die Pacesetter set. For an autoloader, you cannot use a neck-only sizing die. You must use a Full-length sizer. I replaced the Lee sizer in my setup with the RCBS X-Die. The X-Die is a FL sizing die that eliminates brass stretch while sizing, meaning you won't have to trim your brass every (other) loading or so. I don't know exactly how it works (magic, probably) but I believe there is a mandrel inside that prevents the brass from growing as it is resized.

So I have a 3-die set (X-Die sizer, Lee Seater, Lee Crimper) in my 4-hole turret. God gave it 4 holes so 4 dies I shall use! I got the Lee Rifle Charging Die (http://www.leeprecision.com/cgi/cat...7=/html/catalog/powhan1.html#RifleChargingDie) to place in between my sizer and seater. That way I can use case-activated powder drop with the Auto Disk. You'll most likely need the Double Disk kit if you plan on charging rifle cases with it.

Oh, and pick up some Imperial Sizing Wax and make sure you lube your cases well!!!

 

[RustyFN]

IMO the Classic Turret is a great way to start. I have one and load 9mm, 38/357 and 223. You didn't say how much ammo you would need per week or month. I will give you an idea of what I do on mine and you can go from there. I have plenty of time to reload so I don't need 600 RPH or more. I can sit down for 1.5 hours a night, five nights a week and have 1,000 pistol rounds in a week. Rifle takes a little longer with case prep. It is a very easy press for a beginner to setup and use. The difference in the kits are as I believe Cabela's comes with the Pro Auto Disk, L & S safety prime, scale, rifle charging die, lube and half of the case trimmer and no dies.. You will need to buy the other half to match the caliber you will be trimming for. Kempf's comes with everything in the Cabela's kit except the scale but you get the dies. You will want to upgrade to the pro auto disk and the L & S safety prime in the Kempf kit. By the time you buy the dies for one kit or the upgrades for the other they are pretty close in price. I hear most people buy from Kempf's because they are very helpful and nice to deal with. Hope this helps.
Rusty

 

[RustyFN]

I don't think you can get the press any cheaper with a C&R than what is offered in the kits. But I do get some great deals with mine on powder and primers at Grafs.
Rusty