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AR-15 cycling trouble

Discussion in 'Rifle Country' started by kfrancis2001, Aug 29, 2008.

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  1. kfrancis2001

    kfrancis2001 Member

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    I am new to the AR-15 platform. Bought a new Double Star, Star 15 rifle, It will cycle a full mag, but when you put the second mag in it seems to jam after about 5 or 6 shots. An ideas what would cause this?
     
  2. Domino

    Domino Member

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  3. Picard

    Picard Member

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    It's probably a bad magazine. Mark the faulty magazine to see if you can narrow the problem down.
     
  4. Wolfgang2000

    Wolfgang2000 Member

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    First try down loading your mags by 2 rounds. Also remember AR like oil.
     
  5. rcmodel

    rcmodel Member in memoriam

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    5 to 6 shots down in the mag before problems make it unlikely downloading by two is going to help.

    Sounds like the follower is dragging inside the mag body for whatever reason.

    Take the base plates off, pull the springs & followers, and see if there is a bur or something catching on the follower.

    While you have them apart, spray them with Remington Dry-Lube spray and put them back together.

    It also might help to number your mags so you can tell if it is the same one every time.

    rcmodel
     
  6. Larry E

    Larry E Member

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    Get some Magpul followers. Don't have a link to them, but you can search Magpul, and buy them directily from the maker. They're teflon impregnated and slicker than slick. OR a new follower AND spring.
     
  7. kfrancis2001

    kfrancis2001 Member

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    Off the topic of cycling

    The AR I bought has a 20" heavy barrel with free float. Currently it has two stage peep sights. It has a carry handle. What would be some good optics to go with on a "very limited budget"?
     
  8. AR-15 Rep

    AR-15 Rep Member

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    I have the magpul followers listed on ar15-kits.com I will see if they are in stock but should have them.
     
  9. rob_s

    rob_s Member

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    So is the problem solved or are you buying optics for a gun that doesn't work?

    Agree with what both Picard and Wolfgang2000 said. Mark the mags to see if it's isolated to just one, download your mags to 28 rounds, and lube the hell out of the bolt and carrier.
     
  10. W.E.G.

    W.E.G. Member

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    My AR shoots the first magazine of com-bloc .223 ammo pretty reliably.

    The second one is the choker.
     
  11. strat81

    strat81 Member

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    How clean is the chamber?
    What kind of ammo are you using?
    Is it the same mag that keeps jamming?
    Is your carrier key tight to the bolt carrier?


    As for optics, is your carry handle fixed (A2 upper) or removable (A3/A4 upper)? For an inexpensive scope, consider Bushnell, Burris, or Nikon.
     
  12. kfrancis2001

    kfrancis2001 Member

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    It has an A2 upper. Haven't had the chance to go back to the range to check the mags. I was just wondering about the optics. Using Wolf ammo, does this ammo have a weak primer? Seems like my firing pin is knocking a hole in the primer instead of just denting it, Could this be part of the problem?
     
  13. gvnwst

    gvnwst Member

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    i use wolf ammo with my ar and have no problems with punctured primers. mabye wour firing pin has a problem... i aint a expert though.
     
  14. EShell

    EShell Member

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    The malfunction seems to be a magazine and I agree with the other posters that is is necessary to identify your magazines and test to verify that the malfs occur with a certain individual magazine.

    What is the exact nature of the malfunction?

    A small amount of lube is required on the bolt carrier rails, but too much lube doesn't necessarily contribute to reliability. If it's not short stroking, more lube won't help anything. I run mine almost dry, and if in extreme cold weather or dusty conditions, they MUST be run almost dry.

    A little dry lube won't hurt, but a USGI magazine in good condition should need no lube and I run mine clean and dry. The MagPul magazines and followers are decent units, but should not be necessary to make the rifle function correctly. I would say that there are very few aftermarket magazines that are 100%.

    As far as pierced primers go, your firing pin is likely the culprit and it is either protruding too much or is too sharp. Once a few pierced primers are experienced, the tip will usually become eroded, ragged and sharp(er), leading to more pierced primers, so it probably should be replaced anyway. Remove your bolt carrier group, push the bolt back into the bolt carrier and look at the tip of your firing pin. Without a protrusion gauge, it's tough to tell if it's protruding too far, but the problem is more likely that it's sharp. If the end is not smooth and round, I'd suggest getting a replacement firing pin for $6-$8, and it's not a bad idea to have a spare anyway.
     
  15. possum

    possum Member

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    no issues with punctured primers and wolf ammo for me either, as far as your feed issues i would say that that is a magazine issue, the p mags are the best and they are good to go, you should get as many as you can afford. and a lula mag loader to go with it.
     
  16. Bartholomew Roberts

    Bartholomew Roberts Moderator Emeritus

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    If there is a hole in the primer instead of a dent, that is a problem though it may not be the only problem. You need to replace the firing pin if you are puncturing primers (or try a different brand of ammo). Did you by chance go with a titanium firing pin or some other special upgrade?
     
  17. kfrancis2001

    kfrancis2001 Member

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    The mags I am using are P mags it is occuring with both mags. It seems to occur more frequently with more shooting. It is ejecting the spent cartridge but it seems like the bolt is not traveling far enough to catch the next shell. No clue on material of firing pin, I am guessing titanium because it is very light. I am using Semi-Liquid, teflon based, oil.
     
  18. kBob

    kBob Member

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    What everone else said abou the firing pin.

    Now based on post 17 I am going to go out on a limb and say to sheck those bolt gas rings. Assuming you have not gone with one of the newer designs there should be three little snap ring type dealies on the actual bolt that can be seen when you pull the bolt from the carrier.

    Each ring has a break in it. These should be rotated so they do not line up. When I have mine appart I always set them 120 degrees apart. Think roughly 12 o'clock , 4 o'clock and 8 o'clock. I find they are easily moved with a tooth pick.

    Cost nothing, easy to do, and might stop the short stroking.

    I have been told by experts this is pointless and this does no good at all, yet I Have suggested it to folks that tried it and reported it worked. Go figure.

    Anyway it only adds half a minute to cleaning time to give it a try.

    -Bob Hollingsworth
     
  19. Bartholomew Roberts

    Bartholomew Roberts Moderator Emeritus

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    If staggering the gas rings fixes your problem, then your rifle has a problem besides non-staggered gas rings. The gas rings rotate naturally during firing and will align at various times on their own. The tiny amount of extra gas that leaks out will not affect a rifle in good working condition. In fact, most rifles will run just fine on a single gas ring (assuming that gas ring is in good order and not eroded).

    kfrancis, when you fire the last round in the magazine, does the bolt lock back on the empty magazine? What does the fired cartridge look like?

    Can you give us a little more detail in your descriptions as well?

    If the bolt does not lock back on the last round of the magazine, that means either the magazine follower is bad or (more common), your rifle is short-stroking. There are many different causes for this; but most involve either not enough gas or too much chamber pressure.

    The first thing I would check in that case is to make sure that the gas carrier key is firmly attached to the bolt carrier with no gaps and that the screws are not loose.
     
  20. kfrancis2001

    kfrancis2001 Member

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    Yes the bolt locks back on both mags. Cartridge looks fine no marring. Unfired bullet after hand ejection is not showing signs of severe crowning. I down graded the mags to 20 rounds no problems. Then i fully loaded the mags and they jammed. Could the follower be riding at the wrong angle when fully loaded? How can i fix the gas issue if new mags dont work? Sorry about the detail, If you can tell me what to look for I will gladly check it out. Remember AR noobie here.
     
  21. taliv

    taliv Moderator Staff Member

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    is it occurring with rapid fire, slow fire or both?
     
  22. no_problem

    no_problem Member

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    I agree with Kbob. Staggering the gas rings is an easy and free method of maintenance and repair. Also, it does not hurt to have a drop of CLP in the gas tube. Lastly, cleaning and lubing your bolt carrier key never hurts.
     
  23. taliv

    taliv Moderator Staff Member

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    where do you guys get this stuff? lubing your gas tube??
     
  24. orvpark

    orvpark Member

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    You bought a NEW rifle and have shot a bunch of cheap ammo. Some guns don't mind, but most need broke in with some decent stuff. Shoot yourself a couple hundred rounds of good ammo. Then try some cheaper stuff. I had a friend have the same problem. It was inconsistent with Wolf until I swapped him a hundred rounds of PMC (not too expensive) to break it in.

    Now just for good measure, go watch TV and cycle the bolt about 500 times;)
     
  25. Toten Kopf

    Toten Kopf Member

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    Adding a drop of oil to the end (not the inside) of the gas tube (where it slides into the carrier key) and inside the carrier key is a normal part of lubrication for the M16/AR15.
     
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