AR-15 Gas Key
- Thread starter gazpacho
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AZ Jeff
Member
Why would you WANT to attach the key with JB Weld?
I ask because the carrier and the key come with features built into them to allow attachment by other methods, namely screws. Why bypass the screws and use a less secure alternative?
I ask because the carrier and the key come with features built into them to allow attachment by other methods, namely screws. Why bypass the screws and use a less secure alternative?
ocabj
Member
IIRC, the key screws should be torqued down to only 35-40 in lbs. The screws are usually staked in to prevent them from backing out. Loctite or epoxy would be another valid option.
Personally, I'd go with the red loctite and torque down to 40 in lbs. Let it set for 24 hours. If after this the screws still back out, I would probably order a new bolt carrier, preferably with the key already installed and staked in.
Personally, I'd go with the red loctite and torque down to 40 in lbs. Let it set for 24 hours. If after this the screws still back out, I would probably order a new bolt carrier, preferably with the key already installed and staked in.
ocabj
Member
Just saw your edit. Very weird that you would have four different keys come loose on you, even ones that were staked.
GunnySkox
Member
Are you certain they're being staked properly? There's a ton of information about proper staking over at ARFCOM, but I'll try to summarize:
a properly staked key has material from the sides of the key itself pressed inward, so that the metal is pressed into the vertical grooves on the circumference of the screws so they can't turn.
If it looks like some body just laid a flathead screwdriver on top of the screws and gave it a whack, the key is not properly staked.
Pictures found via google.
~GnSx
a properly staked key has material from the sides of the key itself pressed inward, so that the metal is pressed into the vertical grooves on the circumference of the screws so they can't turn.
If it looks like some body just laid a flathead screwdriver on top of the screws and gave it a whack, the key is not properly staked.
Pictures found via google.
~GnSx
Attachments
Kaylee
Member
Safety how? (not trying to be a smartmouth, I'm honestly curious what the safety issue is)
Is there some reason the key needs to be removable from the carrier?
If not, is there any reason to not make a carrier with an integral key, other than cost?
-K
blackhawk2000
member
Don't Tread On Me
Member
Ah, and that is why I like Colt's carriers. They are staked like the picture above - not coming loose. Peace of mind.
Still though, 4 keys coming loose? Sounds excessive. Might want to take a close look at how they are staked. You want to push metal over the edge of the screw. With a punch, this can be done. Not extreme like the Colt pictured above, but good enough to prevent loosening.
The whole trick is knowing how close/far from the edge to place the punch. If you do it too close to the edge, it will only push over a tiny thin sliver of metal that doesn't do anything. Too far in, and you're just making a dimple in the key and not getting material over.
Don't JB weld the key. You will ruin a perfectly good carrier. All you need is a proper staking job. It is unfortunate that the gunsmith didn't properly do it either. Being their job, you'd hope they could do something simple like that.
There's a thread right here on THR where I posted photos straight from the military armorer's manual showing how to do it right. Search for it.
Still though, 4 keys coming loose? Sounds excessive. Might want to take a close look at how they are staked. You want to push metal over the edge of the screw. With a punch, this can be done. Not extreme like the Colt pictured above, but good enough to prevent loosening.
The whole trick is knowing how close/far from the edge to place the punch. If you do it too close to the edge, it will only push over a tiny thin sliver of metal that doesn't do anything. Too far in, and you're just making a dimple in the key and not getting material over.
Don't JB weld the key. You will ruin a perfectly good carrier. All you need is a proper staking job. It is unfortunate that the gunsmith didn't properly do it either. Being their job, you'd hope they could do something simple like that.
There's a thread right here on THR where I posted photos straight from the military armorer's manual showing how to do it right. Search for it.
RTFM
member
Is it a DPMS rifle?
Recent three day class I went to, there were 2 DPMS rifles that had your very same problem - loose gas key.
They gave both owners fits on day 2 and 3.
Just curious.
RTFM
JNewell
Member
JB Weld without the screws? It would never hold.
JB Weld with screws, as a locking agent? There are better locking agents.
The only way to do this right, if you want the rifle to run reliably, is to follow the mil-spec and stake them as shown in the first picture above. Anything less is taking big chances that the rifle will do what is described in the post above - give you fits, possibly at a deeply inconvenient time.
JB Weld with screws, as a locking agent? There are better locking agents.
The only way to do this right, if you want the rifle to run reliably, is to follow the mil-spec and stake them as shown in the first picture above. Anything less is taking big chances that the rifle will do what is described in the post above - give you fits, possibly at a deeply inconvenient time.
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