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Are Winchester Primers junk?

Discussion in 'Handloading and Reloading' started by altitude_19, Jan 24, 2011.

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  1. altitude_19

    altitude_19 Member

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    I've been having about a 10% failure to fire with my reloads. I DID have high-primers, but corrected the issue. My primers have been the optimal .003-.005 below flush. These have all been WLP with a lot number ending in 674G. Anybody know of any issues? Does Winchester have good quality control for their primers?
     
  2. m33p0n3

    m33p0n3 Member

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    I can't speak to that particular lot, but since beginning reloading last year, I have put 1300 WLP downrange with zero failures.
     
  3. rfwobbly

    rfwobbly Member

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    Winchester offers some of the best primers out there. I've used thousands without a single misfire. Check your case lube step and other parts of your reloading procedures for oil and grease products. Lubricants will kill a primer faster than anything.
     
  4. Arkansas Paul

    Arkansas Paul Member

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    ^ What he said.
    I'd bet anything it's not the primers.
     
  5. MaterDei

    MaterDei Member

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    Not for me. They work fine in my reloads.
     
  6. jfh

    jfh Member

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    I've used Winchester primers for over twenty years. As the others have said, no issues--

    For your failure rate, my guess is that you are not seating them firmly into the pocket.

    Jim H.
     
  7. medalguy
    • Contributing Member

    medalguy Member

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    I use a lot of Winnie primers anad they all go boom. HOWEVER I did have a problem with one batch of them (large rifle) last year. They were getting stuck in the primer tube of my Dillon. I had to use a wooden dowel and push down to get them to run down the tube. I used about 5,000 this way, then switched to Remington, no problems, used more Winnies, same problem, changed again to Wolf, no problems. So it was the primers a little bit out of round. Could be a bad batch of primers. Call Winchester and ask about that particular lot. They told me no problems reported with my batch.
     
  8. Gadzooks Mike

    Gadzooks Mike Member

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    Nope
     
  9. Primersinmyshoe

    Primersinmyshoe Member

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    Winchester primers are not junk. Now, lets talk about your gun.
     
  10. Jeff H

    Jeff H Member

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    no!
    They work very well for me.
     
  11. altitude_19

    altitude_19 Member

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    Let's not talk about the gun...BUT, we can talk casings. I've started tearing them down to analyze the problem. Most of the case lengths come out below .886. The shortest at .882 doesn't even have a primer dent. I think I have my answer. I'm going to remove the primers and stick them longer cases...I'm guessing they'll go boom then. Thanks for the input, everybody!
     
  12. cheygriz

    cheygriz Member

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    Any primer made by Winchester, Remington, Federal, CCI, RWS, even Wolf (Tula) are top quality.

    ANY maker can turn out a small bad lot every 30-40 years, but it gets corrected immediately. :D
     
  13. ReloaderFred

    ReloaderFred Member

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    Headspace problems will result in misfires, among other things. Over the years, I've popped several hundred thousand Winchester primers. They are certainly not junk.

    It would help in the future if you listed the caliber you're working with in the original post.

    Hope this helps.

    Fred
     
  14. JimKirk

    JimKirk Member

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    I've loaded thousands of them and never had a misfire yet.

    Jimmy K
     
  15. altitude_19

    altitude_19 Member

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    I'm stumped on this again. I measured a bunch of my brass and cases below .886 are pretty common and fire well. What do your 45 ACP cases measure?
     
  16. cougar1717

    cougar1717 Member

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    While I am sure that there have been occasional bad batches, it is very easy to place blame solely on a component but difficult to accept that the component has to be correctly set by the user in order to work.
     
  17. IROCZ

    IROCZ Member

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    Sometime seating them with too much force can crush the priming pellet. I've used Winchester for 20 or more years and have had no problems except they are to small to use with Hornady match .308 brass, I use CCI's for those.
     
  18. Soonerhawk

    Soonerhawk Member

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    Winchester

    I have been using Winchester primers for 20 years. I have never had a FTF.
     
  19. Primersinmyshoe

    Primersinmyshoe Member

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    Some competition guns with a light hammer strike might have a failure to ignite the Winchester primer since the cup is harder than a Federal. Or a dirty firing pin channel might cause this failure.
     
  20. altitude_19

    altitude_19 Member

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    So what is the case length for your 45 ACP? I'm suspecting a headspace issue. XD chambers are relatively forgiving of oversize cases, but might be less than reliable with undersize brass.
     
  21. Black_Talon

    Black_Talon Member

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    I suspect you have too much slop in the linkage of your press. I'd suggest replacing it with a brand-new RCBS press. :D
     
  22. Funshooter45

    Funshooter45 Member

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    I talked to a CCI technician one time about primers. He said they often ask people to send them their faulty rounds for them to inspect to see if it was a problem with the primer or a problem with the installation of the primer. They dismantle the round and inspect the primer very carefully. It is extremely rare to actually find a faulty primer. The overwhelming majority are caused by failing to seat them deeply enough. Once in a great while, one will be crushed by seating too deeply (I'm not sure how that could even be done).

    Based on their forensic analysis of these things, he said their statisticians estimate that the chance of getting a legitimate faulty primer is about 1 out of 3,000,000.

    Is that the truth? I have no way of knowing, but it sounded good to me. :) Incidentally, when I asked that same guy about Bench Rest Primers as compared to the standard primers, he said don't waste your money on the BR primers. They are exactly the same primers as the standard, except that for the BR primers, "they had 3 guys staring at the assembly line instead of 2 guys". :D
     
  23. rcmodel

    rcmodel Member in memoriam

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    I just went all through this with a WWII Colt Commando.
    http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=563715

    It simply will not work 100% with CCI primers in RA-67 GI cases.

    But it works perfectly with Win, Rem, and Fed primers in RA-67 GI cases. And CCI primers work fine in Win cases.

    It's all about case & primer tolerance stacking causing excess headspace, causing the FP to fail to reach the primer to set it off.

    rc
     
  24. stork

    stork Member

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    #1. It's not the primers.

    I've personally used nearly 40,000 Winchester large pistol primers in the last 10 years shooting bullseye and have yet to have a dud. I have used upwards of 250,000 various makes and sizes in the last 35 years of reloading and cannot honestly remember one dud primer. A long time ago I intentionally loaded with oily hands & fingers, trying to MAKE a dud primer in a cartridge. I had heard for years that you needed to have nearly surgically clean hands so you didn't contaminate the priming mixture. I couldn't do it, not to say it can't be done, but I couldn't. I quit worrying and just loaded. Now I load everything with Dillon 550's and an RCBS 4x4 so the amount of contact I have with the primers is very minimal.

    Without a little more information about the loading setup, I tend to think there is something else in the process that is affecting your ammo.

    What type of bullets are you loading? And, what seating depth is being used? If you're using a lead SWC design, seat them so there is 1-2 thumbnail thickness' of lead exposed.

    What amount and type of powder are you using?

    In my experience, case length means nothing in the 45 ACP. I have yet to measure a 45 case, other than wall thickness. If you were shooting a precision rifle, trimming to one given length is beneficial. On a pistol that is being used at 25 yards or less it makes no difference. At 50 yards, out of a Ransom rest with several custom 1911's, I haven't been able to show any improvement, and I've tested thousands of rounds. The most I will do for my long line loads (50 yards) is use the same brand of case for that match. The next match it may be another brand, but the powder charge, primer, and bullet remain the same.

    If you mark and remeasure your .886 cases after many firings you'll find they have shrunk. A straight wall pistol case does that, they shrink not grow, unlike bottleneck cases.

    Good luck in your quest.

    FWIW
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2011
  25. rcmodel

    rcmodel Member in memoriam

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    Maybe, maybe not!

    I agree it means nothing to a 1911 with a 1/4" of free firing pin travel out of the breach face.

    But the OP is shooting a striker-fired XD, and striker-fired guns are not as forgiving as a 1911 on proper headspace, due to the very limited FP travel available.

    I'm suspecting you are right!

    rc
     
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