Anyone hunt with BP?

[MCgunner]

Just posted a thread over at the BP forum with details, but I notice my type 2 Texas public hunting pamphlet lists a lot of hog areas where it's only legal to hunt with BP. I have this Hawkin Hunter Carbine I bought from Cabelas to use and I've sorted it out with 50 caliber 385 grain bullets or saboted .44 240 grain bullets. I doesn't seem to like the 300 grainers in .44 and it won't shoot light conicals or round balls worth a toot due to its 1:24 rifling. So, between the two, a .44 cal 240 grain JHP at high handgun velocities or that HUGE .50 caliber pill, I'm goin' with the mass of that big pill.

Anyone use a big conical vs a saboted .44 that can tell me which they prefer and why??? I know the .44 should work cause I'm pushing it as fast as a long barreled handgun, but when I look at that 50 cal diameter hollow point, I just get this big grin.

 

[smokemaker]

I looked at your other post on in the BP forum, and was going to tell you to post it here as well, figuring you might get different answers to the question if you get away from the cap-n-ball/sidehammers-n-round balls only crowd, but you beat me to it.

How fast are you pushing these projo's? A 385 grain conical at little over the speed of sound still has tremendous penetration, while you might have to get the 240 grain saboted bullet up over 1600 fps to do real damage. (well, more than a .44 mag) Either one kicks the round ball's butt at any distance, because the round ball loses energy (velocity) so fast.

I'm going to NC for pigs over easter. I'm only taking one gun, my T/C Omega. I'll be using 300 grain Hornady SST/ML's with 130 grains 777 FFg. I chrony'ed that load at 2065 fps. I think it'll work for piggies.

 

[MCgunner]

Thanks. Wow, I ain't loadin' near that hot. I'm shootin' 90 grains of Pyrodex RS (by black powder volume) and I have a short barrel gun, 21", which don't help with BP.

The 240 is shooting about 1400 fps. The big pill is around 1200 IIRC. Got it written down somewhere. I reckon I'll know when I use it, but it has to be as good as a foster slug and it's accurate at full 100 yards. Maybe I should juice up the load a bit and push 'em faster, but I don't think it's possible to do a lot better in that 21" barrel. But, it sure is a handy gun to carry and, like I say, it's accurate.

From what you're telling me, I think I'll stick with the big slug. It's an impressive chunk a lead, at least. No way I could get it going as fast as you're pushin' that 300 grain sabot... ...not in my short barrel. But, I do like it for handy carry. I kinda see why the old timers had them LOOOOONG barrels, though.

Thanks for the help! I'm kinda new to BP rifles and hunting.

 

[BIGR]

In my in-line .50 caliber I have had great luck with the 240 grain Hornady .44 bullets with the sabots using about 90 grains of cleanshot powder. I have taken about 12 deer with them. Probably half of those deer fell dead in their tracks. One evening I dropped a doe and reloaded. As I sat waiting I noticed a small 6 point coming up the ridge towards me. He walked up beside of the doe looking at her like he was saying what the heck happened to you. After I pulled the trigger he was laying about 5 feet from her. I couldn't believe how fast they went down. The past two muzzleloader seasons I have been trying the powerbelt 295 gr. hollowpoints. Have shot about 4 deer with those. They are deadly but I think the .240 gr. hornadys do about as good.

 

[smokemaker]

MCgunner,
The conical will get the job done. But...

You mentioned (and I missed it the first time) that your gun doesn't like 300 grain .44 bullets. It's been my experience that most guns don't like the heavier .44 bullets in sabots, my own Omega included. I switched to .452 bullets in correctly sized sabots (.451-.452), and the 300 grainers really shoot well. Might be worth a try. Not to be a whore for a bullet manufacturer, but those Hornady SST/ML's shoot great and devastate deer. Plus now they make bonded versions of the same bullet for tougher game.

Incidentally, I'm not shooting that load outa my gun because I think I can make 200 yard shots with a muzzleloader, it just happens that this gun likes that load best. I've never shot a deer farther than 65 yards. I don't have a scope on the gun, instead I installed a Williams aperture sight, and cut the front sight down to a patridge blade. The gun kicked way bad, but a Sims recoil pad (limbsaver) really made it into a pussycat. It's my favorite rifle!

 

[MCgunner]

Thanks for the tip! I saw those sabots somewhere, Cabela's I think. I just happen to have a supply of those 300 Grain .451 Hornadys, load 'em in my .45 Colt for heavy loads. Glad to here they have a bonded version, I'll look for it. They probably have the sabots at Midway, too. I like ordering from them for two reasons. I get my stuff really quick from them and I like their NRA support (round up) program. They ain't bad on pricing, either.

Think I'll make an order soon. I will order the bonded bullets. I think they came in boxes of 50 IIRC, so I guess I'll order 2 boxes cause I need some of the bonded ones to load in .45 brass. I can test with what I've got on hand.

I've got quite a few of those 385 grain Hornady conicals on hand. But, never hurts to have another possible load.

I've just got the standard irons on the Hawkin. If I wanna scope a BP rifle in the future, I'll buy one of those inline guns that shoot the 209 primers. But, I don't foresee that. I mean, in east Texas where I'll be using this thing, there aren't that many clear cuts to shoot across. It's pretty dense woods. Heck, I'll keep my shots to 50 yards if possible, but I can hit with the thing out to 100 yards.

 

[critter]

I can't say for sure about any of the .44 saboted bullets. I can, however, vouch for the fact that the big ole fat, slow conicals WILL do a job on whitetails and hogs. You need look no more-unless you want to experiment.

They make big holes, deep penetrations-usually through and throughs, will break bones and cause bleedout. That is all you can ask of a black powder gun. Good luck.

 

[MCgunner]

Yeah, I'll likely use the conicals. They just look devastating. But, I wanna try those .45 bullets, too. They might turn out to be ultra accurate or something, but the conicals I'm using, Hornady's 385 grain, are pretty accurate. I can put 'em into three or four inches at 100 yards off the bench.

One thing, that friggin' thing rivals my 7mm rem mag for recoil. But, I'm pretty recoil tolerant. I've shot much heavier loads, 375 H&H being about the biggest, effectively. But, the gun is only a little over six pounds, very light and handy if you're man enough to handle the actual use of the thing, LOL!

If those .45 caliber XTPs work well, I'll forget all about the 240 grain .44s. The only reason I was worried about those was the lack of bullet weight and S/D on a big hog. It's always good to have options. Never know, might stop makin' that Hornady pill. One of these days, I'm going to get a good heavy bullet mold for that gun and start casting my own. I have a Lee "real" bullet in 250, but this gun doesn't like it, too light to stabilize well with the 1:24 twist, or at least that's what I postulate. It actually tumbles in flight. It's a hazard as you never know if you're going to hit the friggin' backstop at 100 yards with it. ROFLMAO!

Anyone got a mold for such a fast twist that they recommend???? I really do need to start casting for this thing. I haven't checked to see if Lee has anything bigger than 250 now days. Been years since I played with this thing. Goes against my grain to be BUYING projectiles for a BP rifle.

 

[oops!]

I have an old T.C. Hawken that I use with both patched round ball and 385 grn. Buffalo bullets.

The round ball is .490" with .13" cotton patch. Load is 85grn. Pyrodex/CCI cap. This is my small doe or game load and is deadly accurate for 5-6 shots without cleaning.

With the Buffalo Bullets I use 105 grn. Pyrodex/CCI primer. The conical is much more accurite, from this rifle, than the sabot loads. The rifling rate is not for the lighter sabots.