Any used presses to avoid?

[Scimmia]

The op absolutely did ask for opinions, and did not ask them to be backed up by data. When you ask the members on an Internet forums about something, the only answer they can give is their opinion. And for the record my opinion is based on owning several lee presses.

He specifically said "I don't know if there were ever presses produced that had major problems, or that were overly complicated, etc." He didn't ask what people's opinion of a good press is, he asked if any specific presses had problems. This is a request for facts, not opinions. Giving him opinions based on bad feelings or people's attempt to justify spending three times as much as they needed to is useless.

 

[Scimmia]

He did in post #9, said .40s&w and .38spl.

Yep, I noticed and edited my post, check the last line

 

[FiveInADime]

I have a rusty ram old Rock Chucker... rusty but not pitted. Bunch of cleaning and silicone lubricant and it cranks out accurate ammo just like any other good press.

 

[stargeezer]

If you spend $200 on Lee reloading equipment and load 50,000 rounds (that's about all it will last), your equipment will have cost you 4/10 of a cent per round.

Spend $400 on a RCBS setup and the cost per round will double to 8/10 of a cent per round.

The difference? It will be the 4/10 of a cent per round you'll waste fighting with low quality tools producing inconsistent ammo.

Spend 2 cents per round on Dillon reloading equipment and find out what the rest of us know.

 

[jcwit]

If you spend $200 on Lee reloading equipment and load 50,000 rounds (that's about all it will last), your equipment will have cost you 4/10 of a cent per round.

That sir is a joke. Up until a few years ago 50 thousand rounds was just about a summers amount of firing all loaded at that time with Lee equipment. I no longer shoot is these quantities as I have health reasons preventing this. But the equipment is still working as it did when new and loads as good a quality as it did when new.

My Lee turrent has now loaded more than likely 100's of thousands over the years it has been in use. Both in handgun cartridges and rifle cartridges.

At my age of 70 I see little need to squander monies on a dillion press when my Lee, Hornady, RCBS equipment serves me quite well, as it has for 50 plus years.

And to the OP's question regarding SINGLE STAGE PRESSES, most any of the major manufactures well serve him quite satisfactory.

 

[stargeezer]

I'm surprised that with your vast storehouse of knowledge that you could be unaware that Dillon makes presses that are essentially single stage presses that can be operated as a progressive press. The best of all worlds, the 550.

Next the OP was requesting guidance on brands or specific presses to AVOID. Surely you cannot compare the lowest entry level of Lee's "c" presses to any of the other names in the industry, RCBS, Lyman, Redding or Dillon? Since Lee produces a larger catalog of stuff that functions marginally at best, and a new reloader will be ill equipped to honestly judge what is quality from trash, I advise him to avoid the company that makes the most trash.

I do assure you that Lee does make a couple presses that are fair, one of which you own. Even with it's good points it does fail in a couple areas, such as the limited number of dies it can hold. I compare this to the RCBS turret press I've used for the past five years. The RCBS Rock Chucker was a press I used from the mid 70's loading 1000-2000 a month of 45ACP for the first ten years I owned it, and heaven only knows how many since.

At 70, I certainly would not urge you to buy a Dillon like I did 2 years ago. I'm just 60 and have a lot more to do with my time than to spend days on a single stage loading the same quantity of ammo that I now can load on my Dillon in two or three hours. I'd rather be out shooting.

Things have changed a bit over the years, that's why I buy a new truck every 2-3 years. It's also why I use a computer over a typewriter and instead of spending hours at the library, as I did a long time ago, I now surf the web and find information I need in minutes. Why should I reload ammo like I did 40 years ago?

 

[Scimmia]

Spend 2 cents per round on Dillon reloading equipment and find out what the rest of us know.

And here's what I was talking about with people trying to justify spending more. Elitism, pure and simple, "I spent more so I'm better than you".

For the record, most of my pistol ammo is loaded on a Dillon 650.

 

[stargeezer]

My point was not about elitism friend. It's about making quality ammo in quantity. Using efficient tools to produce ammo.

Waste hours and days on a single stage or crank out 1800 rounds in three hours on my 650. The cost of that is what it is. It's more than a single stage. That's just economics.

 

[Scimmia]

If you read the original post, to even bring up Dillon is beyond ridiculous. That is so far from what the OP is asking, that it can be only taken as bragging. The tone of the statement I quoted is unmistakable.

 

[stargeezer]

Some folks do have problems with economics. But, you seemed to miss that the OP is an accountant of some kind, so I based a reply on economic terms that he would hopefully relate to. For a lot of us, money has less value than our time. I don't have lots of free time or life expectancy, I've got plenty of money. It's economics.

You just need to take the "poor boy" chip of your shoulder.

 

[Scimmia]

No, you just need to realize that one size doesn't fit all. The OP is asking about something he can pick up at a garage sale as cheap as possible to he can try reloading and see if it's something he'll keep doing. Recommending he spend $400+ on the press alone is so far outside of what he was asking it's ludacris.

You say I need to take the "poor boy" chip off my shoulder, I say you actually need to listen to what people are asking and not blindly recommend something completely inappropriate.

 

[limpingbear]

A few years ago, justbefore the first big ammo shortage I bought a Lee cast single stage kit form Midway that came with one set of dies, thier perfect powder measure a loading book and a balance beam scale and thier auto prime tool along with some other odds and ends. I think I paid about 125 dollars shipped. I never had a problem with it in all the time i had it. My buddy gave me a rockchucker and i shipped the Lee to my brother in law because he was getting into loading. I still have and use the powder measure and have had no problems at all after thousands of loaded rounds. In fact most of the die sets i own are Lee. Keep an eye on Midwayusa, and dont let the Lee bashers scare you off.

 

[Constrictor]

OK, so now supply us with what years these Lee presses were acquired and what the models were?



And without facts to back the opinion up it is meaningless, turns into nothing more than a he/she said, he/she said. Lacking any credibility.

I'm not going to list my qualifications to you but let's just say I've been loading for 40 years and yes I still have some Lee presses.

 

[Constrictor]

He specifically said "I don't know if there were ever presses produced that had major problems, or that were overly complicated, etc." He didn't ask what people's opinion of a good press is, he asked if any specific presses had problems. This is a request for facts, not opinions. Giving him opinions based on bad feelings or people's attempt to justify spending three times as much as they needed to is useless.

Of course the actual truth is the op asked if there are any used presses to avoid. He didn't ask scientist or experts, he asked regular joes on the net. By definition all you can get from an average Joe is an opinion.
No one is saying you can't make ammo on a certain brand of press, but when asked which ones are better or which to avoid its perfectly acceptable to give our opinion on which brands we have found from personal experience to be less than desirable we should do so. And it appears quite a few agree with me.

 

[jcwit]

I'm not going to list my qualifications to you but let's just say I've been loading for 40 years and yes I still have some Lee presses.

So that's implying the Lee equipment is the earlier cast aluminum presses. Why skirt around the issue, come right out with it.

By definition all you can get from an average Joe is an opinion.

And in getting a reply back from the "average joe" I would expect more than just an opinion, I would expect a well founded and intelligent reply, not a reply "Anything but a Lee", Then why not "anything but a Lee" what is the specific problems with a Lee, or is it all about bragging rights.

In the OP's own words below, sorta says it all, unless I'm missing something.

Since I am new and also not wanting to spend a lot of money I will only be looking at single stages.

My main theme is that most all of the manufactures make presses that would suit the OP's requirements even Lee. Of course remembering, single stage is what he is asking for, not progressive or even turrent.

I've got plenty of money.

that's why I buy a new truck every 2-3 years.

You just need to take the "poor boy" chip of your shoulder.

I think we get it now.

 

[Constrictor]

So that's implying the Lee equipment is the earlier cast aluminum presses. Why skirt around the issue, come right out with it.



And in getting a reply back from the "average joe" I would expect more than just an opinion, I would expect a well founded and intelligent reply, not a reply "Anything but a Lee", Then why not "anything but a Lee" what is the specific problems with a Lee, or is it all about bragging rights.

In the OP's own words below, sorta says it all, unless I'm missing something.



My main theme is that most all of the manufactures make presses that would suit the OP's requirements even Lee. Of course remembering, single stage is what he is asking for, not progressive or even turrent.







I think we get it now.

I've used Lee equipment that has been manufactured at least over a 40 year span
But since the op asked for our
Opinions I don't feel the need to
Roll out a list of degrees for you.
Lee equipment is kind of like an
Old Chrysler. It will work but if
Someone asks me which brand
Of car is prefer to avoid I'd say Chrysler.
No one is recommended a progressive.
I love my rock chuckers.
.

 

[Arkansas Paul]

The repliers to the question posed in this thread have no reason to bash lee, other than the op asked what presses to avoid! Should we not give our honest opioned when asked for it?

If that opinion is based on real world experience that you personally have, then yes you should give it. If your opinion is based on what you read on the internet by some moron who says if it isn't blue it's junk, then no you should not give your opinion because it's just spreading nonsense.

If you spend $200 on Lee reloading equipment and load 50,000 rounds (that's about all it will last), your equipment will have cost you 4/10 of a cent per round.

Spend $400 on a RCBS setup and the cost per round will double to 8/10 of a cent per round.

The difference? It will be the 4/10 of a cent per round you'll waste fighting with low quality tools producing inconsistent ammo.

Yeah, I really should get better equipment. All I can get is lousy groups like this with my cheap crap Lee equipment. And to think for 0.04 a round more I could improve it.

.308 Win


.243 Win


I've got to get me some high quality equipment so I can stop shooting such inconsistent groups.

 

[Bush Pilot]

I love it when these threads turn into a pissing match where the Lee guys do their best to pretend Lee presses are as good as Dillon.

To the OP, ANY single stage press that's in decent shape will make ammo that will shoot well in your guns. If you find a Lee or RCBS press that fits your budget, BUY IT!

 

[Arkansas Paul]

I love it when these threads turn into a pissing match where the Lee guys do their best to pretend Lee presses are as good as Dillon.

I haven't seen a single post where anyone insinuates anything remotely resembling that.

Personally I love it when people who own Dillons think everybody else's equipment is pure crap. It's a two way street friend.

I don't have a doubt that Dillon is the best there is and when my funds allow it, I will likely own one. I own RCBS equipment and would no doubt rank it above Lee equipment. However the statement has been made that Lee is low quality equipment that produced inconsistent ammunition and that is simply not the case, and I have shown evidence to prove that it is not.

The VAST majority of people who say otherwise have never used Lee equipment and simply spew forth the garbage they read by the bashers.

Also, the point is getting lost in this thread, and its partly my fault, that someone new to reloading is inquiring about presses to avoid. I encourage him to not believe everything he hears. While Lee is certainly not the best there is, most of us who use it find it to be perfectly good equipment for the majority of our needs. If you get into this reloading thing, you will likely end up with all different colors on your bench.

 

[Constrictor]

I'm not sure why you even bring up my experience or lack therof when i told you i have 40 years aexperience with lee equipment already. I currently own 4 lee presses, but in all fairness i will admit i mostly have blue presses and i do love them the best.

 

[Arkansas Paul]

Oh yeah.
I'm getting low on a few things. I'll be over to load up some more stuff with your components soon.

 

[CatManDo]

I've loaded ammo since the 1980's and I started with Lee. I got up to a total of 6 Lee Presses and quite frankly almost gave myself a stroke trying to make ANY of the Lee Progressives consistently work. I am down to 3 Lee Presses at present; two Challenger Breech lock presses and a lowly C press. Out of all the Lee presses I have used the Challenger Breech Lock presses are the best. I haven't used the Classic Cast but if I found one at a reasonable price I would buy it. With that said, my most favorite press is my Dillon 650; quality of the first order. Nary a problem with her over the last 4 years of service.

 

[Arkansas Paul]

^ I have heard that the Lee progressives take a LOT of tinkering with to run right. I wouldn't buy one, but would take any of the single stages.

 

[ranger335v]

It's always interesting to read web experts appraising presses by brand based on - usually - a single example, and it's frequently wrong. Most makers have a variety of presses and they are NOT identical in performance by color. As a home shop machinest I have the tools to measure press flex and I've done so on quite a few.

* Old C presses flex much less than most prople think. The only C press currently on the market, Lee's tiny alum alloy "Reloader", flexes very little under normal FL sizing loads (much less than my old RC 2 under identical loads).

* Iron O presses flex much more than most people think; greater total strength does equal total rigidity.

* Lee's alum alloy presses flex much less than cast iron under identical loads before they snap - which won't happen with normal reloading, but nothing's fool proof to a sufficently talented fool.

* Cast iron flexes quite easily to a point, after which it stops until it snaps. (I've seen web photos of three Rockchuckers with broken top straps; clear evidence of a highly qualified fool.)

* Alum alloy presses flex very little before they snap. (I've seen no photos of broken Lee top straps.)

* Any press ever made will last two or three life times if the ram is kept clean and oiled.

 

[zxcvbob]

I like Lee equipment, and have quite a bit of it. I would not buy a used Lee progressive press (there's a reason someone is getting rid of it, and I don't want to find out)