AK Variants

[Bigjake]

Since i'm wasting the afternoon away on THR, I was wondering if you guys could help me compile a list of the different ak's readily available out there, and thier pros and cons. Have at it!

Heres what i can think of

SAR series. seems nice, takes any old mag you put on it, price-efficient.

Saiga series. don't own one

WASR series...?? guys on another thread of mine said they come in single and double stack styles, and are good rifles. how does one distinguish from a single or double stack model, just width of mag well on reciver?

those are the ones i know of

 

[pmbiker]

I'm particular to the milled Bulgarian and American/Bulgarian rifles. Hammer forged, chrome lined barrel on a forged and milled reciever. What else can I say?

Bulgarian slr-101 in single stack or double stack.

Am/Bg is the SAM series, -7 in 7.62x39 and -5 in .223

SAM series has recently included an underfolder and a fine stamped reciever ak-74 clone.

Several shop built kit guns on US made recievers available at places like Atlantic firearms and joeken.

Global Trades builds fine aks on their own US made reciever. Vepr series from Robinson Armament, rpk reciever and heavy barrel made in russia.

 

[Ivy Mike]

Arsenal Inc. recently released the SLR105 line.

This is a stamped reciever (cheaper!) with the usual chrome lined barrel. The rifles are chambered in 5.45x39 and shoot very nicely. I had the pleasure of squeezing a few rounds off with one of these. Better quality than the usual Romanian variants yet cheaper than the milled models. The milled may be better, but you definitely pay for it and it may not be that important to some.

I will be buying a stamped Bulgie from Arsenal when funds permit.

 

[Shane333]

Saiga rifles.

Pros:
Inexpensive. Depending on the caliber they can be found around here from $200 to $230.
Authentic Russian manufacture.
High capacity magazines are now being imported for them.
They're easy to convert to pistol grip and it can be done for less than $100.
They tend to be some of the more accurate AK variants.
There are multiple calibers to choose from, including .223 and .308.

Cons:
If you want the pistol grip, you have to do the conversion (easy, but still an inconvenience + extra cost).
20 and 30 round Saiga mags are expensive right now ($30+ each).
You can convert the Saiga to take regular 5.56 or 5.45 mags or convert mags to work in the Saiga (either way), but that's another inconvenience.

 

[RichardW]

My first (and at this point only) AK is a Saiga in 308 and I based my decision on what I read on forums. The only drawback is the looks, but I will be converting to pistol grip and then will have a factory new AK in 308 for not much more than $400.

 

[Shane333]

RichardW,

Which barrel length did you get for your Saiga .308?

 

[RichardW]

I got the 16", and I'm glad I did. I wanted something in more of a carbine length for maneuverability and so it would be more like an AK when I converted it. Also, when I went to buy all that I saw at the gunshow were 16" so it made the decision easy. I'm glad I did because I have read on forums that the 22" is no more accurate than the 16", which is unusual.

I should have added that my estimate of $400 total includes stock and handguards.

 

[Shane333]

RichardW,

My only real concern with the 16" barrel is the muzzle flash and loss of velocity potential. I also admit that there's something really cool looking about the rifle with the 20+" barrel. I guess I like the dragunov-ish look.

For an urban/suburban carbine, the 16" barrel would be hard to beat. It pretty much turns all cover into concealment.

I ask these questions because I'm seriously looking at getting the Saiga .308, and I'm trying to decide which barrel length I want more.

 

[benEzra]

I love my SAR-1. The main "pro" (and the reason I chose an AK lookalike over an AR) is the price; I simply couldn't afford anything more than the $379 I paid for it. (You could even get them a bit cheaper than that, but I dealt with my local gun shop so I could examine in person the one I wanted and pay for it in installments.)

It's also looks a whole lot like a real AKM, making it a nice companion to my M39 (built on a 1905 M1891) and M44 and my wife's Tula SKS; it's neat to line the rifles up and see the progression of features and those which were retained in each generation of rifle. I kicked around the idea of putting a Galil-style sidefolder on it after the Feinstein ban expired, but decided to keep it stock for exactly that reason.

I like the 16.5" barrel of the SAR-1 a lot better than the ~18" barrel on a friend's Norinco. It also has the built-in optics rail, which is nice (though most AK lookalikes do these days).

Saigas are very nice rifles, but personally I HAVE to have the pistol grip stock--partly for aesthetic reasons, partly for authenticity of appearance (the collector bug), and mostly because I really dislike the ergonomics of a traditional rifle stock.

The one thing I'd like it to have that it doesn't is a threaded muzzle and a (cool looking) slant brake. Depending on the way the political winds blow, I may have that rectified someday.

 

[RichardW]

Shane,
One thing you may consider is get the 308 in the long barrel and then get the 7.62x39 in the 16"! A future project I have thought about is the 7.62x39 as a folder.
The velocity drop may be insignificant, but I don't really know.

benEzra,
It's fairly easy to put a pistol grip on the Saiga, of course that's easy for me to say because I haven't done it yet. You need to change out the fire control group too (US made). And I think an American stock or gas piston to get your US parts count up to where it needs to be.
Of course you can't add the history factor that a real AK has.

 

[Shane333]

Thanks RichardW. I've already got the .223 in 16". I'm getting my US parts together to do the conversion. I guess I'll just have to get the longer .308.

 

[goon]

The older WASR's I have seen had a decent finish and some even had some pretty nice looking blond stocks. The older SAR's were a little rougher and had wood that looked like had been dipped in pancake syrup.

The newer SAR's I have seen (no longer imported IIRC) still had fairly bad looking wood (but better) but the metal looked half decent.
The newer WASR's I have seen look bad.

Compared to a higher end gun like a SA-M7 or a VEPR, both are going to feel like they are full of sand until you get them broken in and both are going to look rougher.
However, I have never seen any AK that didn't work reliably.

If you want pretty, either be prepared to put a little work into a romanian or buy something else.
If just want a functional blaster, a Romanian AK will do just fine.

 

[Browns Fan]

What's wrong with the basic Saiga stock instead of the pistol grip. There is one pictured in "Saiga .308, should I?" that looks great!

 

[Shane333]

Browns Fan,

It greatly depends on your build and preferences. I have relatively short arms, and the basic Saiga stock puts the receiver too far out in front of me to be comfortable. It makes the Saiga feel too front heavy. Shooting from prone position becomes especially uncomfortable.

If you're a tall/large person and the sporter stock feels comfortable, then by all means stick with it. It does have a classy profile.

 

[benEzra]

What's wrong with the basic Saiga stock instead of the pistol grip. There is one pictured in "Saiga .308, should I?" that looks great!

Just personal preference. Like Shane333, I have short arms, and the standard AK fits me perfectly, though long-armed galoots sometimes gripe that the gun was "made for Siberian midgets." I also find pistol-grip stocks more comfortable to shoot, and aesthetically I think they look better, but opinions vary on that.

On a gun that I might possibly ever use for defensive purposes, I also like the fact that a pistol-grip stock (1) gives you more leverage against someone trying to take the gun from you if you are jumped in a close-quarters situation, (2) allows you to short-stock the gun more easily in a home-defense situation, and (3) allows you to safe the rifle in "position sul" without bending your shooting wrist like a chicken wing.