A Solemn Reminder - Caution Graphic Image Linked
- Thread starter Captains1911
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Finally someone said it. There is no reason in the world to have one in the chamber home or anywhere else. If you think that you will be in a drawing contest with Wild Bill Hitchcok and one 100th of a second matters carry a revolver
For 44 years I put my gun away in it's holster and leave it there until either I need it, or I go to bed. If I am practicing, "anything" "shooting" I am conscious of what holster I have and that I have used it with an empty gun before shooting with it on my person.
These are guns after all, and if you keep pushing and pulling at them, eventually you may forget that this was made to kill things with, that's when accidents happen.
The worse thing one can do is engage in a conversation when drawing or holstering their weapon, that 1/10th of a second you take your mind off of what you are doing, can be a death sentence. Guns are inherently dangerous, or we wouldn't need them.
These are guns after all, and if you keep pushing and pulling at them, eventually you may forget that this was made to kill things with, that's when accidents happen.
The worse thing one can do is engage in a conversation when drawing or holstering their weapon, that 1/10th of a second you take your mind off of what you are doing, can be a death sentence. Guns are inherently dangerous, or we wouldn't need them.
Curator
Member
There are only two kinds of gun owners: those who have had an accidental discharge and those who will! Obey the #1 rule of keeping the muzzle pointed in a safe direction and you or anyone else won't get hurt.
Hardtarget
Member
Went shooting this weekend. My friend, a man with many years of shooting experience, had a good discussion of safety, carelessness, complacency and the things that can get us hurt.
Now your post and photo. Perfect timing! Perfect lesson. Makes me realize how EASY it is to get hurt.
Mark
Now your post and photo. Perfect timing! Perfect lesson. Makes me realize how EASY it is to get hurt.
Mark
hueytaxi
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Jlr2267
You must have children. Most guns in my home are loaded or I assume they are. Antiques excepted. I do have a young granddaughter who occasionally visits and the storage areas are locked while here or when I leave the premises.
You must have children. Most guns in my home are loaded or I assume they are. Antiques excepted. I do have a young granddaughter who occasionally visits and the storage areas are locked while here or when I leave the premises.
Jlr2267
Member
I do, but they are grown. I keep 2 of my firearms, a handgun and a shotgun, with ammo in the magazine, but none chambered (while in the home).
Some LEO's I have known kept loaded guns in various locations in the house, because they had learned from each other that some would invade their home to get revenge. Many officers of the court also find need to do so.
From there, a lot of folks in neigborhoods gone bad find themselves at need. They can't bail out, they would lose money on it or are trapped by circumstance.
Rural homes frequently have loaded firearms, the children are taught the rules just as they were. It's almost never a problem. It's the city kids with no idea at all who goof around and pull the trigger.
All that still hasn't clarified exactly what happened in this case, other than a two handed tug of war test fitting a gun that was obviously not cooperating. I think we agree it should not be loaded, in that situation, more than that hasn't been established.
Any further clarification, because this isn't getting anywhere.
From there, a lot of folks in neigborhoods gone bad find themselves at need. They can't bail out, they would lose money on it or are trapped by circumstance.
Rural homes frequently have loaded firearms, the children are taught the rules just as they were. It's almost never a problem. It's the city kids with no idea at all who goof around and pull the trigger.
All that still hasn't clarified exactly what happened in this case, other than a two handed tug of war test fitting a gun that was obviously not cooperating. I think we agree it should not be loaded, in that situation, more than that hasn't been established.
Any further clarification, because this isn't getting anywhere.
That's why it's called an accident. You could say the same for any accident. When driving your car, you don't necessarily have to do anything more than glance away from the road for a split second, or not see the car going through that traffic light.
If something were to interfere with the trigger, "like a foreign object", maybe something fell inside like a coin, or you didn't notice that there was wear on a nylon holster that made the outside vulnerable to being compromised by your finger, that's when something can go wrong.
Guys have them after many years of accident free 7 day a week carry, its just is exactly what it sounds like, an accident.
That's why good safety habits are important, like pointing the muzzle in a safe direction , 'even when inserting and removing your weapon'. As long as man is imperfect he will have accidents.
IE: Uncle Frank found a gun in an empty lot, took it home and started to disassemble it, "uncle Frank, knew guns", but was in a hurry to see what he had discovered.
In the process, the gun fired a 22 round, up his wrist, and bounced around before exiting in his shoulder. "I remember being shocked when this happened". Lucky for him, it only required a couple of months in a cast.
Now if you are always in a hurry and have no patience, eventually you will have an accident with a firearm, given the time and frequency you spend with one. That first rule, that says all guns are loaded, isn't a joke, more people get shot with what they thought was an unloaded gun, than most anything else.
Several times I was saved by that last check, sure enough there was a round there that I thought I removed.
Never take a gun from anyone and pull the trigger, even if they just checked it right in fron of you. Once it get in your hands you always check it again.
If something were to interfere with the trigger, "like a foreign object", maybe something fell inside like a coin, or you didn't notice that there was wear on a nylon holster that made the outside vulnerable to being compromised by your finger, that's when something can go wrong.
Guys have them after many years of accident free 7 day a week carry, its just is exactly what it sounds like, an accident.
That's why good safety habits are important, like pointing the muzzle in a safe direction , 'even when inserting and removing your weapon'. As long as man is imperfect he will have accidents.
IE: Uncle Frank found a gun in an empty lot, took it home and started to disassemble it, "uncle Frank, knew guns", but was in a hurry to see what he had discovered.
In the process, the gun fired a 22 round, up his wrist, and bounced around before exiting in his shoulder. "I remember being shocked when this happened". Lucky for him, it only required a couple of months in a cast.
Now if you are always in a hurry and have no patience, eventually you will have an accident with a firearm, given the time and frequency you spend with one. That first rule, that says all guns are loaded, isn't a joke, more people get shot with what they thought was an unloaded gun, than most anything else.
Several times I was saved by that last check, sure enough there was a round there that I thought I removed.
Never take a gun from anyone and pull the trigger, even if they just checked it right in fron of you. Once it get in your hands you always check it again.
Dr. Sandman
Member
Maybe that guy needs some dummy rounds...
Deltaboy1984
Member
Goodness keep your fingers etc out from the end of the barrel.
Jlr2267
Member
I saw this kind of injury happen live and in person (I was literally watching the guy when he had the ND and blew off his finger). Makes you real sick inside to see this kind of thing.
This is bad for the carry movement being most think they will be drawing against ten Jerry Miculiks at once. This comes from the deranged Jeff Cooper thinking who fired 5 billion rds for 40 years training for a gun fight that never happened. You do not need one in the chamber because many accidents will happen with a loaded auto with a bunch of buttons and levers and it makes bad publicity.How does one go about having an accidental discharge if the finger remains outside the trigger guard until ready to fire? Since my guns are always loaded, its hard to assume they aren't.
Those of us who have been responsible for unit safety understand that the idea of an "accident" is just whitewashing the circumstances. While the method of investigating it shouldn't be to fix blame on any one individual, the process should root out what actually did happen.
In this thread, so far, all we have is he shot his finger off. While some assert his finger must have been on the trigger, there's no factual revelation this happened, and it can, has, and will continue to happen that a combination of holster and gun will trap the trigger and cause it to fire.
So, saying it's just an accident means "we don't care about figuring it out, or even if somebody else does it either." That doesn't really work out for a way to handle guns well, or even make a real good statement to stand on.
More children are killed in swimming pools being left unfenced, or mom's driving the car distracted with her cell phone, but it's ok, it was just an accident? No, what's happening is that we give them a pass, they are already grieving. Nonetheless, we have codes and ordinances to prevent further deaths.
There are no accidents, what we have in some order of liability is ignorance, a lack of training or awareness, an acceptance of risk, or then deliberate malfeasance. Not knowing a combination of factors can lead to negative consequences is one thing, refusing to investigate and learn about it is deliberately hiding our collective head in the sand and accepting it will happen over and over.
Lacking any other facts on the case, we can at least take away that the rule of fitting a gun to a holster UNLOADED was violated. That's not an accident, it's an act of deliberate risk taking. It's self inflicted and earned. Not just some random act of life we have no control over.
In this thread, so far, all we have is he shot his finger off. While some assert his finger must have been on the trigger, there's no factual revelation this happened, and it can, has, and will continue to happen that a combination of holster and gun will trap the trigger and cause it to fire.
So, saying it's just an accident means "we don't care about figuring it out, or even if somebody else does it either." That doesn't really work out for a way to handle guns well, or even make a real good statement to stand on.
More children are killed in swimming pools being left unfenced, or mom's driving the car distracted with her cell phone, but it's ok, it was just an accident? No, what's happening is that we give them a pass, they are already grieving. Nonetheless, we have codes and ordinances to prevent further deaths.
There are no accidents, what we have in some order of liability is ignorance, a lack of training or awareness, an acceptance of risk, or then deliberate malfeasance. Not knowing a combination of factors can lead to negative consequences is one thing, refusing to investigate and learn about it is deliberately hiding our collective head in the sand and accepting it will happen over and over.
Lacking any other facts on the case, we can at least take away that the rule of fitting a gun to a holster UNLOADED was violated. That's not an accident, it's an act of deliberate risk taking. It's self inflicted and earned. Not just some random act of life we have no control over.
So are you saying your 'buddy' loaded the gun and handed it back to you??
Actually the club I belong to has gone to no holster drawing due to range damage and insurance isues. If you want to practice drawing do it with an unloaded gun. I stand at the range and shake my head at people doing 'double taps' or emptying full mags at 10yds with almost NOTHING on the target to show for it. Start SLOW with all shot grouped on the paper, then single shots from a low ready position, then multiple shots from a low ready. Then draw practice with an empty gun, then if you REALLY have to draw practice with a loaded gun on a private range that allow it. Remember if the range allows it and YOU'RE SAFE there may be someone next to you that isn't. Before my club went to NO draw and fire, I was 'swept' by several people drawing from a position further back then 3 or 9 o clock
we are not amused
Member
Tom Gresham of Gun Talk Radio, always emphasizes keeping the gun unloaded and no ammunition in the room when practicing holster drawing. It sounds like good advice, and is what I do!
My one accidental discharge involved an antique pistol that was always stored empty. Somehow, it loaded itself while sitting in a drawer. Fortunately, I didn't ignore all the rules of gun safety, and was deliberately pointing the gun in a safe direction as I fumbled with it. ( an old C96 Mauser, they can fire without a finger on the trigger, if you pull back on the slide with out locking back the hammer or setting the safety!)
Since then, I always check to see if the gun is loaded!
My one accidental discharge involved an antique pistol that was always stored empty. Somehow, it loaded itself while sitting in a drawer.
Fortunately, I didn't ignore all the rules of gun safety, and was deliberately pointing the gun in a safe direction as I fumbled with it. ( an old C96 Mauser, they can fire without a finger on the trigger, if you pull back on the slide with out locking back the hammer or setting the safety!)Since then, I always check to see if the gun is loaded!
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