Another lever action checked off the list

[silicosys4]

The iconic Winchester model 94.

Tuesday was the day I went on the hunt for lever actions, specifically a Winchester model 94. I really wanted a pre-64 model 94, but I haven't seen a decent pre-64 around here for under $1k for years andI haven't seen ANY model 94 under $500 for about as long.
I had one possibility lined up at a LGS that I was going to be visiting anyways, so I went around and checked what was available elsewhere just to make sure I wasn't passing something nicer by.

Well, the only thing that was interesting in the first store was a 1901 Winchester 1894 octagon 26" rifle for $1100. Tempting, yes. Unfortunately the original bluing had all been stripped and the entire gun was poorly cold blued, including the butt plate and fore end cap, so I rather reluctantly passed. I actually think I will go back and check on this one in near future.

My other option was a model 94 1968 Buffalo Bill commemorative, which is a 26"(?) rifle pattern. I like the rifle pattern a lot in the winchester rifles, much more than the carbine to be honest, but the buffalo bill commemorative has that really cheap painted finish and cheesy machine engraving so it just looks super cheap. $550 was pretty tempting though, thats the cheapest model 94 of any kind in any condition that i've seen in a long time and condition wise it was pretty good, about 95%.

There was one more, a 1941 model 94, but it was $2k, with a lot of finish wear. Out of my price range and I didn't see why it was almost triple the price of the gun I ended up with, with less finish.

So this is what I ended up with as part of a group purchase I made recently, the original option I had seen at a new LGS; a 1962 model 94 for $700. Not at all perfect, but honest with a good bore and decent wood. And it nicely fills a gap in my lever action collection.

Thanks for looking

 

[dredd]

I think you did good.

Congrats!

 

[NIGHTLORD40K]

Good choice!

 

[jmr40]

There was one more, a 1941 model 94, but it was $2k, with a lot of finish wear. Out of my price range and I didn't see why it was almost triple the price of the gun I ended up with, with less finish.

With 94's the year 1964 isn't a huge deal. Winchester completely redesigned the model 70 in 1964. In fact, a 1964 model 70 should really have a different model designation than a 1963 or earlier model 70. The guns were very different. Not so much with a 1964 model 94. The changes to a model 94 were mostly cosmetic and took place gradually. After 1963 the model 94 was still the same gun design.

But there is a HUGE difference in desirability for guns made prior to WW-2. That's why the price difference. Winchester didn't just fall off a cliff in 1964. Quality was declining after the war and Winchester was struggling. Especially with their model 70.

 

[tubeshooter]

Congratulations and enjoy!


I picked up a commemorative made in 1968 and I'm grateful to hear that the "1964 cutoff" doesn't impact the model 94 as much as the model 70. So it makes me feel a little better about mine; thanks.

 

[Weflyfast]

Remember - you can never have too many levers-

 

[dieselchief]

congrats....next up a 32 win special? just saying....

 

[CraigC]

I also prefer rifles to carbines but both have their place. The older guns definitely have an appeal all their own. I got a "new" 1953 model about 2yrs ago and paid quite a bit more for it. Put a receiver sight on it as soon as I got it home and it is no longer unfired.

The engraving definitely leaves a lot to be desired on a lot of the commemoratives but Winchesters of that era were not painted, they were plated. If they're black, most of them are black chrome.

https://du-lite.com/blackening-post-64-winchester-receivers/

 

[Dave DeLaurant]

Nice bore condition!

 

[Seedy Character]

'64 is significant in M94, also.
In '64, Winchester switched to sintered metal receivers, MAJOR change.

'70s were the commemorative a week years.some were pretty cheesy looking.

 

[Pat Riot]

Congratulations on your new old Winchester.

 

[Gordon]

Nice looking 94 and a great year and a good price for that condition which seems very good to excellent. Lets face it the build quality on American fire arms PROBABLY peaked in the mid 1930s . A gunsmith position in a major manufacturer during that period was very precious to the worker and they put their all into it and by then there was a lot of experience with very high QC standards. The material physical properties were pretty much developed by then as was the tooling still in good shape , and kept that way. During the war years the material properties developed a little better, war does that IF you are on the winning side ! In the post war years, say early 50s we really see the major manufacturers again turning out a quality product , maybe a little faster than pre war tho. Lets take the Model 70 mentioned before , which I am most familiar with , although I do own a beautiful 1949 Winchester Model 94 I owned quite a few pre 64 Model 70s which is a rather cultish following. In around the 1954 -53 time frame the one piece forged bolt was gradually phased out into a very well welded and ground two piece. fabrication from techniques developed in WW2 . Yes the quality on normal Model 70 walnut wood gradually went down from the mid 50s until 1963 as did the details of finish as Winchester fought off increasing money woes on their aging labor intensive designs which their competitors like Remington had abandoned after WW2 .
I think the XTR series of Winchesters , despite using castings and stampings the earlier pre 64 model didn't , were very well turned out, they were trying to recover sales from the cheap looking stuff they turned out for about a decade. My experience of Ranger 1894 guns from the later 1980s and 90s has NOT been good. The castings and stampings and QC had really gone to Pot (metal) and they were almost impossible to get those cute little Trapper carbines to be reliable . Amazingly right before the New Haven Made Winchester went away in late 90s the Classic Model 70s were once again pretty darn good and especially the Stainless Ultimate Classic ones a great gun IMHO.

 

[pintail]

I recently bought a 1958 94 carbine in 30.30, an itch I'd not scratched in over 60 years.
Here in the UK they are not held in such esteem as in the US and my one cost me about $250. It's not perfect and has obviously had some work done on it but it shoots fine. The work that it has received includes a new bolt lock which is 0.005" oversize, reducing the headspace to 0.002" there were some wear issues, particularly the carrier spring and it's detents on the carrier and the snib on the link lever is worn so I'll probably fit a new one of those when homestead get them in.
I reload for it, manly cast bullets but I have around 100 factory rounds as many places here in the UK require factory ammo to hunt.

 

[Riomouse911]

That is a very nice looking 1894 there, you did great.

The 1894 is my all time favorite rifle, it was the one I always gravitated to when peering into the gun cabinet in the living room of the ranch house.

My Grandfather gave my Uncle the 1930’s era carbine I always ogled when he passed. A 1894 .30-30 was also the first gun I bought with my own money when I turned 18.

That first 1894 that I bought I had to sell due to broke-college-student-syndrome, but in the years since I have bought two post ‘64 (but pre angle eject) .30-30 carbines and one angle eject (pre safety) Trapper .44 mag,

I was also given a used and pretty worn “Golden Spike” 1894 commemorative from my Dad. That is one gaudy old streetwalker of a rifle, I wouldn’t ever take it out to shoot, it’s too much of an eyesore. I just may have it cut to 16.5” to make an Trapper-ish out of it and Cerakote the metal to hide the awful gold colored plating.

Congratulations on filling that void with a very nice carbine. If you go out to shoot it let us know how it shoots.

Stay safe.

 

[Driftwood Johnson]

Did somebody say Winchester Model 1894?

I have two.

This rather nondescript carbine was made during the war years, sometime between 1943 and 1948.






I lucked into this 26" octagon barreled rifle a few years ago. A very early one, it shipped in 1895. It is in very nice condition, no rust, and most of the blue is still on it. It came with a tang mounted peep sight. I think I did pretty good on this one, $1200 a few years ago.









A nice little ivory bead set in the front sight.






A close up of the peep sight.










I took them both to the range one day. I did better with the rifle. No, not 100 yards, the target was set out at 25 yards.

 

[silicosys4]

Welp, I've decided. This gun is pitted and beat up enough that I'm going to go ahead and refinish the stock to match my 1873 winchester. I don't think i'll hurt the value if I strip and refinish this beat up old gal.

The goal is to make this:




look more like this:



My plan is to strip the varnish off with stripper and rags, then 10-12 coats of boiled linseed oil worked lightly into the wood between coats with extra fine steel wool.

 

[silicosys4]

allright, after 4 hours worth of work, we are on our way.
from this



to this



from this



to this



the forearm wasnt nearly as chewed up as the stock. from this



to this



As I keep adding coats over the next week it will darken up and gain more depth. I'll post a final update when its done, and a range report if I can find some ammo and the time to shoot it.

 

[Rodfac]

Looks like a good project for restoration Silicosy. I'd have no regrets refinishing the stock but would not touch the bluing, were it mine. How's it shoot?

I've had four M-94's over the years: a rifle in .38-55, a 2nd rifle in .30-30 (a Texas Centennial) and a pair of carbine .30-30's.

Son #1 made off with the .38-55, a 1921 gun, which came with a Lyman tang peep identical to Driftwood's. It had an unusual flip-up FRONT sight (a bead on one leaf and a small peep aperture on the other). And demonstrated outstanding accuracy, particularly, with cast bullets at a dia. of 0.378" or larger giving us 3/4" 3-shot groups off a rest at 50 yds. It did equally well with Hornady's 220 gr FP jacketed 0.375 but with a muzzle vel. of 1750 fps. That bullet was meant for higher speeds and would not expand so we always hunted with the cast bullet.

While it wasn't much for speed (~1400 fps with my best loads), it more than made up for it with those long 255 gr bullets that would penetrate to next week. It's now my son's one and only for deer in the woods. With an octagonal bbl. 26" long, it was decidedly muzzle heavy and easy to shoot offhand because of it. I liked it best for plinking, using 0.375" swagged round balls, lubed with 50-50 alox, and giving me 1" groups at 30 yds. A lot of fun and zero recoil.

The .30-30's were never as accurate as that .38-55. But both would keep 3 shots in less than 3" at 100 yds with open sights and are good deer medicine inside 125 yds or so. The Texas Commemorative has a 26" bbl. and dazzles the eyes with a gold plated receiver, fore end tip and a medallion in the butt stock. It was a wedding gift from my father in law, a retired Border Patrolman, & former Marine who had landed with the 1st Division on Guadalcanal, Peleliu & Cape Glouhester. He was the real deal; and a hellofa Marine but I didn't mention that I thought his gift resembled the bling on Liberace's pianos. It's still in the safe downstairs.

The other .30-30 is a true work horse. Built in 1949, it's a better cast bullet shooter than with jacketed stuff, but they're still more than accurate enough for deer in our KY thickets. It's my loaner for gun-less friends or family that show up for deer season. In our hands it's bagged a half dozen deer over the past 27 years. I'd say it's in NRA Excellent condition at present. An unusual point with it is that it's not drilled and tapped for a receiver sight, and likewise has only one tang screw, lacking the 2nd one necessary for a peep. But I like it a lot for cast bullet shooting, but carry one of my Marlins when hunting.

Just some musings...best regards, Rod

 

[silicosys4]

Looks like a good project for restoration Silicosy. I'd have no regrets refinishing the stock but would not touch the bluing, were it mine. How's it shoot?

I've had four M-94's over the years: a rifle in .38-55, a 2nd rifle in .30-30 (a Texas Centennial) and a pair of carbine .30-30's.

Son #1 made off with the .38-55, a 1921 gun, which came with a Lyman tang peep identical to Driftwood's. It had an unusual flip-up FRONT sight (a bead on one leaf and a small peep aperture on the other). And demonstrated outstanding accuracy, particularly, with cast bullets at a dia. of 0.378" or larger giving us 3/4" 3-shot groups off a rest at 50 yds. It did equally well with Hornady's 220 gr FP jacketed 0.375 but with a muzzle vel. of 1750 fps. That bullet was meant for higher speeds and would not expand so we always hunted with the cast bullet.

While it wasn't much for speed (~1400 fps with my best loads), it more than made up for it with those long 255 gr bullets that would penetrate to next week. It's now my son's one and only for deer in the woods. With an octagonal bbl. 26" long, it was decidedly muzzle heavy and easy to shoot offhand because of it. I liked it best for plinking, using 0.375" swagged round balls, lubed with 50-50 alox, and giving me 1" groups at 30 yds. A lot of fun and zero recoil.

The .30-30's were never as accurate as that .38-55. But both would keep 3 shots in less than 3" at 100 yds with open sights and are good deer medicine inside 125 yds or so. The Texas Commemorative has a 26" bbl. and dazzles the eyes with a gold plated receiver, fore end tip and a medallion in the butt stock. It was a wedding gift from my father in law, a retired Border Patrolman, & former Marine who had landed with the 1st Division on Guadalcanal, Peleliu & Cape Glouhester. He was the real deal; and a hellofa Marine but I didn't mention that I thought his gift resembled the bling on Liberace's pianos. It's still in the safe downstairs.

The other .30-30 is a true work horse. Built in 1949, it's a better cast bullet shooter than with jacketed stuff, but they're still more than accurate enough for deer in our KY thickets. It's my loaner for gun-less friends or family that show up for deer season. In our hands it's bagged a half dozen deer over the past 27 years. I'd say it's in NRA Excellent condition at present. An unusual point with it is that it's not drilled and tapped for a receiver sight, and likewise has only one tang screw, lacking the 2nd one necessary for a peep. But I like it a lot for cast bullet shooting, but carry one of my Marlins when hunting.

Just some musings...best regards, Rod

Haven't gotten to shoot it yet, waiting on brass, dies, and bullets. Once I do, I'll post results!

 

[pintail]

Here's my lever guns, past and present, the 94ae in 357 was the biggest pos I ever owned and I couldn't wait to get rid of it, the 94 carbine is in 30/30 and the rossi is 357 both lovely guns but the rossi gets it's lever yanked more than the 94
I use cast boolits most of the time. The red dot on the 94 has been sold as I found I suffer from astigmatism and the dot showed up as an elongated blob, the gun has a williams peep on the receiver now together with a fold down marbles on the barrel.
The rossi has a marbles bullseye rear sight and I gotta say it is a little cracker, I'm generally using hard cast 158 grn truncated cone bullets at about 1700 fps, for the 94 I use 178 gas checked lee 2r bullets at around 2000 fps, plenty powerful for what I want.
I've modified the fore sights, the winchester is shown here with a homemade fibre optic foresight, the rossi I fitted a marble orange one on.

 

[King Medallion]

Beings the Buffalo Bill was mentioned, I'll through in my tidbit. My cousin-in-law was gifted a BB when he married my cousin way back early 80's, kept it unfired all these years. I had pestered him the whole time to either shoot it or sell it to me, him doing neither as it was too valuable unfired and he knew I would shoot it. I wanted a full length rifle without all the safety chit or shot out bore. Anyway this spring he finally relented and sold it to me, and I shot it the next day, along with my Crazy Horse 38-55 I bought for the same reasons. That BB is ACCURATE!! And has a very sweet trigger! I'm not the type that worries too much about what kind of finish it has, as long as it shoots.

 

[plainsdrifter]

I was lucky to nab this one from a client for 5 Benjamins. Not pre 64 but she's been locked up forever, four rounds through her. I added the sling, no drill.

 

[silicosys4]

One wasn't enough, as I've heard is the case with pre 64 Winchesters. This '49 and pre war '41 followed it home a few months later.

Those weren't enough either. I've discovered I need an octagon barrel version in a rifle or short rifle configuration. I don't know how I didn't see that before.

 

[DMW1116]

'64 is significant in M94, also.
In '64, Winchester switched to sintered metal receivers, MAJOR change.

'70s were the commemorative a week years.some were pretty cheesy looking.

Can you elaborate on the sintered metal receiver? What does that mean?

 

[CraigC]

I always wanted a Chief Crazy Horse but when I went looking to buy one, I found something I couldn't pass up, a NIB Legendary Frontiersmen with fantastic wood. Same barrel length and chambering.