A serious question regarding ammo. How much is realistically needed?

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A little perspective here. I won't post exact amounts, but for a general idea of my ammo usage:

The one gun related item I buy at wal-mart? Skeet. 4.97/box of 90. I take a truck. They use a pallet jack.

A little fact I've been called on here a few times: Yes my sp101 is only about 7 years old. But it has seen 60,000 rounds I assure you.

Some here have ammo supplies that would scare people to death. Some think anything over 1,000 rounds means you're nuts. Whatever. Not saying you/I need more/less. Your business.

I had 2 goals for this tread:

1. Get others perspectives on *why* they have/want *how much* ammo. Maybe be shown an angle/thought process I hadn't considered.

2. Get others to give the reasons for their approach some serious thought.


Mission accomplished.
 
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i divide my ammo into 3 groups.

group 1 - plinking / target ammo

reloaded 38spl and reloaded 9mm
birdshot for the 12 gauge
wolf 223 and wolf 7.62 x 39
22lr
surplus 7.62 x 54R

I usually have a pile (a pile is 1000 rounds or more in each caliber) of group 1 ammo at any time. I shoot a lot, so i am always reloading or buying more as needed. The more money I have on hand at a given time, the more group 1 ammo I have.

group 2 - hunting ammo

about 500 rounds of 17 hmr
varying amounts of match grade 223

I only varmint hunt, so at times i will either have tons of this (during varmint season), or get pretty low (like right now).


group 3 - SHTF ammo

9mm - 500 rds
223 - 1500 rds
7.62 x 39 - 1000 rds
12 gauge - 100 rds 00 buckshot
357 mag - 200 rds

This is my stash for rainy days. High quality JHP's / military grade ammo as appropriate for each caliber/gun. I dont shoot this stuff off, as its only for bad situations (think Katrina or LA riots).
 
The one gun related item I buy at wal-mart? Skeet. 4.97/box of 90. I take a truck. They use a pallet jack.
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huh?

are you talking shotgun shells?

the walmarts here want $15/100.

Where is this walmart located? I want to go there, even if it is a ways down the road.
 
No, not shells. Clay birds, clay pigeons, skeet. The things you shoot at. Remington is the brand they usually have.
 
Well Ben, you know I dont think you can have too much ammo. But what I use to figure out how much I need to put away is easy.

Basic load, 21 mags rifle, 9 for pistol
Re-supply that 5 times
Have 2k rds on hand for training.

So put that away for each and every gun you have and there you are. Shotguns double or tripple that depending on what you anticipate the amount of use to be.

Now why would you keep 5 times re-supply on hand? Where are you going to buy more in a time of crisis?

Why do you need that amount for each gun when there is just you? Because there is strength in numbers and if you have an extra gun you should really get it into the hands of a trusted person. It is another set of eyes and trigger finger....

Now if you have belt feds or DD's the formula changes.
 
Let's discuss SHTF stock. This does not include foraging ammunition.

Common understanding is each person should have 200 rounds for each weapon they will possess in a SHTF situation. Anything in excess of this amount is a barter/cache amount for myself.

If you have a rifle and a handgun, that adds up to 400 rounds. 200 for the handgun might be viewed as excessive. We could drop that down to 50 for the handgun. Leaving 250 in total.

If you add a shotgun, I'd add 50 to 100 rounds for that, A mix of your own devising between buck and slugs. Me, I would have a rifle, so slugs are not needed. That adds up to 300 to 350 rounds total.

If you are a ten percenter, that adds up to 30 to 35 dead , or wounded bad guys. If you are at, or are close to 100 percent, thats is a long time holding ground with that amount of ammo. If you are posse'd up, it gets better.

This is where Molon Labe comes in. It'll take heavy weapons to dig you out, assuming you used your head and bunkered up well.

Jerry
 
Close to a month ago I shot 400 rounds of 9mm in an outing, just last saturday I shot another 200 rounds of 9mm and close to 100 rounds of .22.

Generally I keep 500 rounds each of what I shoot, .22LR, .223, 7.62x39, 9mm, & 12 Guage.

I don't think that is a alot to have on hand when I can burn up 2/3 of any one caliber on the weekend :confused:


That reminds me... need to order some more 9mm... and check out a S&W 22A :D
 
Jerry, my ammo calculations are based on a SHTF senario. 200rds can go very, very fast in a gunfight, especially if you are laying down fire to deny approach or to keep heads down. Even with a semi auto weapon. Maybe a bolt gun where you are taking precise aimed shots on every target it would be enough, but that is not always the best weapon to use in a running gun battle.

Now throw into the mix that you may have to move thru an area that is not friendly to recover a loved one or get to a more secure location and you are facing the posibility of repeatedly facing a large number of fresh targets. For that instance we keep a few 50 cal ammo cans loaded with rifle mags. You fight out of the ammo cans in case you have to ditch the vehicle and move out on foot. That means you have your full battle load on you when you dis-mount.

I know around here the Guard is keeping on hand a LOT more ammo than that for their soldiers in case of civil unrest or disaster.

We are actually doing a class on disaster prep (how to plan for a disaster, making a plan for our family), convoy training and load outs for each person and vehicle. We will also cover setting up a secure area and a TOC. All of the information in the class is based on the current military POI's and the Department of Homeland Security disaster plans and projections. If things are half as bad as they predict, everyone needs to get a LOT of ammo on hand. The first 72 hrs wont be bad, but when people realize they are on their own, it will begin to get very ugly. Just my .02
 
How much ammo is enough?

42.

Oh, I see... we haven't framed the question properly.

Enough.... for what?

To get you thru the next range session?

To last thru a week of civil unrest or disaster?

To ride out supply shortages and price spikes and keep you shooting?

To hand down to your great grandkids for hunting since before they were born, ammo manufacure and sale have been prohibited?

To ride out the collapse of industrial civilization as we know it?

How much is enough? You tell me...

I can't imagine wanting to have less than 1,000 rounds per gun. I'd love to have 5 times that. Why not? It's never going to get cheaper. It's never going to be more freely available. I would never EVER use credit to purchase ammo or any other expendible commodity unless it was an urgent necessity, and then only in the smallest amounts necessary.

As long as you're not stealing bread from the table or running up debt, there's no reason not to have as much as you can store. Space? You can make more space. Under the bed, under the sofa, back of the closet, behind the bookshelf, build a shed, dig a hole... whatever. The day is comming when we will all wish we'd had twice what we have now, even if only as an investment. With brass, powder and bullets going up up UP in price, it's nearly as good as gold.

Oh, and you guys who are shooting thousands of rounds a year because you like the "bang!", by all means enjoy it because a day is coming when ammo will be too precious to use "just for fun". It will all be needed for serious purposes. JMHO and you can laugh at me if you like, but I can see which way the wind's blowing and it ain't looking pretty down the road. The thought of explaining to your son someday why the rusty old guns covered with cobwebs sit idle, you can explain "I shot up all the ammo... it was fun at the time... wish you could've seen it. sigh... those were the days... you could buy it almost anywhere, even over the internet! And it was cheap! I guess that's why we thought it was so fun, never figured there'd be an end to the stuff... sigh."
 
How much is enough?

It depends on your needs and expectations.

Needs = a year or two at the range. Maybe five to seven years if you buy in bulk.

Expectations = civil unrest, zombies. That might mean several hundred for your sidearm and a few hundred for your rifle. Plus a few hundred [each] for any other defense tool you plan on loaning to another person.
 
PvtPyle, 10 percenters, *maybe*, can worry about ugly. 100 percenters ARE the ugly.

Looters like even better odds than 10 percenters represent. If you are moving through trouble, you made the wrong move. I would never directly attack a mob. I prefer to make it obvious THEY made the wrong move. S&T paves the way.

An AR does't mean you have to throw away ammo quicky. It can mean you just do business quicky and efficiently. Cover fire? Hell, fire and then cover them up! If you don't already have your lanes devised, your S&T are defective.

If everyone in your group has 200 rounds for their rifle and can shoot, that is pretty impressive to the mobs. If you have no group, you do not want to be weighed down with more than 200 rounds. Because you are going to be doing some fancy E&E. That means trying to not engage, so you're less likely to die soon. But, everyone does die, sooner, or later. When it is time to die, make the 200 rounds as effective as possible in a place and manner best suited for you.

Jerry
 
There is no real answer to this question.

I like to have enough on hand for whatever shooting sessions I plan on in the next month or so. That way I don't have to run out and buy anything, or have to hurry up and get out and reload.

Plus some for contingencies.
 
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Jerry, uhm... Hate to break it to you, but PvtPyle, with his experience, equipment, and the guys he works with would probably be a 798%. And that's before we start dropping mortar rounds. :)

We still plan on making I-15 a toll road. I've always wanted to be a Warlord.
 
Jerry, uhm... Hate to break it to you, but PvtPyle, with his experience, equipment, and the guys he works with would probably be a 798%. And that's before we start dropping mortar rounds.
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Thanks for the heads up. But, I kind of figured he might be milspec. The difference is, we are talking two different critters. If I was hooking up to a military unit, his way might be the way. I believe the thread deals more with the common man/family/group in a defensive situation. Not many private groups have the resources he speaks of backing him up.

If I had a weapons platoon, supply line and RE support at my disposal, I'd be a might more offensively aggressive, too. Throw in FAC, I'd be down right belligerent. I don't think this is what my capabilities will be in a SHTF situation.

Topper is, any private group possessing and using the capabilties he describes is going to get unwanted attention from both the mobs and whatever government that is left. Plus, you never want to have ALL of your assets in one location. Reserves should be properly protected from the obvious enemies and other possibles. We should not be trying to emulate George Patton, but Francis Marion. If by chance, we should run headon into a real Patton, we are likely toast.

I have studied 9-11, Katrina and several other government operations. I am not a huge fan of "We are from the government and here to HELP". In that respect, I am anti-government. I agree with the Founding Fathers, government is like fire, a useful tool and a fearful master.

Jerry
 
A little tangent on my own thread if I may:

A couple years ago at the local crossroads gun show here I got the funniest look I've ever gotten from a non gunnie. The convention center was split in 2 halves. One half was the gun show, one half was a home decorating show. The looks gunnies got from some patrons of the other show were just pure entertainment.

Myself, 2 brothers, my father and a couple friends pooled our resources. 4 handtrucks of ammo heading for the parking lot. 1 big pistol in a cowbow rig. 3 rifles on slings. Neat little caravan. The look one lady gave me was one of actual fear. Funny in one way. Absolutely sad in another. I've always wondered wether the look was because of lack of education, or from a mis-education.


Anyway, thanks for all the input guys.
 
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LOL! Out here, you would be suprised.
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If you got what I might be seeing you to say what you've got ( and know large numbers of others who have it), I guess I would be. Convoying without flankers and close air support is dangerous stuff. If you have the confidence to do it, more power to you. And I hope it works for you.


Jerry
 
Jerry. Ok I give. But if we're going to stretch this thread that far(not really what I intended, it's supposed to be about ammunition, not munitions):

Either the local air force base is on our side, or PvtPyle, myself, and a few others will be able to give a better account of ourselves than most.:D

PS: Mods, sorry we've managed to muck up yet another thread somehow. But it's all in good fun, ey?

One other thing-
If you are on my side of whatever *it* is, being "downright belligerent" would be a highly desireable trait. You'd be welcome to some ammo, that's for sure.
 
If you are on my side of whatever *it* is, being "downright belligerent" would be a highly desireable trait. You'd be welcome to some ammo, that's for sure.
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I didn't say I only have 200 rounds. :) But, I just had to move some of what I do have. That reassures me, it ought to be where it should already be. That stuff is heavy in any large quantity. And this is something else to consider. You want security in storage and minimal fuss in access. Too many things to consider and none can rule totally ruled out. Fuels being one of them.


Jerry
 
Serious tip

If you are young and strong, do as you please. If you are old and weak (but trecherous), like me, store you ammo in smaller than 1/2 case lots. I have spent several weeks off work because of throwing out by back moving cases of ammo.

I have since broken storage down into (mostly) .50 cal ammo cans. I can still move bunches of little heavy things, I just can't move big heavy things anymore.:( And, you can get alot of ammo in a .50 cal can!
 
Thats why I use 30 cal. cans and not 50 cal cans as a general rule. Also why I gravitate towards 223 over 308. More rounds per pound, more rounds per cubic foot.

As for moving, not planning on it. That's part of the reason I bought a 4 bed 2 bath house even though at the time I was single. Moving sucks. Moving my gun room? That would be an adventure for sure.
 
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storage of .38 etc.

I have my .22lr loose in a mil ammo can, I have been wondering (as a shooter noob) for some time now if I could just store my supplies of .38 loose in one too? Or is it better to keep it in the little box it comes in. I could store a lot more if it were loose, obviously, and the can is not overtly large to lug around.
 
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