Anyone have or used this??

[Talshiar]

Anyone own one of these, or know someone how does? Just wondering if it is all that durable? And does anyone know if some units in the military actually carry it??? I have an axe and am kinda wanting a Tomahawk as well. The price seems decent and I'm thinking about getting one unless one of you says something that talks me out of it.

http://jsesurvival.com/LaGana-Tactical-Tomahawk-VTAC-VTAC.htm

 

[Bobson]

The LaGana Tactical Tomahawk (a.k.a. “VTAC”) is the standard by which all other tactical axes are judged, period. Battle proven for over 40 years. . . .

People uses tomahawks in combat these days?

 

[Sniper X]

Yep, many did in Viet Nam and still do, almost all special forces carry a hawk. Works for everything it did when the original occupants of the USA were using them hundreds of years ago.

 

[Talshiar]

I take it you have a tomahawk? Have you used the LaGana?

 

[Bobson]

Yep, many did in Viet Nam and still do, almost all special forces carry a hawk. Works for everything it did when the original occupants of the USA were using them hundreds of years ago.

I assumed hawks were used back then because they didn't have anything much better.

Like lightweight, high capacity machine guns.

 

[Talshiar]

But wouldn't a hawk be better then a knife, at least in a lot of situations?

 

[Wangmuf]

Weight, additional length, multiple striking/cutting surfaces? Yes, if you're able to deploy it in a hand to hand encounter, it would trump a knife in many situations.

 

[Bobson]

Sure, I suppose. Carrying one just seems really impractical to me, even if you work in LE.

In the home? Why not just place a firearm wherever you're planning to put that hawk? To each his own though.

 

[scramasax]

News from the sandbox...They are so primitive that you will get a lot more attention from a blade than a gun. A slung gun is normal. Unsheath an impressive blade and you get respect. Stories from some of the kids I've lent hawks and short swords to. Also very good to use for making hides and modifying mud houses.

From what I have seen most of the LaGana hawks are good reproductions to look at. I wouldn't bet my life on one.The original design was for hand to hand fighting the VC. There are a multitude of current hawks out there.I would opt for a reputable custom maker. Ryan Johnson makes some of the best. His hawks have been used by combat soldiers since the First desert storm. I have three on loan to kids I know that have deployed. I have a dozen usable hawks in my collection including an original LaGana.

Cheers,

ts

 

[blindhari]

I was an Army armorer back in the late sixties. Some of the bravest men I ever met were tunnel rats. Prefered weapons were a high standard 9 shot short barreled revolver loaded with 22 short, a Nam hawk, and if they could find it, the Gerber Mk 1 in a leg sheath. Read up on Dak To 66-1968. In WWII small men were invaluable in back ball turrets because of bombers because of space restraints, in Nam a lot of very, very special men went into the tunnels to run charlie out.
If you are intrested in a Hawk I would advise you to Google McGowan manufacturing, the small carving axe is not only devastating in tight and up close, some of us can throw it dependably up to 30'. They are not cheap but there is one riding in each of my vehicle's emergency kits. I have also startled my brother in law with just how quick you can dress, skin, and quarter elk/hog with one of these.

blindhari

 

[Talshiar]

Thanks for all the good responses everyone. I decided to take the plunge, i ordered one. Got a knife to go with it. The JSE's prices seemd pretty good, so hopefully i'll have it in a week or so. If I like it enough I may find myself needing another similar one.

 

[Yo Mama]

For the price, with the ESEE warranty? You're getting a good deal IMO.

 

[hso]

I've had folks that have BTDT say pretty much what scramasax said. Big knives, hawks, even baseball bats (shiny aluminum ones) will create a sense of fear that the "Ho, hum, another M4/AK" won't.

 

[USAF_Vet]

Having been in the sandbox, I can tell ya no one respects the rifle. Just another rifle among thousands. Pistols, however, will get their attention very quickly, as well as blades.

Several months ago, I read a review from a soldier in Iraq about a tomahawk (don't remember which one) that he effectively used to eliminate a threat when said threat pinned his rifle to the wall.

So yes, they are still being effectively used in combat.

 

[rcmodel]

After some enemy propaganda photo's / bad publicity during the Vietnam war, they were banned entirely by the military for years.
But I have no idea what each unit commanders policy on them might be now.

Personally, I can think of a lot of other things that weigh far less that would be far more useful to carry on your web gear anyway.

rc

 

[JohnKSa]

Big knives, hawks, even baseball bats (shiny aluminum ones) will create a sense of fear that the "Ho, hum, another M4/AK" won't.

At the most basic level, people don't really "get" guns. They're practically magic, if you think about it. You press this little thing here, there's a loud noise and flash and way over there something happens if the stars (Ooops, I mean the sights) are aligned just right.

Most folks don't know how it feels to get shot, but everyone knows what it feels like to get cut. Knives and other cutting implements make a lot of sense to people, they comprehend them at the gut level. There's no magic, it's all simple stuff that anyone can understand and that's why everyone reacts to them.

 

[nevermas]

For the price, with the ESEE warranty? You're getting a good deal IMO.

Unfortunately this isn't an ESEE product.

 

[wheelgunslinger]

In the home? Why not just place a firearm wherever you're planning to put that hawk? To each his own though.

I would never want to strike someone with a hawk, especially in front of the wife, but with the population density around me, it's a sensible alternative, I feel. With my experiences, it feel completely natural in my hands. Even in the dark.

I also have a case of PTSD and went through a period where I was clearing the house in my sleep with loaded weapons. So, the guns stay on the wife's side and I use a hawk or my battle axe.

After years of restoring cabins, shaping logs with primitive tools, making firewood, butchering animals, etc. with axes of all sizes and types, I'm confident that a hawk or axe is a good choice for me. It's not a SAW, but in my condo surrounded by people who don't want an errant bullet in them while I secure my home, it's a fair alternative.

 

[hso]

Sound and responsible reasoning.

 

[JShirley]

Sniper X, I think saying "almost all special forces" carry a 'hawk is a pretty strong overstatement. I worked with teams from 3rd and 7th group, and never saw them use any blade larger than the little Benchmade I gave to hso when I returned last time.

I *did* see a Marine Gunny use a cheap Rambo knife for crowd control. He would pull it out, and just herd the locals the direction he wanted them to go.

I didn't see a single ax or hatchet when I was in Afghanistan 06-07. I did order a "crash hawk" from D. Hoskins, but I'm not taking it when I go back this month. Because I'll already have lots of gear, and I don't want troops who have a clue to laugh at me.

 

[TimboKhan]

I can tell you that when I was in Somalia, we were far more successful at backing people up with axe handles and kabars (or whatever you had) than we were with rifles.

 

[JShirley]

Ordinarily, "intimidation factor" is a horrible reason to own a particular weapon.

In the case of deployed service members, the point some are making, is causing compliance with the local populace when killing them *wasn't* warranted.

PS: if your friend said he was taught 100 ways to kill with his bare hands, he was lying.

 

[JShirley]

You clearly don't understand the nature of military training, or you're deliberately trolling. I've had lot of friends and service coworkers who've served in the 82nd or 101st. Even elite units, like the Special Forces teams I was attached to for a few months, spend a relatively short time training in unarmed and knife tactics.

Now, you were off-base from the start, here, when you attempted to address real-world use of non-firearm weapons by troops. Yes, if someone needs killing, we shoot them or blow them up. The whole point several folks were making, was protecting our troops without having to kill.

To get back on track: tomahawks were obsolescent for fighting 140 years ago. Just like knives. They still have uses, like the WWII crash axe I was looking at Sunday, but fighting is not it.

 

[dayhiker]

I usually never post about serving in the Army. Since I was a Soldier at the end of the Cold War, I was never in combat. Never really did anything worth mentioning. Not Airborne, Ranger , or SF.

However, even in Combat Arms in the late 80's, hand to hand or knife training was virtually non existent.

If you wanted to learn to handle yourself there was always someone around with a rep of being a Billy Badass willing to teach. This was done by word of mouth, on your own time, and usually for a few bucks of beer money.

A lot of us would learn just enough to have a chance against the locals, if needed , in the off base bars.

I can see from JShirley's post not much has changed.

 

[jdh]

Back on topic:

While it is a hawk I have this http://www.harborfreight.com/2-lb-firemans-hatchet-94549.html . It works just as well and can more easily be explained a a tool should "Barney" take an interest. And it does come in handy from time to time.