Car Knocker
Member
The best is the Reynolds non-stick foil - with the coating to the outside so that the thought-control waves just slide around the head and continue on.
Are your guns electronically tracked
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Lucky
Member
So I have to ask - just when did it stop being trolling and start being acceptable to take over people's threads and make fun of them?
I see it done a lot, and find it confusing. Such high standards of behaviour are demanded in most other circumstances, yet it's fine to insult the guys who posted in this thread. Why not just make a new thread and list their names, and mock them in there? At least leave them alone to discuss what they like without your interference.
Internet *******s, technology changes, people are constant.
I see it done a lot, and find it confusing. Such high standards of behaviour are demanded in most other circumstances, yet it's fine to insult the guys who posted in this thread. Why not just make a new thread and list their names, and mock them in there? At least leave them alone to discuss what they like without your interference.
Internet *******s, technology changes, people are constant.
I'm of two minds here, at least with respect to the tracking of the firearms we give to Iraqis.
On one hand: RFID can be used to track a person's movement, which could be used by jihadists (very cheaply - a scanner can be made for $100 or so) to find and then kill Iraqi troops.
On the other hand: if those Iraqi troops are Jihadists, and those rifles end up in the hands of jihadist groups, well... that could come in very handy. So I wouldn't really be all that surprised if we did it: "Hajji, it's one of the stipulations of free guns. Get used to it."
As far as RFID in guns sold here: it's not going to be in the metal of the frame, but you might have it somewhere inside the plastic of the grip. However, I believe this has been checked out fairly thoroughly by people concerned and knowledgeable about such things. An X-ray machine would (I think) show the existence of such devices - and you could use a scanner to find them, too.
On one hand: RFID can be used to track a person's movement, which could be used by jihadists (very cheaply - a scanner can be made for $100 or so) to find and then kill Iraqi troops.
On the other hand: if those Iraqi troops are Jihadists, and those rifles end up in the hands of jihadist groups, well... that could come in very handy. So I wouldn't really be all that surprised if we did it: "Hajji, it's one of the stipulations of free guns. Get used to it."
As far as RFID in guns sold here: it's not going to be in the metal of the frame, but you might have it somewhere inside the plastic of the grip. However, I believe this has been checked out fairly thoroughly by people concerned and knowledgeable about such things. An X-ray machine would (I think) show the existence of such devices - and you could use a scanner to find them, too.
230RN
2A was "political" when it was first adopted.
Blackbeard wrote:
True at present for GPS sensors.
But most RFID chips are energized by the Radio Frequency "probing" field in which they're immersed. In other words, these don't need batteries.
If you have a company ID card which opens doors and operates the building elevators, there are no battteries embedded in it. There is a coil running around the outside edges of the card which picks up the RF energy coming out of the card readers and powers a little transponder chip in the card.
The little tiny anti-theft packets which are glued onto retail merchandise contain a resonant circuit which detunes the sensors at the exits to set off the alarm if they aren't deactivated.
Deactiviation consists of demagnetizing part of the tiny resonant circuit so it no longer is tuned to the sensors at the door.
Sometimes they don't get demagnetized thoroughly at the checkout stand and will set off the sensors on your way out anyhow.
(It's apparently an open question as to whether the coil springs in your firearm can set off the door sensors in retail establishments. I for one think it's possible, but not likely.)
wd0xxx, 230RN
True at present for GPS sensors.
But most RFID chips are energized by the Radio Frequency "probing" field in which they're immersed. In other words, these don't need batteries.
If you have a company ID card which opens doors and operates the building elevators, there are no battteries embedded in it. There is a coil running around the outside edges of the card which picks up the RF energy coming out of the card readers and powers a little transponder chip in the card.
The little tiny anti-theft packets which are glued onto retail merchandise contain a resonant circuit which detunes the sensors at the exits to set off the alarm if they aren't deactivated.
Deactiviation consists of demagnetizing part of the tiny resonant circuit so it no longer is tuned to the sensors at the door.
Sometimes they don't get demagnetized thoroughly at the checkout stand and will set off the sensors on your way out anyhow.
(It's apparently an open question as to whether the coil springs in your firearm can set off the door sensors in retail establishments. I for one think it's possible, but not likely.)
wd0xxx, 230RN
AntiqueCollector
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Actually, I saw a year or two ago, they'd put really tiny GPS devices of some sort in RFID chips. I don't recall any mention of a battery being needed...
So, no, this is not tin foil conspiracy theory stuff, this is a very real danger to our privacy and our rights. They're already trying to get people chipped with the claims that it will "protect" you, think they're not going to try to get our guns chipped too? And this technology will only get improved more and more to make it easier for the big brothers of the world to use it.
So, no, this is not tin foil conspiracy theory stuff, this is a very real danger to our privacy and our rights. They're already trying to get people chipped with the claims that it will "protect" you, think they're not going to try to get our guns chipped too? And this technology will only get improved more and more to make it easier for the big brothers of the world to use it.
CDignition
Member
Think "Digital Angel" do a google on it
230RN
2A was "political" when it was first adopted.
Rats. I fell behind the times again:
This particular article didn't say whether it was powered by batteries or not, but the ones for pets are powered by muscle movement. Somehow.
Which makes me wonder how they can find the pet if it's dead.
Well, I guess a nice five-turn coil of 1/4" copper tubing connected to a car battery for a second or two ought to kill them. The RFID chip. Not the pets or the equipment. Like your guns.
I also used to use alnico magnets from loudspeakers to hold things to my lathe headstock, like plans or drawings or gear tables, and, through droppage and possibly the field from the 1/2 HP lathe motor, they'd lose their magnetism.
So I'd wrap a starting cable around the arm of a vise a couple of times, clamp the magnet in it, and zap it with a car battery for a few seconds. Didn't bring them back to full strength, but it worked allright. Sparky, but reasonably safe with gloves and goggles and no tinder or volatiles nearby.
This particular article didn't say whether it was powered by batteries or not, but the ones for pets are powered by muscle movement. Somehow.
Which makes me wonder how they can find the pet if it's dead.
Well, I guess a nice five-turn coil of 1/4" copper tubing connected to a car battery for a second or two ought to kill them. The RFID chip. Not the pets or the equipment. Like your guns.
I also used to use alnico magnets from loudspeakers to hold things to my lathe headstock, like plans or drawings or gear tables, and, through droppage and possibly the field from the 1/2 HP lathe motor, they'd lose their magnetism.
So I'd wrap a starting cable around the arm of a vise a couple of times, clamp the magnet in it, and zap it with a car battery for a few seconds. Didn't bring them back to full strength, but it worked allright. Sparky, but reasonably safe with gloves and goggles and no tinder or volatiles nearby.
The Deer Hunter
Member
Heavy duty, shiny side out.
RFID tags are very small, about the easiest way to block a signal from activating one is to cover it with tin foil. Sadly, I'm not even joking.
Also, those cheap RFID scanners have a VERY limited range. So about the only threat RFID tags pose right now is if someone has a more powerful(and hence expensive) unit that could potentially activate every tag within X distance, and even then you'd need 3 of them, and something very precise monitoring the return time of the signals to effectively triangulate someone's position. You'd only need one to sweep a house for weapons with tags in them, but even then a metal case(or holster/gun case lined with tin foil) would interfere. I feel such a threat would really negated by the limitations of the tags themselves.
Of course, the optimal solution would be to turn your home into a faraday cage
.
Also, those cheap RFID scanners have a VERY limited range. So about the only threat RFID tags pose right now is if someone has a more powerful(and hence expensive) unit that could potentially activate every tag within X distance, and even then you'd need 3 of them, and something very precise monitoring the return time of the signals to effectively triangulate someone's position. You'd only need one to sweep a house for weapons with tags in them, but even then a metal case(or holster/gun case lined with tin foil) would interfere. I feel such a threat would really negated by the limitations of the tags themselves.
Of course, the optimal solution would be to turn your home into a faraday cage
.Lucky
Member
Do a search on inverse-square law. Obviously the power required to get longer ranges is big... But pulses of high power would be enough to get RFID's to 'blip'. And the previously posted 400' limit is gigantic, if it can be referenced.
Imagine the benefits to SWAT if only everyone would get RFIDs, then they could saturate a house with kw of rf and see just where they all are, and not need to perfect that wall radar they're trying.
And the ability to catch 'criminals' if only all guns had RFIDs, you simply set up scanners by busy sidewalks. Or if only there were small structures you could put them by which would limit distance... Like turnstiles, doorways and tunnels. They'll say they're just 'enforcing' the new rules that no-guns are allowed within 2miles of any school or public building, or such.
Imagine the benefits to SWAT if only everyone would get RFIDs, then they could saturate a house with kw of rf and see just where they all are, and not need to perfect that wall radar they're trying.
And the ability to catch 'criminals' if only all guns had RFIDs, you simply set up scanners by busy sidewalks. Or if only there were small structures you could put them by which would limit distance... Like turnstiles, doorways and tunnels. They'll say they're just 'enforcing' the new rules that no-guns are allowed within 2miles of any school or public building, or such.
The amount of energy needed to saturate an area to be able to read passive chips such as in RFID tags and other contactless technologies from satellites would need to be so large that you'd disrupt all normal communication and electronics activity. Probably fry out most non-hardened circuitry, stop pacemakers,even cause brain tumors (hey, tin foil might help!), etc. It would no longer be 'passive'.
I don't think the entire world generates enough power to be able to track rifles in an area the size of Baghdad, let alone Iraq.
I don't think the entire world generates enough power to be able to track rifles in an area the size of Baghdad, let alone Iraq.
ArfinGreebly
Moderator Emeritus
Negatory on GPS
I've done a little work with GPS.
I work with a guy who actually dabbles in that part of the electronics world.
And he's a shooter.
His response?
*Laughter* RFID, maybe. GPS? Not in your dreams. (Long technical discussion ensues.)
The biggest barrier, as mentioned above, is the power requirement.
Now, if "THEY" somehow manage to re-task RFID scanners in stores, install billions (with a 'B') of them in cities everywhere, you might have a prayer of tracking an RFID chip.
Even then, the chips are too easy to disable.
So, just from a logistics point of view it's not happening.
Now, if I set up a database where I keep the serial numbers of every piece of gear that I assign to some region, and follow them from issue to return, that would qualify as electronically tracking the gear under current definitions.
By the time they solve the science needed to keep track of every lousy gun out there, you may be assured we will have other things to worry about.
I've done a little work with GPS.
I work with a guy who actually dabbles in that part of the electronics world.
And he's a shooter.
His response?
*Laughter* RFID, maybe. GPS? Not in your dreams. (Long technical discussion ensues.)
The biggest barrier, as mentioned above, is the power requirement.
Now, if "THEY" somehow manage to re-task RFID scanners in stores, install billions (with a 'B') of them in cities everywhere, you might have a prayer of tracking an RFID chip.
Even then, the chips are too easy to disable.
So, just from a logistics point of view it's not happening.
Now, if I set up a database where I keep the serial numbers of every piece of gear that I assign to some region, and follow them from issue to return, that would qualify as electronically tracking the gear under current definitions.
By the time they solve the science needed to keep track of every lousy gun out there, you may be assured we will have other things to worry about.
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It is all TRUE! Back when I was a special forces WALRUS (like the SEALS but for fat people) we used to have missions where we'd break into various citizens houses and RFID implant their Glocks.
That was before I took with the aerial unit of the WALRUS's spraying chem trails from airplanes around the US on a vast population reduction scheme.
Many times on the way home we'd fly low level and spot yeti's. Mostly around trailer parks feeding in the dumpsters. But sometimes we'd see Elvis and he would chase away the yetis.
It is all true!
That was before I took with the aerial unit of the WALRUS's spraying chem trails from airplanes around the US on a vast population reduction scheme.
Many times on the way home we'd fly low level and spot yeti's. Mostly around trailer parks feeding in the dumpsters. But sometimes we'd see Elvis and he would chase away the yetis.
It is all true!
El Tejon
Member
H&H, you tell the truth on the Errornet, young man.
H&H were both in SEEL Team 37.5, not WALRUS.
user, remember--it's the media, they get nothing right. The scanning is on the outside of the crate, just like Wal-Mart.
There are no chips in your guns. Just the chips that H&H put in your head as you sleep.
H&H were both in SEEL Team 37.5, not WALRUS.
user, remember--it's the media, they get nothing right. The scanning is on the outside of the crate, just like Wal-Mart.
There are no chips in your guns. Just the chips that H&H put in your head as you sleep.
MarshallDodge
Member
After all this discussion, nobody has produced a picture of a gun with a RFID tag or similar tracking device. Must be that there is no such thing. 
Sig has guns with barcodes on them but of course you have to be real close and have line-of-sight to get a read on it.
I sell RFID products and the size of the RFID tag is what determines the range. The larger the tag, the bigger the antenna, the longer the range. A tag the size of a Glock and an antenna that is about 2 feet in diameter could read from a couple feet away. Unless there are antennas posted all over the place you won't have any worries anytime soon.
Sig has guns with barcodes on them but of course you have to be real close and have line-of-sight to get a read on it.
I sell RFID products and the size of the RFID tag is what determines the range. The larger the tag, the bigger the antenna, the longer the range. A tag the size of a Glock and an antenna that is about 2 feet in diameter could read from a couple feet away. Unless there are antennas posted all over the place you won't have any worries anytime soon.
Justin
Moderator Emeritus
And MarshallDodge wins the thread.
In the meantime, my overlords at the Trilateral Commission have asked that I close this thread, lest the proles start to get uppity.
In the meantime, my overlords at the Trilateral Commission have asked that I close this thread, lest the proles start to get uppity.
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