AR 22 conversion questions

[brighamr]

AR15 - 22LR conversion questions

1) how much does it cost? (dedicated vs conversion upper)
2) do I have to have a dedicated lower, or do I just switch the upper/mags and go shooting?
3) How reliable is a 22 Ar?
4) does anyone have one of the 22LR belt fed uppers? What do you think of this?

I own multiple 1022s, some stock, some modified... none of them are what I would call reliable (compared to my AKs and ARs). I know .22LR ammo isn't the most reliable round in the world, but I'd just like to know if people think 22 ARs are better/worse reliability than say a stock 1022?

TIA!

 

[Bazooka Joe71]

1. A dedicated upper is just as much as a .223 upper (~$550) and a conversion kit(Ceiner or M261) are between $150 and $200.

2. Your .223 lower will work fine with a new upper or conversion kit.

3. Don't have a lot of experience with a .22 AR, but my conversion kit, with black dog machine mags, after cycling through a few mags, works flawlessly now with Federal Bulk.

I LOVE my M261...Lately it has been the only thing I've been taking to the range. 2-3 cents a shot and I'm getting practice with one of my favorite/most decked out rifle. Plus, since I haven an ACOG, the BDC allows me to not have to rezero when switching between the .223 and .22lr BCG.

BTW, FWIW I hear Ceiner is a major a-hole, but I don't know that from experience.

 

[ArmedBear]

1. My 16" HB A2 .22LR upper from Model 1 Sales cost me $475. I love it; it's rock-solid reliable. It doesn't need frequent cleaning and I use it for 100 yard target practice.

http://www.model1sales.com has a very wide variety of the things, including 20", bull barrel, fluted barrels, stainless, 16", M4, SBRs, and quick turnaround times. Note that the barrel sticks into the receiver a bit, so a 16" looks more like a 14.5".

2. I took my 5.56 20" rifle upper off the lower, put the .22LR upper on the lower, and went shooting. Works great.

3. Mine works GREAT with Federal Bulk, and everything else I've fed it. It took a few hundred rounds and a cleaning as a break-in; after that, it's a VERY reliable semiauto. Love it!

The Ceiner magazine, in parkerized steel, is an EXCELLENT design. It has very light spring tension, so unlike most stack magazines, it's easy to load. My thumb feels the same after 300 rounds as it did when I started. It also comes apart for cleaning like it's a miniature AR magazine.

The only "issue" I can think of is that it doesn't have last-shot-hold-open like a 5.56 AR does. At an organized range, you might want a chamber flag.

After I'd shot mine a bit, I wanted to send some business to CavArms, so I decked it out with a Cavalry Arms M4 stock, grip and foreend in Coyote Brown. Damn near everyone who sees it, wants to get one for him/herself.

WRT Ceiner, I don't know. Model 1 deals with them, not me. (The bolt assembly used for a .22 upper is the same as the bolt used for a conversion.)

 

[Zak Smith]

Note that this thread title is somewhat confusing because "AR22" is the model name of Nordic Components' 10/22 conversion kit.

-z

 

[HisDivineShadow]

I'm going for a Spikes Tactical M4 upper + custom lower myself.

 

[brighamr]

Zak - sorry bout the confusion, I changed the title.

Bazooka & Armed Bear - thanks for sharing your experience. This is sounding more and more like something I want to do

Now to make the decision of dedicated lower or not... wait! I can buy the upper now and buy the lower during the "buy a gun week". Perfect, just got two birds with one stone. Thanks guys!

 

[Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow]

1) how much does it cost? (dedicated vs conversion upper)

Someone else answered; conversion is cheaper.

2) do I have to have a dedicated lower, or do I just switch the upper/mags and go shooting?

Answered; you can just switch.

3) How reliable is a 22 Ar?
Uppers, quite reliable. Conversion kits, also quite reliable.

4) does anyone have one of the 22LR belt fed uppers? What do you think of this?

I think it's mondo cool, but don't have one.

I give a high thumbs up to my Ceiner-Atchisson conversion kit. It has a distinct advantage over complete uppers - PM me if you're interested in that.

 

[strat81]

I'm going for a Spikes Tactical M4 upper + custom lower myself.

+1. I'm sitting on two Spike's lowers, once of which will get the Spike's .22LR dedicated upper.

 

[buttrap]

I have a factory Colt kit and its pretty much a total waste of time and ammo. Leads the neck area of the chamber all to heck,shoots like crud and hits a mile off from the sights. A dedicated upper is the only way to go.

 

[Bazooka Joe71]

I have a factory Colt kit and its pretty much a total waste of time and ammo. Leads the neck area of the chamber all to heck,shoots like crud and hits a mile off from the sights. A dedicated upper is the only way to go.

So your one bad experience with one brand of kit tells us that all kits are trash and a dedicated upper is the only way to go?

 

[Tarvis]

What about mags? Are they interchangeable or does each conversion require a certain type of mag? Which mags for which conversions (if they aren't universal)?

 

[Tarvis]

http://www.tacticalsol.com/store/pc/home.asp

Buddy of mine knows one of the owners. Apparently they are good uppers but I have no idea.

 

[buttrap]

Well as the bore is bigger than the slugs for any kits and they will all shoot off where the sights are set for 5.56 yes I would tend to look at pretty much all kits as trash unless you dont mind dealing with the issues they have.

 

[Bazooka Joe71]

The bore is a thousandth of an inch bigger, and .22's are only good out to ~100 yards anyway, so I don't see it as that big of a deal.

Sure, if you have $1600+ extra to drop on a dedicated .22lr AR + optics then by all means, go that route...If you don't, then spend $150.00 on a conversion kit and shoot for cheap.

 

[brighamr]

Tarvis good question. Anyone else care to weigh in on mags? Specifically what's required, and which brands are more reliable/easier to clean?

 

[buttrap]

Really nothing wrong with any of the conversion kits. Kicks and giggles to blast ammo up range they do fine. There is the fun of having a way to do a quick swap on your AR and have some diffreant fun with the things too. But thats another issue too as a 22lr is good for well past 100yds with proper sights. My self I dont find the kits worth the bother but everyone has a differant idea on what they expect out of a .22 too.

 

[HRT]

I recently purchase a Spikes M4 .22 LR (ST22)upper as a clone to my Stag lower /Grants Tactical M4 upper. I pulled it a part ran a bore snake through the bore cleaned the bolt assembly by the way which is hard chromed, lubed it like an AR (wet) and went to town.

500 rounds of federal bulk later with no problems except for an occasional low powered round where the empty would not fully clear the receiver. At the end of the run when retracting the charging handle vigorously (don't know how to do much else) would occasionally "lock back" This was simply blow back residue on the running surfaces gooping it up. The bolt group is similar to the old A1 bolts (no Fwd assist) and have the thumb cut out. A little nudge with the thumb and the bolt went snick and there you were shooting again.
I got it home cleaned and reassembled. Put it back together considerably drier ran 750 or so rounds with none of the previously noted "locking back". I can't say exactly how accurate it is but it is accurate enough so far. I'm working an Arms flip up with a Standard front tower and my 48 year old eyes are not quite up to all of that when wearing my progressive lenses. But I can say that with a braced standing position I was able to tear a raggedy hole in the head of the 1/3 size silhouette target at 25 yds. The neck on the target at 25 yds is pretty darn close to the same width as the front sight.

At first I was running the upper on my AR15 Stag lower but I liked it so much I bought a dedicated Spikes lower. The Spikes lower needs the same trigger treatment that the Stag lower got to enhance shootability.

I'm at the end of my third bulk pack of Federal and I love it. I'm currently running 6 Black Dog mags 4 smoke and 2 black. Get the smoke. You can easily see the cartridges in the mag.

Fun little rifle/carbine. another couple of boxes of Federal bulk and it will have paid for itself (based on the per round cost of 22lr vs even hand loaded 5.56). Besides at $12-13/bulk pack I can shoot 550 rounds on an outing and not feel too guilty. That same trip with even Wolf Ammo would be a couple hundred dollars.

As a side note nothing was done to the combo to get it shooting reliably except an initial clan and lube which I obviously overdid. The Fwd Assist does not assist with the Ciener derived bolt assembly. The bolt stop does not lock the bolt to the rear so some sort of chamber flag is much appreciated by the SRO.

 

[Nhsport]

Generally the magazine will vary from brand to brand,some have the ejector mounted on the mag,some don't.
The ceiner mags come 10 round and 30 round,Ibelieve the new spikes dedicated upper uses the same mag. Black Dog has some great mags for the ceiner system (28? rounds). I mostly use only the 10 round Ceiner factory mags as most of my shooting is bench or prone and the longer mag gets in the way.My offhand hold is tight to the front of the magwell so that doesn't work well with the longer mags also.
Some day I will save the big bucks and get a top line upper for fun (I am thinking a White Oak) But the Ceiner works great for me and I love the ability to swap it around in my different Ar's.One day in my 20" for service rifle practise ,next day toss it on my flatop carbine with a red dot for a plate shoot or whatever I feel like.