Air Marshal Leaves Plane After Dropping Bullets

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From what I've read, the federal air marshal training actually is pretty good, and most of the air marshals are probably competent. But we do need to keep in mind that in any large group there are those who are outstanding because they are above average, and those who are outstanding because they just barely made the cut.

Many years ago Ann Landers wrote about doctors that we should always remember, 50% the doctors in practice graduated in the bottom half of their class. Guess what? The same applies to air marshals. The real world isn't Lake Woebegone, where all the children are above average.
 
Some thing is wrong...

The last time (maybe 10 years ago) I flew commercially there was carpet on the floor. So could someone tell me how a magazine, dropped on carpet, could eject a bunch of cartridges?

When was the last time anyone saw this happen at an IDPA match with "tactical" reloads? Ever, or never?

My vote goes in the "I'm the only one professional" category.

It just not logical to expect that an incompetent federal agency would have competent agents.

Got rope?
 
Funny to see one thread with "how I dropped a gun in public" stories, and another thread with "OMG HE DROPED HIS BOOLETS COPS R DUM" posts. :rolleyes:
 
So far, the Air Marshalls have killed more innocent civilians than terrorists
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LG, way to stay on the High Road. This is a bullcrap statement if I've ever heard one.
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Old Dog:

As far as I know, the statement is correct.

An air marshal killed one innocent civilian last Fall (the South American guy with mental issues in Florida). The shooting was obviously justifiable, but the guy was no terrorist. Good chance he would have been innocent on any disorderly conduct charges for reason of insanity (probably temporary because he didn't take his medicine - but I'm no criminal lawyer).

I haven't heard of any air marshalls killing terrorists, and it seems like it would have been widely reported.

Unless someone can bring up an example of an air marshall killing a terrorist, the statement is true.

I agree with you though, no reason to bash LEO for no reason. I think most do it because the media indicates that LEO can be trusted with guns, but civilians cannot.
 
I have heard of floor plates popping off of mags, and it's not much of stretch if a person only cleans them every few thousand rounds and puts them back together in a hurry.

I'm with biker, stuff happens.
 
olddog said:
Stuff happens. Never ceases to amaze me how y'all pile on when someone in a law enforcement capacity experiences an event such as this. Standing by for further ridiculous variations of the same tired quotations ("Only the police and the military are professional enough ...")
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You know, stuff does happen... to everyone, however, you'd see less LEO bashing or ridiculing about things like 'dropping a mag' if there wasn't all this crap talk from these very LEO's about how civilians aren't professional enough or trained enough to carry. Now, I know that MOST of those in law enforcement don't feel that way about civilians, but it's that very vocal minority that doesn't get soundly told to **** by the majority that brings about the LEO bashing. It's not any different than people bashing liberals, conservatives, jews, blacks, mexicans, blondes, rednecks, etc.....
 
I'm Thankful for the Air Marshalls

Inasmuch as my wife and daughter will be traveling internationally within the next couple of weeks, I am VERY glad we have air marshals. I rest much more comfortable that they WILL be safe.

Regarding the statement that marshals "...have killed...", I would rather look at it as how many thousands and millions of contact hours have they had, and how many incidents? Precious few.

Doc2005
 
to everyone, however, you'd see less LEO bashing or ridiculing about things like 'dropping a mag' if there wasn't all this crap talk from these very LEO's about how civilians aren't professional enough or trained enough to carry.
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Um, really? And just how often do you read LEOs' posts on this forum routinely talking about how civilians aren't professional, or well enough trained, to carry? Examples?
 
so what, the guy dropped a mag. he is a human being and we are very flawed. i am sure no one here has ever dropped a mag before. unless they are leos. :rolleyes:
 
I am not faulting the Air Marshall because he dropped his mag. That could happen to anyone.

I am faulting the entire Air Marshall program because it is a complete joke, costs too much money for the service provided, and leaves huge gaps in security. All it does is give people a false sense of security. Air Marshalls are only on about 10 percent of flights.
 
I fly all the time for work and I can understand how something like that could easily happen. Not sure what gear that the use but even with magazine pouches with snaps, you could get one unsnapped pretty easily in the seats and it wouldn't take much to catch a magazine and pull it out if you're trying to navigate through business class seats.

Nothing against the guy at all. If I carried on a plane with my normal carry gear, I bet that I would lose a magazine, too, at some point.
 
You guys are kind of hard on yourselves, no? Taking the High Road is one thing, but refusing to criticize a gov't agency that illustrates multiple examples of ineptitude and criminal infiltration, when that agency exists to fill a role created by another bureaucracy disallowing people to do what the agency then fills the need to do...

Hypocritical, inefficient, inept. Probably expensive, too.
 
I think that criticizing the agency and the supersizing of the US government is one thing but the fact that a guy dropped a magazine doesn't really demonstrate anything but that he dropped a magazine.

From what I know (all anecdotal and none of it first person anecdotes), the expansion of the Air Marshalls has been a joke...but that doesn't mean that this one guy deserves derision for the simple act of dropping a magazine. Maybe he is a "Fife" but you can't tell that from the article. You can't tell anything about him from the article.
 
Nah. My point is that if you carry and handle guns and the peripheral equipment long enough, you're gonna screw up. I carry a gun from when I wake up to when I go to sleep - have since God was a boy.
Stuff happens. Mountains, molehills and all of that...

Biker
 
If you ignore all the other wrongs, Pilgrim still has a very valid point.

The agent did nothing to enhance anyone's safety. He had a choice to make between being embarassed and still doing his job, or leaving. That's a failure any way you look at it. When your ego comes above the safety of others, especially ones that are disarmed, and you are supposed to protect.

Still doesn't look too good. Plus the all the other criticisms.
 
he left because his identity was compromised. i guess if you look hard enough you will find fault with anything. :barf:
 
So far, the Air Marshalls have killed more innocent civilians than terrorists.
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:rolleyes:

Lone Gunman, does the term, "statistically irrelevant" mean anything to you?

It's been 1728 days since 9/11/2001...the difference between 1 in 1728 and 0 in 1728 is "statistically irrelevant".

It's been roughly 4,1465 hours since the events of 9/11/2001...the difference between 1 in 4,1465 and 0 in 4,1465 is "statistically irrelevant".

So your statement has no real analytical merit, and thus I can only deduce that it was only added for the intended effect of taking a worthless jab at the program and thus, in layman's terms, it's full of BS.


As for the rest of you Amazing Kreskins, are you available for parties and other events? The fact that you can know enough of exactly what happened from an obviously ignorant and flawed news report with a staggering lack of detail is simply awesome, and I'm sure I know some 8-year-olds that would get a kick out of your superpowers.

None of you have ever had a paddle attachment walk up on you in close confines and release a magazine when the base pad or finger rest clipped itself on something? Then you obviously don't carry on an airplane or in the rafters while running cable.

None of you have had a paddle retention system fail where the rivet or screw stripped or backed itself out and thus released enough tension to allow the mag to pretty much fall out? Lucky you.

None of you have had a snap, button or screw/bushing fail to seat or remain seated on a leather retention system? It boggles the mind.

None of you can see how this can happen when you use your gear for more than carrying concealed while walking your dog? What's the weather like in your neck of reality?

I have had 2 tension systems fail on top name and good quality holsters, I have indeed had a magazine squeeze itself out of a Kydex mag holder while standing in an elevator at work (alone thankfully)...I have also had a magazine's defective floor plate shoot itself off underneath my shirt sending the floor plate, spring, follower and the ammunition up into my shirt and then witness the horror of gravity doing its thing to send them all straight onto the floor. :eek:



Let me know about the party thing, that's a cool trick...not one that any intelligent adult would enjoy I’m sure; but for the kids, I think they'd love you guys.
 
Lone Gunman, does the term, "statistically irrelevant" mean anything to you?
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I wonder if the crazy guy that was killed by Air Marshalls considered his death "statistically irrelevant".

I wonder if his family considered it irrelevant?

Will the jury consider it irrelevant during the ensuing civil lawsuit?

Statistics themselves are irrlevant, when we are talking about one individual life.
 
It must have been a Cleavon Little in "Blazing Saddles". Putting his weapon under his chin he proclaims "Nobody move or the air marshal gets it!". LOL what a maroon. Joe
 
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