About the AR: what are some good sources for buying uppers and lowers for assembly? Any makes I should avoid? I assume there to be a plethora of different upper kits to choose from. Any suggestions to simplify the process? Differences between A2, A3, and any others? Considerations for scoping? Can any upper be mated with any lower? What have been your experiences? Also, any other good online sights of reference for technical and legal guidelines?
AR15 assembly
- Thread starter Snowjob
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What do you want to do with it ? Plinking, varmints, competition ? Do you absolutely have to have a kit, or would you consider buying a complete rifle. I built my first one with a kit, but I would have saved some money if I bought a complete one. It was a good learning experience though.
Okay, now I'm a little confused. All I have heard from people is that the way to save money on an AR is to assemble one. Is this not the case? Pre-assembled or not, I am just trying to determine the most cost-effective path. I really want an AR but have a hard time dishing out 1K+ if I can supposedly assemble upper and lower for much cheaper.
I plan to use it for plinking, varmint, and the like, but I also want to work toward having it as a "survival tool" (AR15.com).
I plan to use it for plinking, varmint, and the like, but I also want to work toward having it as a "survival tool" (AR15.com).
For a basic AR, it's probably cheaper to build one. A basic 16" kit will run about $400 plus shipping from Model 1. A stripped lower will run you about $100 or so at a gunshow. As far as tools go, other than the standard screwdriver/wrench/pliers, you are going to need a punch set for driving in the roll pins. Add a little bit more for a sling, case and mags and all said and done, probably about $550-575 to build it yourself.
I haven't shopped AR's in awhile, but I think the cheapest forged receiver rifle might by Oly's GI model which I think runs around $650. Yes, you do save some money, but in the end, it's not a whole lot.
I haven't shopped AR's in awhile, but I think the cheapest forged receiver rifle might by Oly's GI model which I think runs around $650. Yes, you do save some money, but in the end, it's not a whole lot.
DMK
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I say pick up a Bushmaster upper, a Rock River lower and slap 'em together. Buy the lower in parts form if you wish to tinker.
That will give you a quality chrome lined barrel and an economical, quality lower with a decent trigger.
www.bushmaster.com
www.adcofirearms.com
That will give you a quality chrome lined barrel and an economical, quality lower with a decent trigger.
www.bushmaster.com
www.adcofirearms.com
You actually don't need any special tools to put a lower together. I just used a pair of pliers with heavily taped ends to squeeze the roll pins through (not my idea, an armorer at a gun show said that was how he did it).
Brands of lowers that I have personal experince with are DPMS, Olympic Arms & Rock River. I like them all, but it seems like the Rock River are the best value (around $100 at Ohio Rapid Fire). Regardless, make sure you get a forged receiver.
Uppers can be tricky. Unless you order it, it can be hard to tell who made it, as most manufacturers don't put their brand on their uppers. Model1 is ok. They claim that they get their uppers the same place that Bushmaster does. They do shoot very accurately and have pretty good customer service. If you go to a gun show you'll probably find a whole rifle kit for around $450ish. I recently saw an entire Rock River kit for that cost.
As far as complete firarms go, DPMS (at least in my area) is about the best value. I've seem them go for $650ish brand new for a basic model.
To decide what model to get, I'd browse a catalog to get an idea of what's out there, then decide what model is going to fit your needs. You'll also see that you can spend as much as you want, depending on the features you want. The things that I'd spend extra on are the trigger (personally, I love the JP single stage) and freefloating the barrel.
Good Luck & if you build your AR, have fun.
Brands of lowers that I have personal experince with are DPMS, Olympic Arms & Rock River. I like them all, but it seems like the Rock River are the best value (around $100 at Ohio Rapid Fire). Regardless, make sure you get a forged receiver.
Uppers can be tricky. Unless you order it, it can be hard to tell who made it, as most manufacturers don't put their brand on their uppers. Model1 is ok. They claim that they get their uppers the same place that Bushmaster does. They do shoot very accurately and have pretty good customer service. If you go to a gun show you'll probably find a whole rifle kit for around $450ish. I recently saw an entire Rock River kit for that cost.
As far as complete firarms go, DPMS (at least in my area) is about the best value. I've seem them go for $650ish brand new for a basic model.
To decide what model to get, I'd browse a catalog to get an idea of what's out there, then decide what model is going to fit your needs. You'll also see that you can spend as much as you want, depending on the features you want. The things that I'd spend extra on are the trigger (personally, I love the JP single stage) and freefloating the barrel.
Good Luck & if you build your AR, have fun.
There is a metal tube that goes over the barrel and attaches to the receiver. It's covered by the handguards. The float tube isolates the barrel from outside forces like sling tension so accuracy is improved.
Where in Washinton are you??? Your in Olympic Country and they have a good kit deal going all the time. Upper is assembled and ready to shoot, so basically all you need to do is assemble the lower which isn't to bad at all. I can hook you up with a couple local dealers depending on where you are at and get you "AR'd" up in a hurry!!! Im or Email me about it...
Cheers
Cheers
I am still undecided about which companies to go with, and whether to go pre- or postban. I was talking to a guy at a recent gun show who said there is also a maker in Lacey whose finished products appear a little smoother. Know anything about them? On the other hand, I am leaning toward RRA and Bushmaster. Really, it comes down to finding excellent quality at the best price. I don't want to pay for just a name, but it must be strong and reliable. Don't get me wrong: I am not in any way ruling out Oly Arms, I just don't know much about their reputation and quality. While I am anxious to have an AR, I don't want to be in so much of a hurry that I make a choice I will regret (if at all possible).
From the title of the thread and your original post is sounds like you want to build this AR now. Which mean you really don’t have to choose between pre and post ban because you don’t have an option you have to build post. You aren’t missing much from the upper though. I mean when was the last time you felt the need to fix a bayonet to anything?
As for Olympic Arms makes a very good product I have one of there PCR series rifles that I purchased in 1999 before Californias Assualt weapon ban happened. I routinely swap my Olympic upper with my Bushmaster upper. Never had a problem.
As for Olympic Arms makes a very good product I have one of there PCR series rifles that I purchased in 1999 before Californias Assualt weapon ban happened. I routinely swap my Olympic upper with my Bushmaster upper. Never had a problem.
I went through this the last few weeks...listen, if you really want good quality and low prices, go to Adcofirearms.com, buy an RRA upper.
RRA has good quality I'm told, and a lifetime warranty on all parts!
Here's some quick math:
RRA flatop 16" CAR or mid-length upper: $375
RRA lower parts kit: $54
Buttstock (ACE skeleton or ultra lite stock. This is just an example, any stock you prefer will do): $89
stripped lower receiver (Eagle Arms. again, example): $98
Total is $616. Note that with the flattop you will have to invest in a rear site, since flattops don't come with sights. A.R.M.S #40 is a good investment.
The above barrel is not chrome lined, but it is chrome moly. Chrome lined lasts a lot longer than other barrels. Below is another option:
Model 1 CAR kit (includes everything besides reveicer): $415, or $450 chrome lined. Go for chrome lined!
Eagle Arms lower: $98
Total is $513 or $548 chrome lined. Again, go chrome if you can, it is well worth it.
However, Model 1 has no warranty, and again if you get a flattop you would have to invest in a good backup sight unless you are just gonna slap an EOtech or Aimpoint on it. Another option is a removable carry handle, which they offer for an additional $75. I would just buy an ARMS #40, because it is a flip up sight and you can use it AND optics at the same time, or if your optic dies or something, you can just flip the rear sight up and use the irons.
Can you tell I've been planning to buy one?
If I were you, I would order the chrome lined kit from Model 1 or similar company that offers a good kit and buylower, assemble it (instructions can be found on AR15.com, its pretty easy to do) and enjoy your rifle for a good $200 lower than just buying a complete one. Not to mention the sense of accomplishment
edited to add: Also, the free float tubes heat up alot, so plinking is not good with them. They are more for sniper-type ARs, competition shooting, or varminting. Nothing against them, but I would rather not half to wait 10 minutes at the range for my handguards to cool down...
just my $.02
Sites to check:
www.adcofirearms.com
www.model1sales.com (sells kits)
www.quanticoarms.com
www.rockriverarms.com
www.m-aparts.com (sells kits)
www.jtdistributing.com (sells kits)
and, of course, www.ar15.com
RRA has good quality I'm told, and a lifetime warranty on all parts!
Here's some quick math:
RRA flatop 16" CAR or mid-length upper: $375
RRA lower parts kit: $54
Buttstock (ACE skeleton or ultra lite stock. This is just an example, any stock you prefer will do): $89
stripped lower receiver (Eagle Arms. again, example): $98
Total is $616. Note that with the flattop you will have to invest in a rear site, since flattops don't come with sights. A.R.M.S #40 is a good investment.
The above barrel is not chrome lined, but it is chrome moly. Chrome lined lasts a lot longer than other barrels. Below is another option:
Model 1 CAR kit (includes everything besides reveicer): $415, or $450 chrome lined. Go for chrome lined!
Eagle Arms lower: $98
Total is $513 or $548 chrome lined. Again, go chrome if you can, it is well worth it.
However, Model 1 has no warranty, and again if you get a flattop you would have to invest in a good backup sight unless you are just gonna slap an EOtech or Aimpoint on it. Another option is a removable carry handle, which they offer for an additional $75. I would just buy an ARMS #40, because it is a flip up sight and you can use it AND optics at the same time, or if your optic dies or something, you can just flip the rear sight up and use the irons.
Can you tell I've been planning to buy one?
If I were you, I would order the chrome lined kit from Model 1 or similar company that offers a good kit and buylower, assemble it (instructions can be found on AR15.com, its pretty easy to do) and enjoy your rifle for a good $200 lower than just buying a complete one. Not to mention the sense of accomplishment
edited to add: Also, the free float tubes heat up alot, so plinking is not good with them. They are more for sniper-type ARs, competition shooting, or varminting. Nothing against them, but I would rather not half to wait 10 minutes at the range for my handguards to cool down...
just my $.02
Sites to check:
www.adcofirearms.com
www.model1sales.com (sells kits)
www.quanticoarms.com
www.rockriverarms.com
www.m-aparts.com (sells kits)
www.jtdistributing.com (sells kits)
and, of course, www.ar15.com
N3rday...your input is excellent - exactly the kind of info I have been trying to discover. Now, I'll be awake per adrenaline rush for the next three hours, just taking it all in. Too bad I have to be up early.
All of you guys have been extremely helpful. Thank you. I do believe I am now, officially, giddy.
It's not so much the bayonet that interests me as a bipod. Is the bayonet lug not needed for mounting a bipod? I'm not even sure that I would put one on, but I would like to have the option, if I so choose.
As far as the barrel goes, I am convinced I must have it chrome-lined.
I hadn't really considered a flattop, as I wanted the carry handle (for aesthetic and functional purposes) and didn't really want to mess with a removable. Although, I kinda like your suggestion of the flip up sight partnered with optics. If I take that route, will the flip up irons afford the same sight picture as with the other option? Does anyone have a photo of this setup?
All of you guys have been extremely helpful. Thank you. I do believe I am now, officially, giddy.
-chink
It's not so much the bayonet that interests me as a bipod. Is the bayonet lug not needed for mounting a bipod? I'm not even sure that I would put one on, but I would like to have the option, if I so choose.
As far as the barrel goes, I am convinced I must have it chrome-lined.
-N3rday
I hadn't really considered a flattop, as I wanted the carry handle (for aesthetic and functional purposes) and didn't really want to mess with a removable. Although, I kinda like your suggestion of the flip up sight partnered with optics. If I take that route, will the flip up irons afford the same sight picture as with the other option? Does anyone have a photo of this setup?
N3rday is right that some freefloat tubes do transfer a lot of heat, but not all do. The Armalite front ends don't have this issue and neither do the "DCM" style that go underneath standard hand gaurds. My OlyArms OA-93 has a metal hanguard & has never been uncomfortable to hold onto, either. It is definitely something you can do anytime after you buy/build a rifle and isn't necessary. I just prefer it. I like that I can tug on my sling or rest my rifle on a bipod without effecting my point of impact.
Snowjob, you don't need a bayonet lug for a bipod. Most bipods attach to a standard sling stud and installing one on any handgaurd is pretty simple.
As for flip-up sights, skies the limit. There are a so many out there that if you go that route, you can definitely find a setup to meet your needs.
Go to: http://www.gggaz.com/products/uwwsystem.php to see an example of a rifle with flip-up sights (and everything else, for that matter).
One quick comment. One buddy of mine built an AR from all Rock River parts (as did I) and one built one from a Model 1 kit. All three of these rifle perform very well, but the rifle from the Model 1 kit took a little tweaking. The rifle didn't feed properly. The problem turned out to be a hammer that was riding high. It just needed filed a bit off the top. We took the hammer to a gunsmith and he said it was a "demilled" M16 hammer. Not a big deal, but both Rock River kits were flawless from day one. Just FYI.
Snowjob, you don't need a bayonet lug for a bipod. Most bipods attach to a standard sling stud and installing one on any handgaurd is pretty simple.
As for flip-up sights, skies the limit. There are a so many out there that if you go that route, you can definitely find a setup to meet your needs.
Go to: http://www.gggaz.com/products/uwwsystem.php to see an example of a rifle with flip-up sights (and everything else, for that matter).
One quick comment. One buddy of mine built an AR from all Rock River parts (as did I) and one built one from a Model 1 kit. All three of these rifle perform very well, but the rifle from the Model 1 kit took a little tweaking. The rifle didn't feed properly. The problem turned out to be a hammer that was riding high. It just needed filed a bit off the top. We took the hammer to a gunsmith and he said it was a "demilled" M16 hammer. Not a big deal, but both Rock River kits were flawless from day one. Just FYI.
I'd just like to say a couple of things.
First, you don't have to shell out $1,000 for a complete rifle. A little bit of legwork and some sleuthing will result in a complete rifle from a good reputable company (Colt, Bushy, etc) for somewhere in the range of $750-$850.
Second, building your own is only cheaper when you make a basic rifle and use only average quality parts (no match grade this or jewel triggers that) and by the time you take into account shipping costs, FFL transfer fees, and the time involved, the amount saved is usually less than 15% of the complete rifle cost. If someone is really strapped for cash, yeah, it's the way to go. Or if someone really wants to say they built their own, go right ahead, but I don't think the savings are large enough to say 'oooweeee, I just saved me a bunch of money.'
Of course, all things are relative, and YMMV, but you'd have to build 5 or 6 to save the equivalent of one. Not exactly a prime ration, but to each his own.
First, you don't have to shell out $1,000 for a complete rifle. A little bit of legwork and some sleuthing will result in a complete rifle from a good reputable company (Colt, Bushy, etc) for somewhere in the range of $750-$850.
Second, building your own is only cheaper when you make a basic rifle and use only average quality parts (no match grade this or jewel triggers that) and by the time you take into account shipping costs, FFL transfer fees, and the time involved, the amount saved is usually less than 15% of the complete rifle cost. If someone is really strapped for cash, yeah, it's the way to go. Or if someone really wants to say they built their own, go right ahead, but I don't think the savings are large enough to say 'oooweeee, I just saved me a bunch of money.'
Of course, all things are relative, and YMMV, but you'd have to build 5 or 6 to save the equivalent of one. Not exactly a prime ration, but to each his own.
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