allow me to vent about the classic turret...

[rbernie]

I would be willing to bet that the rounds would chamber if I were to reload them... but that would also mean that I would have to ignore what a gage is telling me. This would be a rather unsafe reloading practice. Don't you agree?

No, I don't agree at all. If the round chambers readily (and presuming that the loading is itself safe), then the brass size is safe.

Look at it another way - how do you think neck-sizers work? They don't push the shoulders back or resize the base at all. In general, the less resizing that's needed the more accurate the round will be and the longer the brass will last.

Addressing your concern that the press is causing the sizing error - I gotta tell you that logic dictates that it cannot be the press. If the press's ram is fully pressing the shellholder against the bottom of the die, then any amount of slop in the die holder has been removed from the system by the upward pressure of the ram. This means that any sizing issues are related to the dimensions of the die and/or shellholder - period.

 

[FullEffect1911]

If the round chambers readily (and presuming that the loading is itself safe), then the brass size is safe.

I would agree with you if I were loading for a bolt action... However I am loading for a semi auto. Full length sizing and proper headspace are critical to avoid an out of battery firing. Even if the chance may be slim.

This means that any sizing issues are related to the dimensions of the die and/or shellholder - period.

Unless the turret wasn't perpendicular to the ram.

 

[SSN Vet]

I see your point about the possibility of the turret play causing the sizing die to be slightly angled wrt. the ram/casing.

But given the force of the ram/shell plate pushing firmly on the sizing die, I suspect that it's more than enough to overcome the weight of the other dies and apparatus on the other side of the turret and push the entire turret up flat.

Remember, there's no pivot point in the middle of the turret. The only thing that would cause it to get "cock eyed" would be the weight on the other size of the turret inducing a moment....but you've go ~100 lbs. + on one side and ~2 lbs. on the other side. I think it's going to push untill the shell plate is hard up on the sizing die, 360 degrees around.....lifting the turret the same amount all around.

I'll have to use the tail end of my callipers (depth probe) and check the distance from the top of the turret to the frame all around, both at rest and when the ram is hard up on the sizing die.

If the distance is the same all around, I think that would negate your theory.

I'm still wagering it's the sizing dies fault. If so, send it back to Lee and ask them to re-machine or replace the die.

 

[FullEffect1911]

Remember, there's no pivot point in the middle of the turret. The only thing that would cause it to get "cock eyed" would be the weight on the other size of the turret inducing a moment....but you've go ~100 lbs. + on one side and ~2 lbs. on the other side. I think it's going to push untill the shell plate is hard up on the sizing die, 360 degrees around.....lifting the turret the same amount all around.

Good point and well explained...

I can see it going either way really. My thought is that because the ram side of the lugs contact first and so the far side wouldn't contact as much... though conversely the bottom of the die is flat as is the ram which would help bolster your side of things.

Come wednesday I will know for certain on this one...

Is it the press or is it the die.... oh the anticipation.

 

[FullEffect1911]

And the Verdict is...

Alright, on lunch today I set up the new Classic Cast press and resized the cases that were out of spec (by the way the mounting hole locations for the classic turret and classic cast are in-fact different).

I screwed down the die until it contacted the shell holder and then screwed it in an additional 1/2 turn. Lubed the case, sized it and viola, an in spec full sized case. There was no playing around with set up, it was just as simple as that.

So the solid single stage press was the answer to my woes and my die is perfectly fine.

So I will again re-voice my opinion, there are definite applications where a single stage press is better. There are also applications where an auto advancing classic turret is better. However I don't believe that the LCT makes the Classic cast no longer useful.

By the way, the classic cast is one heck of a press, solid as they come.

 

[DEDON45]

I think the best compromise is to outfit a single stage with the Hornady LnL system... fast die changes, and no flex issues. I use a LnL AP press, so there's no flex issues there either, but I could see where a turret press might cause a few problems there.

 

[krs]

Did I hear right that someone estimates the "necessary" play in the head of the Lee turret press at 1/16"??

I have a Redding T-6 (Turret, 6 die mounting holes). It works fine and has no discernable movement in the turning plate. Big heavy castiron motha' with balls that locate it positively in each position. Turns easily and chunks into place perfectly lined up for whatever stage. Great press, had it for over twenty years.

So I thought to wonder if Redding might have come up with a conversion to progressivize the T-6. They didn't, but they now make a turret press called the "T-7" (Turret, seven die positions). I'd bet there's NO play in that one either, and you know why?

That press costs almost $600.00...that's why.


The moral of this story is one you've heard over and over..............."You Get What You Pay For", and there's no play in that.

 

[krs]

My Redding turret autoadvances and indexes too.............and it uses my left hand to do it.

 

[GLOCK45GUY]

To FE1911

How much do you want for your LCT? I'll take it off your hands if you don't want it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[RustyFN]

The moral of this story is one you've heard over and over..............."You Get What You Pay For", and there's no play in that.

And some are happy paying a lot less. Most can make the classic work and some can't. Mine makes as good or better ammo than the T-7 and makes it faster for $450 less. If your happy with your press that's great. I have found in life that just because something cost more doesn't make it better.
Rusty

 

[FullEffect1911]

The lee classic turret really is a good press, it just couldn't get my .223 sized to within gage specs. The press really shines with it's auto advance and loading for pistol calibers. And the price is certainly right. It is just necessary to be aware of it's potential issues. Also keep in mind my AR's chamber may be near the high end of chamber tolerances. This would require the full length sizing to need to size more. It was very likely a combination of my gun's chamber and the bit of play in the turret, therefore it just didn't suit my needs.

Also the turret play is probably nearer 1/32" of clearance rather then 1/16".

 

[Redhat]

FE1911,

If you have adjusted the die in far enough to take out the slight movement of the turret, I would encourage you to consider trying another turret. All I can say is mine does fine resizing .223, .270 and 30-06. I also use a headspace gage from Wilson to check .223 and 30-06. Luckily, no problems so far.

 

[RustyFN]

FullEffect1911 I wasn't referring to you in my post and I'm sorry if it sounded that way. I just get a kick out of people that think it didn't cost enough to be any good and their's is the best because it cost five times more. There are people that have been making great ammo on the cheap Lee Challenger kit for years without any problems. If Lee products were as bad as some like to tell then Lee wouldn't be in business. I hope you enjoy your classic as much as I have enjoyed mine.
Rusty

 

[RustyFN]

Also the turret play is probably nearer 1/32" of clearance rather then 1/16".

Mine is probably the same, I was guessing 1/16 at the most because I wasn't near the press. I don't see the play as being an issue at least in my loadings. I check OAL quite often to make sure everything stays good and it has never been off more than .002. If the play in the turret was that bad my numbers wouldn't be anywhere near that. You can find horror stories about any press if you look around.
Rusty

 

[FullEffect1911]

FullEffect1911 I wasn't referring to you in my post...

No need to apologize Rusty, I was backing your play... I agree about the price thing.

You can find horror stories about any press if you look around.

I wouldn't call my issue a horror story, but more of a shortcoming. I really think it wasn't just the press, but my rifle's chamber too. I would bet the LCT works great for most people (remember it sized never fired brass just fine).

I would encourage you to consider trying another turret.

a good suggestion... but alas I tried that. The Single stage set me straight.