Anyone loading 200 grain RNL or SWC in .38 Special?

[Landric]

Obviously the bullets are less available than the old standby, the 158 grain RNL or SWC, but I have recently developed an interest in loading the .38 Special with 200 grain bullets.

I'm not sure I have a really good reason other than I just think it would be fun, but then again, that is enough. I'm wondering if I can make up a nice IDPA load with a 200 grain RNL. It only needs to make 625 fps out of a 4" barrel to make power factor, and that is likely to make it a pussycat.

So, any experience out there? Any good sources for 200 grain bullets? I'd like to try and work up a load with Trail Boss, anyone have data for it with a 200 grainer, or am I going to have to wing it?

I have found several sources online, but I just want a small quanity to start with to see if I can come up with a load I like, and I'd rather not pay $13 shipping on 100 or so bullets. Any casters out there or someone with some 200 grainers sitting around want to talk trade?

Thanks!

 

[1858rem]

you may have trouble loading with trailboss and getting that velocity, i was shooting 255g cast bullets over 4.0 grains and that was barley enough to cycle the slide (but your shooting a revo) and getting 550fps over the chrono. you probably would be using a compressed charge to do that with trailboss unless you seated the bullets so long you had just enough clearance to rotate the cylinder.

sure would look like little torpedo's or something with a 200g bullet in there!

 

[Landric]

Are you talking 255 grain/.45ACP with 4.0 Trail Boss. If so, my experience has been different. I loaded up some 250 grain RNFP in .45ACP with 4.0 of Trail Boss and I was getting an average right at 700fps out of my M&P45. Recoil was very mild, and did seem to be just enough for reliable operation, but it was making 175,000 power factor. Once I use up all my 200 grain bullets, its going to be my new IDPA/CDP load.

I agree that Trail Boss might not be the right powder for a 200 grain .38 Special. I do want to give it a try though. My Lee manual has data for 200 grain lead bullets in .38 Special, and for a while Winchester was loading a Super-X "Police Load" with a 200 grain bullet. It can be done, but it might require a different powder.

 

[Ben Shepherd]

I've done 200's in 357. Both magnum and maximum. Work ok, better in the maximum with it's larger case capacity.

But with that short 38 case you have 2 issues you need to watch closely for:

1. Case capacity is going to be very low, so work up you loads slowly, as you'll get pressure spikes pretty easily.

2. Watch your speeds carefully as well. Much slower than the 625 you mention, and you run the very real risk of sticking one in the barrel.

 

[1858rem]

Are you talking 255 grain/.45ACP with 4.0 Trail Boss. If so, my experience has been different. I loaded up some 250 grain RNFP in .45ACP with 4.0 of Trail Boss and I was getting an average right at 700fps out of my M&P45.

sure am, i think i had a high of 600fps and a low of around 550fps. i think it was 4.0, i loaded 4.0 of BE for a while with 200g pills, then went to 4.5 and BE with the 200g, and maybe was only loading 3.8 of TB, i know out of 25 that i loaded 255's and TB i had one fail to eject all the way....


(BTW i didnt check my load notes yet)

 

[Oyeboten]

In .38 Special...I'd think that 180 grn would be a good compromise for still getting decent fps, and, all round fun...which is what I am planning to experiment with once I get my press and everything set up.


I've seen Lyman Moulds for .357 200 grn Round Nose and also semi-wad...

 

[Larry Burchfield]

200gr bullets

Several years ago I used to shoot a Lee 190gr RNL when shoot my 357 TC in silhouette matches. I 'll check and see if I still have that loading data.
Larry Burchfield
SEABEES/VIETNAM/67/68/69
DAV

 

[rcmodel]

1970 Lyman #45 lists 6 powders with a 195 (200 nominal with lube).

Factory Duplication of the old police load = 3.8 Unique - 703 FPS.
Accuracy load = 3.6 Unique - 671 FPS.

Other loads:
Bullseye 2.0 - 530 - 2.7 Max - 658
Unique 3.0 - 572 - 4.1 Max - 772
2400 8.0 - 734 - 9.5 Max - 893
SR7625 3.0 - 478 - 3.8 Max - 675
SR4756 - 4.0 - 506 - 5.4 Max - 810
IMR4227 - 7.0 - 494 - 9.5 Max - 748

Clearly, you need to use a medium or slower powder for best velocity.

rc

 

[Landric]

So, to revive my thread, I'll post some of my experiences.

I decided to cast my own 200 grain bullets for .38 Special. I got myself a used Lyman 358430 mold (2 cavity 200 grain RN). It drops right around 200 grains before lube with clip-on wheel weight lead. Most of the bullets are running at about 200.5 grains, but I have seen a low of 198 and a high of 202. The bullet is extremely nose heavy, and the OAL, when crimped in the crimp grove in a .38 Special case is around 1.545. The interesting thing about the bullet is that it is so nose heavy that it doesn't seat any deeper in the case than the 158 grain RNL I have been using, but my 158 grain load is about .10 shorter OAL. Luckily that means basically unchanged case capacity. Those nose heavy bullets also fall quite nicely into the chambers.

Anywhere, here are some of my results. As always, while I have seen no excessive pressure signs, I have no doubt that some of my loads are working their way past max pressure for .38 Special +P and therefore I do not suggest that anyone use any of these loads themselves.

These loads were all tested in my 4" S&W 681 and all use Federal SP primers and mixed brass with the 1.545 OAL.

3.0 grains Titegroup, Ave. 640 FPS
4.1 grains Trail Boss, Ave. 625 FPS
5.2 grains HS-6, Ave. 622 FPS
5.6 grains HS-6, Ave. 690 FPS
6.5 grains HS-6, Ave. 765 FPS

I'm working my way up a bit with the Trail Boss since I am looking for about 650 FPS average, and with HS-6 I'm looking to make IDPA major (165,000 PF/825 FPS), so I'm still working that up. So far no signs of excessive pressure, and I think I will get to 825 FPS without problems, but it remains to be seen.

 

[Landric]

More time at the range today resulted in more data. Again, I do not suggest anyone use any of this information without working up to it themselves.

4.5 grains of Trail Boss, Ave. 703 fps, which makes minor with room to spare. It was pretty mild shooting, so I expect to stick with it for SSR.

As for major in .38 Special, I got these two to work:

6.9 grains HS-6, Ave. 876 fps
9.5 grains 2400, Ave. 875 fps

The 2400 load felt a little softer shooting, but both were quite pleasant and neither showed any signs of excessive pressure. My preference is for the 2400 load since the powder fills out the case better and it was more consistent, in addition to feeling softer. However, I have A LOT more HS-6, so I might go with that instead.

 

[prks304]

I have found some 200gr LRN Bullets from a Company called "Magnus Bullets". They look just like the original Winchester Loading. I just ordered some more yesterday. Paid $58.04 for 500. Now I would have got a better deal on shipping if I had ordered more. They ship USPS Flat rate boxes. I have been loading mine with 3.6grs of Unique. Don't know the FPS, but I did drop a Coyote with one. Though & though shot and there was evidence of "Keyholing". Exit wound was about 1.5 long and .75 inch wide. He was about 18 yards away and I just happen to have my 2" S&W Model 10 with me in the Pickup. Needless to say he has since given up Chicken stealing. LOL