Accurate AK?
- Thread starter retgarr
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Rubber_Duck
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I usually get 4" (give or take) with Wolf FMJ out of my WASR-10.
If you want a more accurate AK, take a look at the Finnish Rk.62/95 TP series. I'm not sure what the civilian available-in-the-USA counterpart would be.
If you want a more accurate AK, take a look at the Finnish Rk.62/95 TP series. I'm not sure what the civilian available-in-the-USA counterpart would be.
Domino
Member
With your run of the mill AK-47 I would say "expect" Minute of pie plate accuracy. The best I have done with my WASR-10 and ANY ammo is about 8-10" at 100 yards. Perhaps I could do a little better with optics and more extensive ammo testing, but for me that is not what my AK is for. My AK is for offhand shooting inside of 200 meters.
Rubber_Duck
Member
Good to see you understand this. Many people say AKs are innacurrate junk just because they can't keep up with an AR at 600m. Almost all AK will have a useable level of accuracy.
Prince Yamato
Member
An AK with a heavy receiver (1.6mm or milled) and a fixed stock will probably give you the best accuracy. I suspect that you'd have to handload ammo. Perhaps if you loaded it subsonic and used a sound suppressor you'd get the best accuracy.
Would it be better than a standard AK? Yes. Dramatically better? Probably not.
Would it be better than a standard AK? Yes. Dramatically better? Probably not.
motivated builders
I'd have to agree that motivation during the build makes an amazing difference. Have had several AK versions. Up until last week, my Yugo M70AB2 was the best with 2" at 100 yards. Last week a gunsmith from Boardman, Ohio (who gaining national rep for his AKs) completed a build for me from one of those Romanian G series, unissued parts kits that Classic Arms was selling. With Wolf FMJ at 100 yds, I was stitching target stakes up the middle (hand held and with fore grip)
I'd have to agree that motivation during the build makes an amazing difference. Have had several AK versions. Up until last week, my Yugo M70AB2 was the best with 2" at 100 yards. Last week a gunsmith from Boardman, Ohio (who gaining national rep for his AKs) completed a build for me from one of those Romanian G series, unissued parts kits that Classic Arms was selling. With Wolf FMJ at 100 yds, I was stitching target stakes up the middle (hand held and with fore grip)
bogie
Member
Do you own a barn?
Can you go inside it?
Put the earplugs on before you commence the accuracy test.
mr.trooper
Member
a well built AK will do 3 MOA, maybe a hair better if its exceptional.
missouri dave
Member
My arsenal arms ak, milled reciever with fixed stock, would shoot 4 to 5 inches at 100 yards with just about any ammo. With really good ammo it would shoot just under 3 inches. All shooting for groups done from an improvised bench rest.
gcrookston
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My Arsenal AK107, scoped will deliver 3-4 MOA with wolf. Good enough for it's intended purpose. I have an Ak84s that will hold to 2 MOA "occasionally"
AK103K
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This pretty much covers it.
I've owned/own and shot AK's across the price ranges and there is really little difference in how they shoot. The exception here is, guns assembled from kits made here. I've always had better luck with guns that were made or barreled in the factories that make them for the military of the issuing country. I'm not saying "all" the kit guns are poor shooters, just that they have been the least accurate for me. I'm sure there are good ones out there somewhere.
Other than the kit issue, the accuracy issue with the AK's is usually more of an ammo or shooter issue than it is the rifle.
If your AK wont consistently shoot 3-4" at 100 yards from field positions, using the iron sights, with ammo it likes, then there's something wrong with it. You should easily be able to keep good COM shots on silhouette targets out to 300 yards/meters.
If you put a good red dot on one, it will easily keep up with an AR out to any realistic distance. You will also get very similar hits on the targets.
Ammo like Wolf can vary widely between lots. I've had good and bad, and you never really know what your going to get, and it can be hard to get the same lot number when you do find one that shoots, especially if you order bulk on line. The best Wolf I've used has been their 154 grain SP's.
The best overall results I've had, has been with the old Barnaul brand, which I believe is now being sold under the "Bear" brands. Specifically, their 125 grain SP's were very consistent and accurate. Their bullets have a fully jacketed base, which usually do a lot better than the rolled crimp type usually seen.
3-5" moa seems to be the average, but a souped up higher-end can easily score 2". But, by then, you're coming close to the AR price point. AKs are always considered "for the money" guns, so you gotta decide what exactly that "for the money" amount is for you.
FlyinBryan
Member
if it shot 4" it would be the most accurate ak ive ever seen.
all the ones ive seen are 8-10 inches at 100, and off the 11x17" plate at 200. forget 300.
if your looking for target grade acccuracy, like sub 1", your shopping in the wrong department.
if you want an extremely tough rifle and dont have a cleaning kit, the ak could be perfect for you.
if you want the tightest groups, you will need a little more than it can give.
all the ones ive seen are 8-10 inches at 100, and off the 11x17" plate at 200. forget 300.
if your looking for target grade acccuracy, like sub 1", your shopping in the wrong department.
if you want an extremely tough rifle and dont have a cleaning kit, the ak could be perfect for you.
if you want the tightest groups, you will need a little more than it can give.
AK103K
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How many have you seen?
This was shot at 200 yards with a SAR1 with its slightly canted iron sights using Wolf 154 grain SP''s. The smaller group at the bottom, from a rest to confirm zero, the upper group from a cross legged sitting position shooting at a steady cadence.
This was shot with a Krebs AK103K(14" barrel) with an Aimpoint on an Ultimak rail, offhand, at 100 yards.
One of these was with my SOCOM, the other, the SAR (I think, or it might have been my WASR, cant remember now) either way, not much of a diffference, except in the price of the gun.
2 second snap shots from low ready using the AK103K. Left is 100 yards, right, 50.
Target guns they are not, but then again, I dont shoot to many bullseye type targets or matches anymore. None of these have an aiming point. Funny thing is, I get pretty much the same results with any rifle I shoot these type targets with, AK, AR, M1A, etc. .
Like I said earlier, unless there is something radically wrong with the gun, its usually not the guns fault if you cant shoot it. Funny thing is, when it comes to shooting, I rarely ever hear the person say they might be the issue, and its almost ALWAYS the guns fault.
They all need cleaning and proper treatment. If you dont take care of your weapon, how do you expect it to take care of you?
Sometimes I really wonder from some of the comments, if there really are "riflemen" still out there these days.
HorseSoldier
Member
AK inaccuracy is grossly overstated on the internet for the most part, like other posters have noted. Using cheap Wolf ammo, where velocity spreads can exceed 100 fps within the same batch of ammo, won't help much with getting good groups, though.
Texas Bob
Member
Not my "WORDS", but someone pointed out to me; "Most AKs are a bit more accurate than most people give them credit for, and most ARs are a bit more reliable than most people give them credit for." In 7.62x39 what well help or hurt the most is the right bullet diameter for you rifle. I've seen bullets mike anywhere from .308 to .311 which is why some people I know carry a digital set of calibers to any gun show they are planning to bulk buy at. ymmv
aka108
Member
Pretty much 4 inch groupings at 100 yds. My $200 stock Saiga shoots smaller groups than my Arsenal SAM 7S.
KBintheSLC
Member
My Yugo is quite accurate out to about 300 yards. I have found that ammo makes a big difference. Any bulk Russian ammo is significantly less accurate than say a high grade hunting load. The Russian stuff is more conical with less of a flat contact surface on the bullet itself. The difference is major, cutting my group size nearly in half when using high grade ammo compared to Wolf or Brown Bear. Nonetheless, I am still getting around 2 MOA even with bulk ammo. I can get it down to about 1.25 MOA with some high grade hunting loads and a decent scope at 100 yards... the same will give me around a 5" group at 300 yards.
Gun wise, I have found the Israeli Galil to be an excellent shooter. But I still think the ammo choice takes first spot in determining accuracy out of any decent AK. As for the canted, distorted, cheap-o's... just point, shoot, and have fun with it... it is what it is.
_N4Z_
Member
My Vector Arms clone, built on Polish parts, will shoot 4 inch groups with Brown Bear 123hp or fmj - 5 shots at 100 yards. Barrel must be allowed to cool off between groups or that 4 inch number will grow considerably.
It will shoot Wolf just fine too, but the accuracy is not there. More like 5-6" with Wolf.
It will shoot Wolf just fine too, but the accuracy is not there. More like 5-6" with Wolf.
jackdanson
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Friends saiga 7.62x39 get 2-3 inches with wolf. That is with a scope and rest.
Those people need to learn how to shoot them then. I've owned 8 AK's myself and shot several others and the worst I've come across was a MAK90 that shot 6" groups at 100 yards. AK's aren't tackdrivers, but the typical AK will shoot about 4 MOA if the shooter knows what he's doing. Get a Saiga in .223, scope it and shoot some Black Hills match through it and it will probably do 2 MOA or better.
Most people just can't hit the broad side of a barn using notch and post iron sights. You could put the same sights on a bench rest rifle and they'd shoot the same 8" to 10" groups.
bogie
Member
Well, I suppose could always screw in a Turkey choke...
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